Best temperature setting for most vapor and clouds?

[SpartanM]

I just threw in a dual 28gauge 9wrap spaced nickel build running 0.09ohm in my tfv4-R2 deck on top of an ipv3 Li and I was wondering what joules and temperature setting (in degrees Fahrenheit) would maximize flavor and vapor? Thanks.
I should mention I prefer opening the tfv4's bottom afc all the way while leaving the drip tip afc 1/3rd to halfway open.

Also, the ipv3 Li can only put out a max of 50J on Ni200 TC, but I heard I could "cheat" that limit by using the 100J setting on Ti01, and then lowering the desired TC setting by 100F? Has anyone tried this?


-themaxster

 

[Bunnykiller]

since I like to vape in the dark, I go for flavor... and I find TC is too much of a pita so I stay with kanthal

 

[SpartanM]

since I like to vape in the dark, I go for flavor... and I find TC is too much of a pita so I stay with kanthal

I'm really starting to regret getting nickel too..


-themaxster

Edit: I ended up getting somewhat hard to it, but you have to take much, much longer pulls than a regular kanthal build. That and you don't get an immediate kick when you fire it up.

 

[dhood]

Remember that the joules setting is the power it will use to get to the desired temperature - i.e. it only affects ramp up time. The higher the joules, the quicker it gets there. After that it will regulate to the temperature by adjusting power up and down. Have a vape and watch the screen in a mirror while you inhale. More than likely you'll see temp protection cut in and out. I don't think you'd see much of a difference between 50 and 100 on that setting. Raising the temp a bit while set to 50 joules will give you more flavor and cloud. I build with titanium and generally run around 500 degrees at 45 watts. If I want a warmer, fuller (cloudier) vape, I'll bump the temperature, not the wattage.

 

[SpartanM]

Remember that the joules setting is the power it will use to get to the desired temperature - i.e. it only affects ramp up time. The higher the joules, the quicker it gets there. After that it will regulate to the temperature by adjusting power up and down. Have a vape and watch the screen in a mirror while you inhale. More than likely you'll see temp protection cut in and out. I don't think you'd see much of a difference between 50 and 100 on that setting. Raising the temp a bit while set to 50 joules will give you more flavor and cloud. I build with titanium and generally run around 500 degrees at 45 watts. If I want a warmer, fuller (cloudier) vape, I'll bump the temperature, not the wattage.

Awesome, thanks dhood! I played around with the temp settings and I found 50J at 520F worked best for me!


-themaxster

 

[dhood]

Yeah, we're so used to using wattage to determine how we vape and temperature control has sort of turned that on its ear. It's still used, just not the way we are used to.

 

[suprtrkr]

I have gotten off TC lately, despite spending hundreds on mods and wire. I can't help it, I am a mech modder at heart, lol. FWIW, I liked about 140 degrees F. The wattage... it doesn't matter a lot unless you're using really wild coil builds. In TC mode, the mod will pulse the power anyway, to maintain wire temp. The wattage setting is more like a speed limit, a "do not exceed" value. If you want to use 16ga, triple, left-handed, quad parallel twisted semi-clapton coils, and have half a kilogram of wire to heat up to make vapor, you'll want to set the wattage pretty high to heat it fast. If you're doing the 28ga spaced 9 wrap you mentioned, then 20-40 watts should be more than enough. But you can also set it as high as the mod will go without trouble and expect the mod to shut it off when the wire overheats. The wattage isn't about how much power goes to the coil, it's about how fast the wire gets to temp. If you're not getting any noticeable latency in vapor production, that's enough watts. If you are, run it up some.

 

[SpartanM]

Yeah, we're so used to using wattage to determine how we vape and temperature control has sort of turned that on its ear. It's still used, just not the way we are used to.

Forreal bro I feel you! At this point I feel like I should've invested in some 22g kanthal A1 instead of this bs nickel crap lol. But it's all good... count it as a learning experience I guess :\


-themaxster

 

[SpartanM]

I have gotten off TC lately, despite spending hundreds on mods and wire. I can't help it, I am a mech modder at heart, lol. FWIW, I liked about 140 degrees F. The wattage... it doesn't matter a lot unless you're using really wild coil builds. In TC mode, the mod will pulse the power anyway, to maintain wire temp. The wattage setting is more like a speed limit, a "do not exceed" value. If you want to use 16ga, triple, left-handed, quad parallel twisted semi-clapton coils, and have half a kilogram of wire to heat up to make vapor, you'll want to set the wattage pretty high to heat it fast. If you're doing the 28ga spaced 9 wrap you mentioned, then 20-40 watts should be more than enough. But you can also set it as high as the mod will go without trouble and expect the mod to shut it off when the wire overheats. The wattage isn't about how much power goes to the coil, it's about how fast the wire gets to temp. If you're not getting any noticeable latency in vapor production, that's enough watts. If you are, run it up some.

I'm about to get off TC soon too haha. I find myself going to back to my super leaky mutation x v4 until I find the time to "fix" my RBA (aka meticulously build a kanthal build on it). The only problem for me with ramping up watts/joules is that my ipv3 Li caps off at 50J max :\ so idk if cranking up the temp is gonna help me much if I'm looking for that "warm vape" experience?


-themaxster

 

[suprtrkr]

I'm about to get off TC soon too haha. I find myself going to back to my super leaky mutation x v4 until I find the time to "fix" my RBA (aka meticulously build a kanthal build on it). The only problem for me with ramping up watts/joules is that my ipv3 Li caps off at 50J max :\ so idk if cranking up the temp is gonna help me much if I'm looking for that "warm vape" experience?


-themaxster

It should help. That's that the temp is for. The watts-- actually the joules-- aren't going to make a lot of difference. At worst, you'll suffer some ramp up time before the coils make vapor.

 

[SpartanM]

It should help. That's that the temp is for. The watts-- actually the joules-- aren't going to make a lot of difference. At worst, you'll suffer some ramp up time before the coils make vapor.

Thanks suprtrkr! I guess I'm just not patient enough to wait for only 50J to kick in every time I wanna ramp it up to 520F lol. Would doing less wraps (between 6-8wraps dual nickel builds) ramp up a little faster purely due to the fact that there's less heating metal, and therefore imitating a "higher" Joule reading? or would it heat up at the same speed?


-themaxster

 

[suprtrkr]

Thanks suprtrkr! I guess I'm just not patient enough to wait for only 50J to kick in every time I wanna ramp it up to 520F lol. Would doing less wraps (between 6-8wraps dual nickel builds) ramp up a little faster purely due to the fact that there's less heating metal, and therefore imitating a "higher" Joule reading? or would it heat up at the same speed?


-themaxster

yes, definitely. smaller diameter wire, less complex coil builds, fewer wraps, all trend in the faster heating direction and, as you have said, the reason is less mass of wire to heat. Naturally, there are trade-offs. Vapor can only be made at the wire's surface, and only then where this surface is in contact with juice-soaked wick. From this point of view, heating the middle of the of the wire is an efficiency loss, as the middle of the wire can't make vapor. So smaller wire is good. But, smaller wire is also more resistive-- less of a problem with TC wire-- meaning you use fewer wraps to obtain your targeted resistance. Fewer wraps means less surface area, and your back where you started. For a contact coil, I use whatever wire on whatever mandrel gives me my target resistance and 4-10 wraps. I consider that the sweet spot. Less and instart to worry about surface area. Four will fit on a tiny deck. And over 10, I get worried about dry wick in the middle of the coil, from the juice being evaporated dry before it gets that far in. Using the spaced coils common in TC work, this is all less of a problem, until you get so many wraps you run out of deck. Consider trying using fewer wraps of double or triple twisted 32ga, or maybe Claptons.

 

[SpartanM]

yes, definitely. smaller diameter wire, less complex coil builds, fewer wraps, all trend in the faster heating direction and, as you have said, the reason is less mass of wire to heat. Naturally, there are trade-offs. Vapor can only be made at the wire's surface, and only then where this surface is in contact with juice-soaked wick. From this point of view, heating the middle of the of the wire is an efficiency loss, as the middle of the wire can't make vapor. So smaller wire is good. But, smaller wire is also more resistive-- less of a problem with TC wire-- meaning you use fewer wraps to obtain your targeted resistance. Fewer wraps means less surface area, and your back where you started. For a contact coil, I use whatever wire on whatever mandrel gives me my target resistance and 4-10 wraps. I consider that the sweet spot. Less and instart to worry about surface area. Four will fit on a tiny deck. And over 10, I get worried about dry wick in the middle of the coil, from the juice being evaporated dry before it gets that far in. Using the spaced coils common in TC work, this is all less of a problem, until you get so many wraps you run out of deck. Consider trying using fewer wraps of double or triple twisted 32ga, or maybe Claptons.

Dangg sounds like you spent a good amount of time figuring all the trade offs of nickel LOL. I'm just getting used to plain ol' kanthal.. I'm going to be trying around 7 wraps for dual nickel, but I'll keep you posted on the results!

I've always felt that parallel outperformed twisted wires for some reason.. but that might just be a personal thing haha


-themaxster

 

[suprtrkr]

Dangg sounds like you spent a good amount of time figuring all the trade offs of nickel LOL. I'm just getting used to plain ol' kanthal.. I'm going to be trying around 7 wraps for dual nickel, but I'll keep you posted on the results!

I've always felt that parallel outperformed twisted wires for some reason.. but that might just be a personal thing haha


-themaxster

Lol, it's a personal decision. If you like parallel, then you like them and there's an end on't. FYI, it is possible to use Clapton wire without changing the resistance of the base wire. Just unwind the Clapton wrap on the ends of the coil legs and cut it off, making sure only the base wire is connected to the posts, and leaving the Clapton wrap only out in the middle of the coil. In this way, the surface area of the wire is increased by the Clapton wrap, but the resistance does not change because electricity always takes the path of least resistance, which would be through the center base wire. You can even Clapton nickel wire with Kanthal like that

 

[SpartanM]

Lol, it's a personal decision. If you like parallel, then you like them and there's an end on't. FYI, it is possible to use Clapton wire without changing the resistance of the base wire. Just unwind the Clapton wrap on the ends of the coil legs and cut it off, making sure only the base wire is connected to the posts, and leaving the Clapton wrap only out in the middle of the coil. In this way, the surface area of the wire is increased by the Clapton wrap, but the resistance does not change because electricity always takes the path of least resistance, which would be through the center base wire. You can even Clapton nickel wire with Kanthal like that

Oh whattt.. I've never thought of it that way! I just realized that the "claptoned" wire of the coil heats through contact rather than conduction haha. Thanks for the helpful tip suprtrkr!! I'll definitely try that out on my next build


-themaxster