BEST 18650 battery

[tiyantiyan]

Just got some LG ABC21865 2800mAh (Orange) batteries and the performance exceeded my expectation.
This specific LG battery is hidden jewelry and lasts much longer than most other batteries on VV/VW.



This is a very special battery, it can maintain on the higher useable voltage (>3.5V or > 3.3V) most of the time, which is what we usually need.
It's also special in that it can be charged to 4.3V to get additional capacity and voltage. For most of us who can only charge to 4.2V, its performance is still much better than many other highly rated batteries here.


Here are some comparison with other good batteries. The LG 2800 orange is charged to 4.2V.
Graphs can also be found at http://lygte-info.dk/review/batteries2012/Common18650comparator.php.

Look at the total Ah at cutoff Volt = 3.5V or volt = 3.3V, you will see the LG gets much high useable capacities

LG2800 orange v.s. AW 3100mah Black


LG2800 orange v.s. Orbtronic 2900 Black


LG2800 orange v.s. Orbtronic IMR 2250mAh Black


LG2800 orange v.s. AW 2000mAh Red


Hope this finding is useful!
Cheers

 

[Thrasher]

cant seem to find this anywhere but wholesale lot orders.
several of the testers cannot seem to find any details of the amperage limits and output, they state this themselves, so an unknown at this point (maybe someone else will have better luck finding this info then i did).

on a side note: i have never trusted this comparator in the link. all the batteries drop into the chart at different voltages. i cannot believe a battery loses .1 to .3v in mere seconds.

for example I like the orbtronic 2900 maybe not the very best but my charger holds them steady at 4.25 after several puffs I can still get a reading of around 4.15v yet this is where the chart starts them at.
not quite fair to compare a battery starting at 4.3 against a battery starting at 4.15

then to actually use the rated voltage requires a special charger. the ones i dug up are in the 100+ dollar range. until someone out there can even prove it is a high drain battery i would say it's not a safe bet yet.

how about a link to where you picked them up.

 

[damthisisfun]

Yes - how abt a link please

 

[Thunderball]

Thanks for the info. Always like to see somethijng new I can research.

 

[mattrhdr]

just noticed a thread earlier about people talking about this... they were talking about the panasonics and samsungs. I always thought the AW IMR were the best but I guess i thought wrong! Although I find my AW IMR 18350's to be pretty darn good and last quite some time even though they are only 700mAh... I guess its trial and error and personal preference

 

[Thrasher]

just noticed a thread earlier about people talking about this... they were talking about the panasonics and samsungs. I always thought the AW IMR were the best but I guess i thought wrong! Although I find my AW IMR 18350's to be pretty darn good and last quite some time even though they are only 700mAh... I guess its trial and error and personal preference

It is known AW makes one of the best 350's around.

 

[tiyantiyan]

For discussion only:

The comparison is for LG 2800 orange charged at 4.2v only, not charged at 4.3V. So the comparison is fair.


After I compared all the available battery graphs, LG and Sanyo (e.g., 2600 Red) make some good batteries which are better than most (if not all) AW/Orbtronic/Pani, in terms of the total capacity (Ah) at cutoff voltage 3.5 or 3.3 volt.

>for example I like the orbtronic 2900 maybe not the very best but my charger holds them steady at 4.25 after several puffs I can still get a reading of around 4.15v yet this is where the chart starts them at.

The reading of 4.15 is obtained off load, which will be higher. There are detailed explanation and graphs for this at Flashlight information.


Probably shouldn't post a link here, as it seems not many sellers selling it (at around $7-8 each) and I don't want anyone think I am the seller. I am NOT.
Just want to share some interesting findings with all of you. It is a pity that these batteries haven't got much attention here, and they certainly deserve more attention.
(If anyone can do some serious comparison/test, I can certainly provide the link offline. )

cheers

cant seem to find this anywhere but wholesale lot orders.
several of the testers cannot seem to find any details of the amperage limits and output, they state this themselves, so an unknown at this point (maybe someone else will have better luck finding this info then i did).

on a side note: i have never trusted this comparator in the link. all the batteries drop into the chart at different voltages. i cannot believe a battery loses .1 to .3v in mere seconds.

for example I like the orbtronic 2900 maybe not the very best but my charger holds them steady at 4.25 after several puffs I can still get a reading of around 4.15v yet this is where the chart starts them at.
not quite fair to compare a battery starting at 4.3 against a battery starting at 4.15

then to actually use the rated voltage requires a special charger. the ones i dug up are in the 100+ dollar range. until someone out there can even prove it is a high drain battery i would say it's not a safe bet yet.

how about a link to where you picked them up.

 

[tiyantiyan]

Exactly! That's what I thought before as well

just noticed a thread earlier about people talking about this... they were talking about the panasonics and samsungs. I always thought the AW IMR were the best but I guess i thought wrong! Although I find my AW IMR 18350's to be pretty darn good and last quite some time even though they are only 700mAh... I guess its trial and error and personal preference

 

[dr g]

Just got some LG ABC21865 2800mAh (Orange) batteries and the performance exceeded my expectation.
This specific LG battery is hidden jewelry and lasts much longer than most other batteries on VV/VW.

The LG D1 battery (available at everyone's favorite Chinese online retailer) outperforms the C2, not sure how you missed that on the comparator. The performance of this LG battery is not really a secret, well it might be among vapers, but actually the PD2900 is pretty competitive at 4.2v charge, which is what is available without specialty chargers: AkkuDB

(IMO the other comparator doesn't give good figures for the PD2900, the Orbitronic and Enerpowers that are supposedly PD2900s underperform what the AkkuDB test of PDs explicitly shows).

It is well known that 4.3+v batteries, not only from LG but also from Samsung, outperform many if not all 4.2v batteries. BUT ....

several of the testers cannot seem to find any details of the amperage limits and output, they state this themselves, so an unknown at this point (maybe someone else will have better luck finding this info then i did).

This is quite a big concern, and perhaps more importantly I could never find any details of the construction of this battery. This is the reason, even knowing that it is an excellent performer and arguably outperforms the PD2900 even at 4.2v, I chose the PD2900s over it for my own mods. I also note that the D1s have a heavy early voltage sag under load, which tends to lead to quicker battery consumption in regulated mods, so that may offset any advantage at lower voltages.

on a side note: i have never trusted this comparator in the link. all the batteries drop into the chart at different voltages. i cannot believe a battery loses .1 to .3v in mere seconds.

for example I like the orbtronic 2900 maybe not the very best but my charger holds them steady at 4.25 after several puffs I can still get a reading of around 4.15v yet this is where the chart starts them at.
not quite fair to compare a battery starting at 4.3 against a battery starting at 4.15

There's nothing odd about this. That's voltage sag under load, which is completely normal for batteries and happens very quickly after the load is applied. Note that this is a constant load, so when you take a puff, then check voltage, you are not comparing the same thing. You would have to compare voltage under load.

 

[Thrasher]

Note that this is a constant load, so when you take a puff, then check voltage, you are not comparing the same thing. You would have to compare voltage under load.

true what i missed is the constant static load. even under load for a second or two the voltage under load is slightly different for vaping. because with a static resistance, as the voltage drops/sags the amperage/power output will also adjust giving it a slightly different reading - whereas the tests use a set amperage drain for the whole test.


recently at work i been dreaming up a test rig that constantly adjusts the amperage as the voltage drops to give up a more accurate picture of a battery under a mechanical mod coil load. just too dang busy to get on it.

but the static testing (3 amps til dead) is one of the resons I dont rely on these tests for more then quick comparison especially for a mechanical

 

[dr g]

but the static testing (3 amps til dead) is one of the resons I dont rely on these tests for more then quick comparison especially for a mechanical

Well it does provide useful information as long as you understand what the actual vaping model looks like ... it will tell you generally speaking which battery has more "juice" than others.

 

[tiyantiyan]

The LG D1 battery (available at everyone's favorite Chinese online retailer) outperforms the C2, not sure how you missed that on the comparator. The performance of this LG battery is not really a secret, well it might be among vapers, but actually the PD2900 is pretty competitive at 4.2v charge, which is what is available without specialty chargers: AkkuDB

That's all good info, I especially like the other test you pointed out. Very informative.

True D1 3000 pink is a bit better than LG C2 2800 orange. Their curves are almost same, except D1 extends a bit further. They should be of the same chemistry, with D1 packs more (perhaps by using thinner separator).

Besides D1, efest 2600 ft black has almost same curve as the LG C2 2800 orange. Probably efest 2600 ft black is a rebranded lg c2 2800 orange?

Sanyo 2600 red has similar curve as well.

To make it easier for others, these are the only four which perform similar and better than others in terms of capacity at cut off voltage 3.5 or 3.3v.
Put it simple, LG D1 3000 Pink > LG C2 2800 orange = efest 2600 ft black = Sanyo 2600 red > others.
(Charged voltage = 4.2v)

This is quite a big concern, and perhaps more importantly I could never find any details of the construction of this battery. This is the reason, even knowing that it is an excellent performer and arguably outperforms the PD2900 even at 4.2v, I chose the PD2900s over it for my own mods. I also note that the D1s have a heavy early voltage sag under load, which tends to lead to quicker battery consumption in regulated mods, so that may offset any advantage at lower voltages.

Not sure how much current each one need. Here is my calculation:

For me, 2.4 ohm 5W is the sweet point which gives warm and mouthful flavor (flavor is so good that it's often like just having a soft drink). My main setup is CE3 with cotton wick.
This translates into current well below 1C (2.8A), so it's super safe.

Even if some one needs to go 5.6A, 2C is usually considered safe for quality li ion batteries. Pls feel free to point out if you have better info on this. Anyway, this translates to 5.6 x 3.7 = 20 W, and 20W is above the range of most vw devices.

So for most folks, it's good and safe enough. Of course, if one needs to go to 10A(37W) or even 20A(74W), he definitely better use a battery specifically designed for that.


Note: the above is only calculation based on my research. IMO that I can safely say 2.8A(10W) is super safe with a quality big name 2800 battery. 5.6A(20W) is what you can decide by yourself.

 

[dr g]

Usually 1C or 2C rated batteries don't fare too well for vaping, they tend to be lower-end, protected or both. Also the math for boosted mods is different, amp draw rises as the battery runs lower. For 20W (e.g. DNA20) just before the 3.2V cutoff that's 6.25A at 100% efficiency, so it will be higher than that. This would consistently exceed the continuous rating of a 2C cell, which is not a good practice IMO. I chose a 10A continuous cell that is proven to be safe by construction and chemistry in most situations.

If one is making mods for others, one needs to be sure of these things. I wish I could find this info for the LG cell, the performance looks excellent.

Or if I could find a micro-usb 4.3v charger board I might be willing to just go for it.

 

[tiyantiyan]

This comparison shows something interesting:
AkkuDB

Total capacity at 3.3V:

AW P18650-26 (protected)
1000mAh 3.418Wh

LG ICR18650D1 (unprotected) @4.20V
1762mAh 6.045Wh

LG ICR18650D1 (unprotected) @4.35V
2173mAh 7.567Wh

Panasonic NCR18650PD (high-drain, unprotected)
1586mAh 5.612Wh

AW IMR 18650-2000
1136mAh 3.964Wh


So, compared to the two AW batteries, the LG D1 has almost twice the total capacity, which is quite A LOT difference. This means: if a battery that lasts one day, the other one can last almost 2 days. If the first battery's total life is 1 year, the second battery can last 2 years. Wow! I didn't realize the huge difference before but this test database tells so.

I found LG D1 can be had at $9 with free shipping:
LG 18650 3000mAh Original Li ion Rechargeable Battery 2pcs | eBay
LG 18650 3000mAh Original Li ion Rechargeable Battery 6pcs | eBay
There are other sellers and I didn't take time to search.

Because I am happy enough: $9, Better price, twice the life. Think you get a AW at $4.5!
And super safe for at least 10W (10 / 3.3 = 3A = 1C).

 

[Winchester]

Hi,

They sound like just what I am looking for. Were did you get them?

 

[tiyantiyan]

Hi,

They sound like just what I am looking for. Were did you get them?

Get the LG 3000 D1.
The LG 2800 C2 I posted in OP has less capacity and at about the same price.
So LG 3000 D1 is the winner

LG 18650 3000mAh Original Li ion Rechargeable Battery 2pcs | eBay
LG 18650 3000mAh Original Li ion Rechargeable Battery 6pcs | eBay

Thanks to Dr. G for his finding.
He might have better source for the D1.

 

[tiyantiyan]

Get the LG 3000 D1.
The LG 2800 C2 I posted in OP has less capacity and at about the same price.
So LG 3000 D1 is the winner

LG 18650 3000mAh Original Li ion Rechargeable Battery 2pcs | eBay
LG 18650 3000mAh Original Li ion Rechargeable Battery 6pcs | eBay

Thanks to Dr. G for his finding.
He might have better source for the D1.

Found this on fasttech: it's perhaps what Dr. G refers to:
Found 6 lg 18650 at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping
There are two LG D1 batteries: $12.82 for 2 or $8.89 for 2.

The first one has "Authentic" in the title, and runs to $6.4 each. Can't be better!

Not clear why the second one (same battery) is even cheaper.

 

[dr g]

This comparison shows something interesting:
AkkuDB

Total capacity at 3.3V:

AW P18650-26 (protected)
1000mAh 3.418Wh

LG ICR18650D1 (unprotected) @4.20V
1762mAh 6.045Wh

LG ICR18650D1 (unprotected) @4.35V
2173mAh 7.567Wh

Panasonic NCR18650PD (high-drain, unprotected)
1586mAh 5.612Wh

AW IMR 18650-2000
1136mAh 3.964Wh


So, compared to the two AW batteries, the LG D1 has almost twice the total capacity, which is quite A LOT difference. This means: if a battery that lasts one day, the other one can last almost 2 days. If the first battery's total life is 1 year, the second battery can last 2 years. Wow! I didn't realize the huge difference before but this test database tells so.

I found LG D1 can be had at $9 with free shipping:
LG 18650 3000mAh Original Li ion Rechargeable Battery 2pcs | eBay
LG 18650 3000mAh Original Li ion Rechargeable Battery 6pcs | eBay
There are other sellers and I didn't take time to search.

Because I am happy enough: $9, Better price, twice the life. Think you get a AW at $4.5!
And super safe for at least 10W (10 / 3.3 = 3A = 1C).

It's really not fair to compare a 4.35v battery to a 4.2v. The real comparison is at 4.2v, and the difference is almost perfect to the 2000mah vs 3000mah capacity ratings. The LG is just a larger capacity battery. But we still don't know what its performance specifications are.

And also remember, on a regulated mod, the amp draw increases as the battery gets weaker.

Found this on fasttech: it's perhaps what Dr. G refers to:
Found 6 lg 18650 at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping
There are two LG D1 batteries: $12.82 for 2 or $8.89 for 2.

The first one has "Authentic" in the title, and runs to $6.4 each. Can't be better!

Not clear why the second one (same battery) is even cheaper.

I honestly do not understand the difference between these two listings. One says 3.7v and one says 4.35v but I think they should both be the same. Same model number so they should be the same.