DIY Unflavored WTA

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peterforpats

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rounding third and heading home...
"New and improved" is usually just marketing-speak for "Smaller and more expensive".

does anyone remember when a cup of yogurt was actually 8oz.? I think the are now 5.4oz.(but of course, new and improved) can you imagine if eliquid vendors travel the same road? soon they will be selling pre-moistened wicks for the price a bottle used to be.........
 

djezewski

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does anyone remember when a cup of yogurt was actually 8oz.? I think the are now 5.4oz.(but of course, new and improved) can you imagine if eliquid vendors travel the same road? soon they will be selling pre-moistened wicks for the price a bottle used to be.........
blasphemous...don't want my mind to go there.
 

MsChris

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I have added DIY WTA to our inventory this morning. Please note that orders are limited to (1) bottle per household so that more customers get to try the eliquid.
DIY WTA.jpg
 

Robinowitz

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Thank you Ms. Chris and all of Aroma! I was doing my normal stalking of this thread, FB and website (3 times a day) and almost spit out my coffee when I saw the WTA was in!! I can't tell you what a difference the WTA makes to me. I'm in my 6th month of no analogs. I'm so grateful that the technology is there to make this feat possible but had always felt like something was missing! I have some great mods and lots of supplies but found that I was always thinking about that next Vape. I kept trying juices that i could add extra flavoring to but "it" just wasnt "it." i attributed it to 40 years of smoking menthols. Now with the addition of WTA, I feel satisfied most of the time and Vape so much less liquid (1-2 ml a day). I have found the missing piece!! THANK YOU and please pass along my gratitude. An aside note: might you be getting the menthol w/ WTA stocked soon? Have a wonderful day all.
 

Mr.Mann

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Is the diy wta really already out? Man I cant catch a break. I still havent been able to sample this and still no P-38 in stock. People need to stop liking this stuff so much lol. Well back to vaping my crappy stuff until p-38 is available.

Unfortunately it is one of those things that you have to "catch." Not only do they sell out relatively fast, the stock that does go up is low. I think last time it wasn't very many of the 15 mL, but I didn't check on the 2 dram (roughly 7.5 mL) bottles that went up. My point is that you have to be informed and then quick.

The DIY WTA normally sells out in about 10 minutes. You need to subscribe to the announcement thread and the Facebook page so you know when it's going to be put on site. Even though they limit it to 1 bottle a person pent up demand makes it sell out quick

This is the only surefire way really.
 
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DVap

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All of the 24 mg DIY WTA that was put up for sale earlier this week is "new and improved".

Since the term "new and improved" is generally over-used and abused, I'll summarize in as much as I can what is new and improved about this stuff. Actually, some of these items represent "new and improved" while others represent what has always been the case.

1. The process by which it is made has been tweaked to allow the production time for any single batch, beginning to end, to occur much more quickly.

2. The amount of WTA produced during any single batch is now greater than in the past. Combine these first two points and the result is more WTA and faster WTA.

3. The amount of chemical manipulation required to get from a pile of tobacco to a vial of purified WTA has been minimized. This is an item on which I spend a lot of thought. While the process is currently "set", this is something that I will always be attempting to simplify further.

4. I've placed a number of time constraints on the processing steps. This simply means that the amount of time that the in-process material is permitted to remain at a certain stage of processing is capped. The reason for this limitation is to minimize the time that the alkaloids are permitted to remain in contact with the processing chemicals, thus minimizing potential undesirable by-products.

5. As always, the fate of any processing chemical is carefully evaluated. A good number of the processing steps exist solely to assure that the final product is WTA and only WTA. A lot more WTA could be made a lot quicker if these steps were skipped. The result would, however, be a WTA product that I could not endorse.

6. Each batch is evaluated for concentration via titrametric determination. This is just a fancy way to say that when the purified alkaloids are diluted down to their intended concentration, that concentration has been verified.

In addition to all of the above, I am currently working with Jerry to establish appropriate testing protocols. Since Jerry will ultimately be footing the bill for these tests, the back and forth is a bit of a negotiation process between me throwing out overkill and Jerry tempering my enthusiasm for overkill with the notion of establishing effective and meaningful testing, all without breaking the bank.

Some of these tests should be necessary only when a new batch of source tobacco is being introduced, some of these tests should be necessary to evaluate the process as a whole, and some of these tests should be necessary to evaluate each finished batch. From my experience in the testing industry, I'm quite aware that you can spend a lot of money and get surprising little for your expense if you don't choose your testing firm carefully.

I would categorize the testing as I envision it as follows:

1. Tests to be performed once on the purified alkaloids from each new tobacco batch. Any particular tobacco batch will be quite large and be used for many alkaloid batches. Thus, this represents testing to be done whenever a new bale, crate, etc of bulk tobacco is received.

a. GC/GCMS - What's in it? How does the alkaloid profile look? Is the alkaloid profile fairly consistent between one tobacco batch and the next? Are there nasty things present that we don't want? Are the TSNA's low? While careful selection of tobacco should result in a minimal TNSA content, customers would probably rather have it proven than taking a vendor at their word.

The reason that this test would only be performed once on new tobacco batches is that the processing steps should do nothing to change these results since they are tobacco dependent. As such, this testing tells us about the tobacco being used.

2. Tests to be performed once on the process itself, or any time the process is significantly modified.

a. Heavy metals - Not like we gave a damn about this back when we were smoking, but does the process eliminate heavy metals from the alkaloid product?

b. Residual solvent - Does the process effectively remove all residual processing solvent? Again, the process is designed to do just that, but again, would you rather take someone's word for it, or have it proven?

The reason that these tests would only be performed once is that the process is a standard process with the same things being done every time. We want to assure ourselves that these process steps effectively eliminate certain undesirables. Also, if we make significant changes/improvements to the process, we want to assure ourselves that these changes don't have unintended consequences.

3. Tests to be performed on each alkaloid batch produced.

a. Alkaloid concentration. Does the finished liquid contain the alkaloids at the stated concentration? Typically, the alkaloids will be mixed down into the base (VG, PG, or some combination of the two) at some large volume and then individually bottled. Testing the alkaloid concentration once mixed down to the large volume assures that what ends up in the bottles is at the intended concentration.

The reason that this test would be performed on all WTA liquids pre-bottling is simple: Box Elder anyone?
 

Mr.Mann

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All of the 24 mg DIY WTA that was put up for sale earlier this week is "new and improved".

Since the term "new and improved" is generally over-used and abused, I'll summarize in as much as I can what is new and improved about this stuff. Actually, some of these items represent "new and improved" while others represent what has always been the case.

1. The process by which it is made has been tweaked to allow the production time for any single batch, beginning to end, to occur much more quickly.

2. The amount of WTA produced during any single batch is now greater than in the past. Combine these first two points and the result is more WTA and faster WTA.

3. The amount of chemical manipulation required to get from a pile of tobacco to a vial of purified WTA has been minimized. This is an item on which I spend a lot of thought. While the process is currently "set", this is something that I will always be attempting to simplify further.

4. I've placed a number of time constraints on the processing steps. This simply means that the amount of time that the in-process material is permitted to remain at a certain stage of processing is capped. The reason for this limitation is to minimize the time that the alkaloids are permitted to remain in contact with the processing chemicals, thus minimizing potential undesirable by-products.

5. As always, the fate of any processing chemical is carefully evaluated. A good number of the processing steps exist solely to assure that the final product is WTA and only WTA. A lot more WTA could be made a lot quicker if these steps were skipped. The result would, however, be a WTA product that I could not endorse.

6. Each batch is evaluated for concentration via titrametric determination. This is just a fancy way to say that when the purified alkaloids are diluted down to their intended concentration, that concentration has been verified.

In addition to all of the above, I am currently working with Jerry to establish appropriate testing protocols. Since Jerry will ultimately be footing the bill for these tests, the back and forth is a bit of a negotiation process between me throwing out overkill and Jerry tempering my enthusiasm for overkill with the notion of establishing effective and meaningful testing, all without breaking the bank.

Some of these tests should be necessary only when a new batch of source tobacco is being introduced, some of these tests should be necessary to evaluate the process as a whole, and some of these tests should be necessary to evaluate each finished batch. From my experience in the testing industry, I'm quite aware that you can spend a lot of money and get surprising little for your expense if you don't choose your testing firm carefully.

I would categorize the testing as I envision it as follows:

1. Tests to be performed once on the purified alkaloids from each new tobacco batch. Any particular tobacco batch will be quite large and be used for many alkaloid batches. Thus, this represents testing to be done whenever a new bale, crate, etc of bulk tobacco is received.

a. GC/GCMS - What's in it? How does the alkaloid profile look? Is the alkaloid profile fairly consistent between one tobacco batch and the next? Are there nasty things present that we don't want? Are the TSNA's low? While careful selection of tobacco should result in a minimal TNSA content, customers would probably rather have it proven than taking a vendor at their word.

The reason that this test would only be performed once on new tobacco batches is that the processing steps should do nothing to change these results since they are tobacco dependent. As such, this testing tells us about the tobacco being used.

2. Tests to be performed once on the process itself, or any time the process is significantly modified.

a. Heavy metals - Not like we gave a damn about this back when we were smoking, but does the process eliminate heavy metals from the alkaloid product?

b. Residual solvent - Does the process effectively remove all residual processing solvent? Again, the process is designed to do just that, but again, would you rather take someone's word for it, or have it proven?

The reason that these tests would only be performed once is that the process is a standard process with the same things being done every time. We want to assure ourselves that these process steps effectively eliminate certain undesirables. Also, if we make significant changes/improvements to the process, we want to assure ourselves that these changes don't have unintended consequences.

3. Tests to be performed on each alkaloid batch produced.

a. Alkaloid concentration. Does the finished liquid contain the alkaloids at the stated concentration? Typically, the alkaloids will be mixed down into the base (VG, PG, or some combination of the two) at some large volume and then individually bottled. Testing the alkaloid concentration once mixed down to the large volume assures that what ends up in the bottles is at the intended concentration.

The reason that this test would be performed on all WTA liquids pre-bottling is simple: Box Elder anyone?

I have just a few questions. These questions are directed in part to DVap but mostly to Jerry.

* Is what went out earlier this week obtained from a new and different source tobacco from what was used prior?

* Since this post (DVap's) is mostly in reference to "24 mg DIY WTA that was put up for sale earlier this week," will the WTA made for the flavored line remain the same as it was until it is sold out (phased out), and then replaced with the new advances? Or, is the old stuff being ditched, meaning discarded, in lieu of the "new and improved stuff"?

* From what I can tell, it would seem like the new stuff should make things more efficient, cost effective and quantitatively legit, but will the customer notice a difference qualitatively? Or is the "new and improved" WTA, for all intents and purposes, going to be the same on our end with just more peace of mind?

Since it just went out, I ask Jerry this: when you vape the new stuff vs. the old stuff, what do you notice differently? Even if I am asking you for your subjective experience with your own work, I want to know whether you notice a difference in the vape? I am not asking about good or bad, but does it taste and feel the same to you?
 

olderthandirt

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All of the 24 mg DIY WTA that was put up for sale earlier this week is "new and improved".

Since the term "new and improved" is generally over-used and abused, I'll summarize in as much as I can what is new and improved about this stuff....
.... Box Elder anyone?
Insights like this are unique and very much appreciated DV!
Had to google the Box Elder reference. Whoah! That was a nasty event.
 

DVap

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I have just a few questions. These questions are directed in part to DVap but mostly to Jerry.

* Is what went out earlier this week obtained from a new and different source tobacco from what was used prior?

* Since this post (DVap's) is mostly in reference to "24 mg DIY WTA that was put up for sale earlier this week," will the WTA made for the flavored line remain the same as it was until it is sold out (phased out), and then replaced with the new advances? Or, is the old stuff being ditched, meaning discarded, in lieu of the "new and improved stuff"?

* From what I can tell, it would seem like the new stuff should make things more efficient, cost effective and quantitatively legit, but will the customer notice a difference qualitatively? Or is the "new and improved" WTA, for all intents and purposes, going to be the same on our end with just more peace of mind?

Since it just went out, I ask Jerry this: when you vape the new stuff vs. the old stuff, what do you notice differently? Even if I am asking you for your subjective experience with your own work, I want to know whether you notice a difference in the vape? I am not asking about good or bad, but does it taste and feel the same to you?

Can't get hold of Jerry myself the past couple days, so I'll try as best I can to address this.

The source tobacco is still the same.

I believe the flavored line will be sold out and replaced.

The new stuff should be pretty much the same, though one particular processing modification is intended to make the new stuff a bit more mellow. Whether this translates to a difference that individuals will notice is unknown and might depend on the individual, their palate, or whatever.

And of course, Jerry would have to answer the last question.
 

Mr.Mann

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Can't get hold of Jerry myself the past couple days, so I'll try as best I can to address this.

The source tobacco is still the same.

I believe the flavored line will be sold out and replaced.

The new stuff should be pretty much the same, though one particular processing modification is intended to make the new stuff a bit more mellow. Whether this translates to a difference that individuals will notice is unknown and might depend on the individual, their palate, or whatever.

And of course, Jerry would have to answer the last question.

Thanks, D. That is exactly the info I wanted.

Now, unfortunately, it doesn't make the decision for me as to whether I would want to try the new stuff. Of course, since my bias is for WTA-exclusive, no matter the maker, I probably will try it so I can speak on it. Plus, I really want to see if the "one particular processing modification" will in fact make it easier on my throat (the other stuff was unpleasant for me). But aside from that one part, if it is the same tobacco, it will likely not give me a different experience as the alkaloid profile will be the same (same tobacco/same alkaloid profile). I'd be game for a 2 dram.
 

homeprogreen

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This unflavored WTA is really helping my wife. She has been analog free since April but lately the cravings have really been getting her. I set her up a dripper and gave her a bottle of the unflavored so when she feels the cravings she swaps to it for a few vapes. Problem solved. Hopefully the new process keeps working out so I can buy it for her on a regular basis
 
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