Class Action Lawsuit Filed Against Health Canada

[Battlelance]

Oh..... pardon me, then.

I hope you didn't take what I said the wrong way. Someone suggested it wasn't Voltaire, and I just responded to that. But anyway, thats OT.

The point remains the same regardless of who first coined the phrase, however; generation after generation we run away from "oppression" only to re-create it in a different location. That is why the "price" of Freedom is "eternal vigilance"; we ALL have the annoying habit of "extending" our individual Dominion beyond the boundaries of our own personal bodies... this seemingly unimportant little quirk, becomes an "insurmountable" obstacle to Freedom (& true Democracy) when you add "Statutes" into the mix.... nuf'said. Death is "inevitable".... thus it is not a valid excuse for "over-regulation" & the infringement upon Constitutionally protected individual rights & freedoms. "Some" collateral damage is better than a Free Nation "forcing" itself into a disfunctional & thoroughly "chained" condition, simply because it's people haven't the courage to accept Death as the constant-companion to Life.

In the spirit of this discussion, death may be inevitable, but it is somewhat avoidable by people far smarter than I doing their best to ensure (to the best of their abilities) that we're not ingesting mystery concoctions made by some dude in a shack.

When it is necessary to see a doctor, I believe that this doctor has my best interest in mind when prescribing me a medication designed to help with a particular condition. I also have to believe that the medication was developed and tested in a way that reduces my exposure to unnecessary harm while also providing me with some benefit. The same goes for NHPs that make health related claims - if you make a product that makes a health claim, it should be produced in a facility that meets standards for safety, the product must be free of known harmful ingredients and that health claim better be backed up by scientific study. I also reject the notion that collateral damage due to negligence and ignorance is an acceptable alternative.

If this makes me undemocratic, infringes upon my constitutionally protected rights, dysfunctional and without the courage to face death, then so be it.

Finally, let me just say that what makes democracies so interesting is the varying opinions and the right everyone has to share those opinions. Discussions like the one taking place in this thread gets people thinking and talking, and that is a good thing.

 

[NickFit]

I am firm believer in personal freedom. People should have the right to do WHATEVER they wish to do to themselves as long as they do not infringe on the rights of others or harm another in the process. Consenting adults may also do whatever they wish as long as both agree.

The whole untested argument for homeopathics kind of loses when you take a look at how many pharmaceuticals are also untested(properly) and the untested vaccines (i.e Swine flu) that have been put out and taken by millions. The H1N1 vaccine was untested, yet people lined up to take it? If testing actually worked on pharmaceuticals we wouldn't be seeing the recalls. I believe in government oversight, information on risks etc... but ultimately the individual should decide what they put in their body. I used to use this argument for smoking as I am sure many others did as well, and I will continue to stand by it even though I chose to stop smoking. Choice is the ultimate freedom and without it we are not really free.

About the deaths from homeopathics and interactions with pharmaceuticals... ever see the stats on deaths from purely pharmaceutical interactions? Aspirin causes hundreds of deaths every year and it is over the counter. According the the CDC, in 2008 there were 20,044 deaths caused by prescription drugs. Alcohol accounted for an estimated 80,000 deaths in the same year. Yet we we can choose to use these substances. tobacco of course is the leading cause of death, and the government makes a mint off their involvement in the sale.

 

[ardelleg]

It seems like most of the arguments against natural remedies and homeopathy are the same arguments used against vaping...... right?

 

[Battlelance]

The whole untested argument for homeopathics kind of loses when you take a look at how many pharmaceuticals are also untested(properly) and the untested vaccines (i.e Swine flu) that have been put out and taken by millions. The H1N1 vaccine was untested, yet people lined up to take it?

I agree to a point, but the H1N1 vaccine wasn't untested, it was tested. In ferrets. They seemed to do ok In the end, it is a influenza vaccine to target a different strain, the base is the same... which is what happens with the "regular" flu vaccine yearly anyway.

As for the CDC report, were the deaths directly attributable to prescription medication or complications from existing illness helped along by prescription medication? I haven't seen the report, but there is a huge difference between the two. If someone has an existing heart condition and takes asprin, ends up with a peptic ulcer which requires surgery and dies of a heart attack during the procedure, did asprin cause the death? Is there such thing as medical philosophy?

It seems like most of the arguments against natural remedies and homeopathy are the same arguments used against vaping...... right?

Pretty much. Do we poke the 500lb gorilla (government) without proper studies done on the effect/safety of vaping and risk vaping being made illegal, or do we take our chances and stick with the status quo.

 

[tgrsaint]

It seems like most of the arguments against natural remedies and homeopathy are the same arguments used against vaping...... right?

(chuckle)... we have "repeatedly" seen (usually eminating from Big Pharma if you follow the money)... the "no Clinical evidence" argument used to ban various beneficial products (some 20,000 have been removed in Canadian Health Stores which were "formerly" no-Clinical-evidence, but they enacted a "side-door" Legislation & stormed in with Swat 'cause the vendor hadn't put the "DRUG intentification sticker" on'em)... well OF COURSE (duh?!) there's no-"Clinical"-evidence... such tests are ONLY done by organizations with LOTS of money when the outcome promises to be "PATENTABLE"........ "Natural" remedies are NEVER "patentable"...... the simple "fact" that Oregano Oil is singularly, one of the most powerful "Natural" anti-biotics "known" (though it remains "un-patentable") has been sufficient evidence for 800 yrs.... & does NOT make it a DRUG that requires a Drug Identification Number. Science now insists (finally) that ......... is one of the singularly most healing plants on the Planet; when will it be "un-banned"(?) ... that's easy; when the not-so-secret liason between Govt's & Big Pharma are ready to "bottle" it & sell it "by prescription".

 

[daddytwigs]

But they worked so well!

I still take those. Haven't eaten in 8 yrs, but I'm full of energy

 

[tgrsaint]

I agree to a point, but the H1N1 vaccine wasn't untested, it was tested. In ferrets. They seemed to do ok In the end, it is a influenza vaccine to target a different strain, the base is the same... which is what happens with the "regular" flu vaccine yearly anyway.

(chuckle)... there is a rather IN DEPTH YouTube expose on the H1N1 vaccine; AND legal action has been filed in the International Court. At least one Country was sent "live" H1N1 virus that was "labeled" VACCINE & it seems ABUNDANTLY CLEAR that this was the INTENTION for the outset. Haha..... curiosly, documents have come to light which reveal that the H1N1 vaccine was ready for distribution some 6 months or so before the H1N1 virus was even identified. Gettin' the picture; see how it works?

 

[bobsyeruncle]

I have to say I'm a little suspicious of "natural" products being pushed through by lawsuit. Natural doesn't necessarily mean safe. Heck, psychedelics come from natural ingredients. Of course, given Health Canada's lazy attitude towards validating e-juice, I kind of like the idea of that institution getting shaken up every once in a while.