Correlation, not Causation, but...

[Doffy]

<<Rewind to 2019, I was vaping 50mg nic, 9mg WTA (WTA is a mixture of at least 6 alkaloids, not 1 like nic)

Early 2020, lots happened. The start of the pandemic, I tried lowering a medication

But, I keep lowering both



Currently vaping 33.5mg nic, no WTA

Around the same time, I had (and continue to have) a flare of OCD** symptoms

Just recently, I was thinking of timeline. And how when around 2014 and I lowered nic, similar happened

I ran some tests. Those being dripping some 36mg WTA and having a snus, and brain was quiet and calmer

As I said; lots happened in early 2020 and beyond. But I thunk it worth a mention

*Nic has been banned (More than previous ban) in Australia

**OCD is a disorder of intrusive thoughts. Most of which are not suitable for ECF. But violent, sexually deviant etc thoughts

 

[englishmick]

Bad news mate. Does this mean you might not be able to get nic at all in Australia? Sounds like you really need your nic.

 

[Doffy]

Bad news mate. Does this mean you might not be able to get nic at all in Australia? Sounds like you really need your nic.

So far, it has just fueled black market, I think. All just disposable pods though

 

[Katya]

So far, it has just fueled black market, I think. All just disposable pods though

Is Swedish snus available down under? The only thing that worked for me--I had no luck with WTAs. But, of course, we're all different.

 

[Doffy]

Is Swedish snus available down under? The only thing that worked for me--I had no luck with WTAs. But, of course, we're all different.

I have a decent supply in the freezer. Last 2 orders never arrived, so I guess that it got tied in with ban on importing tobacco

 

[Katya]

I have a decent supply in the freezer. Last 2 orders never arrived, so I guess that it got tied in with ban on importing tobacco

That's weird. I thought snus was OK, even in Australia. That's really bad. I always thought that even if everything gets banned here, I'd always be able to vape 0 nic unflavored and use snus. So sorry, Doffy.

 

[Doffy]

To medical staff of my care team

I am not medically trained. The following is based on a layman’s understanding of tobacco addiction, not limited to nicotine

Nicotine as the primary compound associated with tobacco addiction and dependence came from a Surgeon General’s report in the USA. The vast majority of study around tobacco dependence focus on nicotine

But, in addition to nicotine, tobacco also contains 5 minor alkaloids anabasine, nornicotine, anatabine, cotinine and myosmine. These alkaloids are psychoactive, and account for disparity of nicotine as stimulant, and anecdotal accounts of relaxation

The alkaloid profile of tobacco depends on the individual plant, but is usually around 92% of the alkaloid profile as nicotine, and the remaining 8% as the 5 minor alkaloids

There is also apparently a very slight inhibition of monoamine oxidase A

As with other things, I don’t have a science background. This is just layman reading on the subject

Up until around 2019, there were 5 vape liquid manufacturers in the USA who produced “Whole Tobacco Alkaloids” or “WTA” or full spectrum vape fluid. With the USA Deeming Regulations and increased controls, all but 1 shut down. The remaining 1, Mother’s Milk WTA, label theirs as “For research purposes” on the bottle, to cheat regulations. They were always the lowest quality of the 5 companies

In 2020, the Australian Government closed the loophole in the SUSMP Poisons Schedule, which allowed importation of nicotine, provided it wasn’t labelled “For therapeutic use” and made no health claims. Liquid nicotine for vaping was then by prescription only, with added fine print that nicotine is the only permissible active ingredient in vape fluid. Which effectively banned WTA even by prescription

So, from early 2020, I began weaning both nicotine and WTA. 2019, I vaped 5% nicotine plus 0.9% WTA (Comprised of 92% Nicotine and 8% Minor Alkaloids anabasine, nornicotine, anatabine, cotinine and myosmine)

By 2022, armed with a few litres of 500mg/ml or 50% nicotine in my freezer, and a decent supply of 3.6% WTA from Aroma e-cig, I had weaned to 3.35% nicotine and no WTA in my vape

The timeline recently occurred to me, and i thought back to trying to wean the same in 2014, I think after a Senate Enquiry into nicotine vaping. In 2014, I weaned to 12mg/ml or 1.2% nicotine, and abandoned the endeavour owing to rage, irritability, and intrusive thoughts

I have recently experimented with some Swedish Snus from my freezer, and dripping some WTA eliquid in my vape again. Each time, I have had blissful relief from the intrusive thoughts and rage

I started smoking aged 12. After growing up with parents smoking inside, and during pregnancy

I just figured this was worth a mention. As I said, I don’t have a scientific understanding of it, but have read studies and participate vaping forums

I know that Dr Jon is very against vaping, despite RANZCP official stance E-cigarettes and vaporisers | RANZCP

Dan

 

[hittman]

To medical staff of my care team

I am not medically trained. The following is based on a layman’s understanding of tobacco addiction, not limited to nicotine

Nicotine as the primary compound associated with tobacco addiction and dependence came from a Surgeon General’s report in the USA. The vast majority of study around tobacco dependence focus on nicotine

But, in addition to nicotine, tobacco also contains 5 minor alkaloids anabasine, nornicotine, anatabine, cotinine and myosmine. These alkaloids are psychoactive, and account for disparity of nicotine as stimulant, and anecdotal accounts of relaxation

The alkaloid profile of tobacco depends on the individual plant, but is usually around 92% of the alkaloid profile as nicotine, and the remaining 8% as the 5 minor alkaloids

There is also apparently a very slight inhibition of monoamine oxidase A

As with other things, I don’t have a science background. This is just layman reading on the subject

Up until around 2019, there were 5 vape liquid manufacturers in the USA who produced “Whole Tobacco Alkaloids” or “WTA” or full spectrum vape fluid. With the USA Deeming Regulations and increased controls, all but 1 shut down. The remaining 1, Mother’s Milk WTA, label theirs as “For research purposes” on the bottle, to cheat regulations. They were always the lowest quality of the 5 companies

In 2020, the Australian Government closed the loophole in the SUSMP Poisons Schedule, which allowed importation of nicotine, provided it wasn’t labelled “For therapeutic use” and made no health claims. Liquid nicotine for vaping was then by prescription only, with added fine print that nicotine is the only permissible active ingredient in vape fluid. Which effectively banned WTA even by prescription

So, from early 2020, I began weaning both nicotine and WTA. 2019, I vaped 5% nicotine plus 0.9% WTA (Comprised of 92% Nicotine and 8% Minor Alkaloids anabasine, nornicotine, anatabine, cotinine and myosmine)

By 2022, armed with a few litres of 500mg/ml or 50% nicotine in my freezer, and a decent supply of 3.6% WTA from Aroma e-cig, I had weaned to 3.35% nicotine and no WTA in my vape

The timeline recently occurred to me, and i thought back to trying to wean the same in 2014, I think after a Senate Enquiry into nicotine vaping. In 2014, I weaned to 12mg/ml or 1.2% nicotine, and abandoned the endeavour owing to rage, irritability, and intrusive thoughts

I have recently experimented with some Swedish Snus from my freezer, and dripping some WTA eliquid in my vape again. Each time, I have had blissful relief from the intrusive thoughts and rage

I started smoking aged 12. After growing up with parents smoking inside, and during pregnancy

I just figured this was worth a mention. As I said, I don’t have a scientific understanding of it, but have read studies and participate vaping forums

I know that Dr Jon is very against vaping, despite RANZCP official stance E-cigarettes and vaporisers | RANZCP

Dan

Thanks for sharing. I still have some Aromaejuice wta that I use sparingly. I use different strengths of eliquids depending on the device I’m using but also use probably six portions of snus a day and that keeps me level for the most part. It still saddens me that Aromaejuice went out of business. There’s was expensive but top notch quality.