E-liquid Legality

[SueCityVocals]

Just out of curiosity and for my own safety as a consumer, for those that make and/or sell refill juice in various nicotine quantities:
Do you need to obtain a license to mix and sell products containing nicotine?
Do you need any sort of qualifications to sell pre-mixed e-liquid containing nicotine?
Does your mixing technique, end product, and operation have to be checked on by a higher organization?
Is it possible to and is it standard procedure to check an end product of a large batch for nicotine content to ensure proper nicotine and other chemical levels?
Is it required to test end products in other ways before shipment to ensure no hazardous chemicals found their way in while being made?

If the answer to all these questions is no, how can consumers be sure they are safe using the product? And if a batch of a product is 'bad' are the creators of the product liable or is the buyer liable?

I should add that I am a vaper, I am in no way anti-vaping and any information i receive will not make me stop vaping. I'm just asking a question i have yet to see asked, and seeing if I should look into a DIY approach to mixing.

 

[Sugar_and_Spice]

Just out of curiosity and for my own safety as a consumer, for those that make and/or sell refill juice in various nicotine quantities:
Do you need to obtain a license to mix and sell products containing nicotine?
Do you need any sort of qualifications to sell pre-mixed e-liquid containing nicotine?
Does your mixing technique, end product, and operation have to be checked on by a higher organization?
Is it possible to and is it standard procedure to check an end product of a large batch for nicotine content to ensure proper nicotine and other chemical levels?
Is it required to test end products in other ways before shipment to ensure no hazardous chemicals found their way in while being made?

If the answer to all these questions is no, how can consumers be sure they are safe using the product? And if a batch of a product is 'bad' are the creators of the product liable or is the buyer liable?

I should add that I am a vaper, I am in no way anti-vaping and any information i receive will not make me stop vaping. I'm just asking a question i have yet to see asked, and seeing if I should look into a DIY approach to mixing.

Welcome to ecf...
Your questions are being asked by many vapers, new vapers and ones that have vaped a long time.....at this time I can suggest freedomsmokeusa.com.
I know that they opened up a vaping lounge and had the state come in and do inspections. The same kind of thing that a resturant does....
Other than that. I suggest if you find a vendor you wish to purchase from ask them the same questions you have listed above....and that includes any supplies for DIY.
sorry I don't have better answers at this point......ecigs is still in its infancy, and like any industry has growing pains....
happy vaping.

 

[celestmark]

I usually stick to vendors in the states that can prove they use pharmaceutical grade nicotine and quality ingredients. Feedback is a must and there needs to be many positive reviews for the company as well.

As the tug-of-war continues between "Big Tobacco", FDA and local authorities, you can be sure it's going to heat up as tax revenue for smokes will continue to decrease due to e-cigs. They're legal for now, but due diligence is a must in choosing your vendors.

Glad there's a forum like this to help in the learning curve!

 

[RedZone]

I'm not knocking your valid questions by any means, But... Consumers have smoked cigarettes for years, and Tobacco Companies (Until just now!), have NEVER had to release to the public, FDA, or any government entity, any of the chemical/organic additives they used in the production of cigarettes! And millions of consumers ingest "The unkown" even to this day!

Does this fact, in any way deter that every Company producing nicotine juice, should have to adhere to some type of lab testing for both product quality and pharma lab equivalent concerning a sanitary production environment? No!
But, I imagine that the majority of juice vendors are very small operations, and probably couldn't afford such testing and/or licensing. Will this change in the future? Probably....

Yes, we blindly trust these distributors to produce the NIC levels we order, use sanitary environments to produce the product, and also trust that the nicotine they are purchasing is pure, with no other additives or contaminants.

It's an interesting topic, and I would like to see some eJuice vendors jump in and communicate to forum users about their operations.

I have a friend that mixes juice for us. He has a room dedicated to the process, follows strict sanitary standards, and though he is experienced, he's no chemist! I imagine that if he opened a website, he would be replicating what 90% of the eJuice vendors are in our vaping world. There are vendors that state their product is produced in pharma quality labs, but it's the Internet. Anyone can say what they want, especially with no type of federal or state regulation.

Has anyone personally toured the lab facilities in China where Dekang juice is manufactured? Remember this is the same country that has been known to produce toys for young children using paint with high lead contamination!

I still feel better about using NIC juice from a local US small business vendor, than buying Chinese made juice. But, that's just my personal opinion, and I really have no basis of proof, if one is safer for human ingestion, than the other...

 

[spicyed]

As said above ask or look into what the company's website says. After awhile you can build trust with the vendors. I know Halo only uses pharmaceutical grade ingredients and they test nicotine content of end user product. All their bottles are also labeled with lot numbers.

 

[bnrkwest]

I look for US made ejuice if I buy it, like Halo. The rest I pretty much make my own with DIY. I like knowing what I am putting in my juices. I have purchased a few juices here and there but mostly it is Halo or DIY for me. I did just order a couple of MsT's Bakery to try tho. bnrk

 

[RedZone]

bnrkwest, Ms T's was the only vendor I had bought juice from over the last 3 years. Always a consistent product!
I just recently decided to try some other vendors: Velvet Vapors and Vapor Bomb. (The only reason I tried those two vendors was from many positive reviews from ECF users)...

Like you, we DIY'd our own juice for the most part. We toyed with the idea of retailing juice in 2009, but decided to just keep our efforts in house, and only sell juice to local friends to help offset costs.

 

[bnrkwest]

Thanks for the thumbs up on Ms T's I hear only good things about her juices. The one thing I have found with alot of purchased juices is they are rather weak in flavor. Only a couple I can say I got that weren't. Halo being a good one. I guess with DIY I like the options of tweaking and making something stronger. It is alot of fun as you know! I am hooked on DIY. bnrk

 

[cavibird2005]

According to the 2010 Minnesota moderization compliance act you would have to get a ATF tobacco license to legally sell any product containing nicotine in Minnesota (Excluding FDA approved quitting products)

At least that is what I was told @ the ecig shop in Anoka

 

[dee5]

Yes, Redzone, one of our members DID actually tour one of the factories and made a video. ( I wish I could find it so I could post a link for you) I remember it as being spotless, with all the workers in disposable protective gear, including full body suit, face mask, gloves and hair coverings.

 

[santo19586]

how does one know that the e-juice , a person is buying is being made in their home or just a room in the basement or garage, some places i checked out on google map, shows a satelite view of there home, or a house newly built , out in some new development area..or their contact address is a po box

 

[santo19586]

Yes, Redzone, one of our members DID actually tour one of the factories and made a video. ( I wish I could find it so I could post a link for you) I remember it as being spotless, with all the workers in disposable protective gear, including full body suit, face mask, gloves and hair coverings.

good to know, pm me the company

 

[cavibird2005]

Dekang
Chinese E-liquid Manufacturing Facilities - YouTube

Johnson creek
Inside the Lab at Johnson Creek - YouTube

 

[Zogem]

I have a friend that mixes juice for us. He has a room dedicated to the process, follows strict sanitary standards, and though he is experienced, he's no chemist! I imagine that if he opened a website, he would be replicating what 90% of the eJuice vendors are in our vaping world. There are vendors that state their product is produced in pharma quality labs, but it's the Internet. Anyone can say what they want, especially with no type of federal or state regulation.

Has anyone personally toured the lab facilities in China where Dekang juice is manufactured? Remember this is the same country that has been known to produce toys for young children using paint with high lead contamination!

I still feel better about using NIC juice from a local US small business vendor, than buying Chinese made juice. But, that's just my personal opinion, and I really have no basis of proof, if one is safer for human ingestion, than the other...

++1

Let's not forget the pet food scare: 2007 pet food recalls - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. Or the toothpaste: Toxic Toothpaste Made in China Is Found in U.S. - New York Times

I made the switch from analog because I wanted some control of what I was willfully ingesting, and refuse to purchase juice from most foreign manufactures, as my liability reach is pretty limited when it comes to china, but pretty high in the US, and for the most part the EU.

I don't have expectations of lab quality conditions. My expectation in that regards are no higher than the the kitchen than served me a brilliant Cuban Picadillo today... reasonable assumptions about preparation I can deal with. But, I do expect quality.

Ultimately consumerism will drive this, sans bureaucratic intervention.