MATH is not optional... a minor rant.

[shakeytails]

About every day or so, someone posts about how to figure out a percentage, and it seems like they always have high % nicotine. Really guys, it's basic algebra, you should have learned it in like 7th grade. If you can't do it easily, there are several calculators on this forum AKA "Read the stickies!"

If math is still beyond your reasoning, maybe DIY with concentrated nicotine is not a good idea.

Rant over, carry on...

 

[Aheadatime]

I get a bit frustrated when somebody posts what seems like a delicious recipe but turns out to be relying upon 'drops', which is a huge turnoff for me. Different sized droppers, varying degrees of viscosity, and smaller test batches makes things weird. If you're working under the assumption that 20 drops = 1ml, yet in actuality a ml contains, on average, 11 drops from the particular dropper you're using, and you've only mixed a 3ml test batch, that results in a big difference in end-result flavor %'s, too big for me to want to attempt your recipe.

 

[shakeytails]

The drops method is a bit sketchy to duplicate, but not particularly dangerous. It doesn't bother me nearly as much as someone who buys 60 or 100mg nic but can't figure out how to dilute it.

 

[SASmith]

I hate algebra.............................slowly backing out of the room!

 

[Spazmelda]

Here's an example of how to double check the calculators to make sure your nicotine concentration is right, with my attempt at an explanation of how it works. I'd recommend always doing at least this, because it will double check that you haven't typed something wrong into the calculator.

Let's say you want to make 30 ml of 18 mg/ml juice and you are starting with 100 mg/ml base.

If you wanted to make 1 ml of 18 mg/ml, it's easy to see that you'd want 18 mg of nicotine in that 1 ml. For 30 ml, you just want 30x that amount. So:

18 mg/ml x 30 ml= 540 mg of nicotine (the mls cancel out).

So, now you know that you need 540 mg of nicotine total for your 18 mg/ml juice. Your base nicotine has 100 mg of nicotine per ml. Easy math...

540 mg 100 mg/ml = 5.4 ml, mgs cancel out and ml moves to the numerator because you divided by it.

If you use algebra to smoosh this all into one equation, it's even easier...

(18 mg/ml / 100 mg/ml x 30 ml = 5.4 ml

Making it more general...

(Concentration you want in mg/ml / concentration of base in mg/ml) x how much you want to make in ml = how much base to use.

 

[shakeytails]

I hate algebra.............................slowly backing out of the room!

LOL! Nobody said you had to like it. But you can read and use the nifty online calculators that figure nic percentage for you, right?

 

[shakeytails]

Spaz, good explanation for those of us who understand math, but what about the folks that say something like "If I mix 18mg juice with 18mg juice, it's 36 mg, right?"

 

[zoiDman]

I don't mind Math.

In Fact, I Kinda Like It.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...l-nicotine-juices-already-containing-nic.html

 

[FACE MEAT]

I get a bit frustrated when somebody posts what seems like a delicious recipe but turns out to be relying upon 'drops', which is a huge turnoff for me.

What about a recipe that calls for something like this: "One drop of Acetyl Pyrazine per 10mL"?

I use such measurements because, unless you're making a giant batch, these types of measurements are too small to accurately calculate. That's allowed, right?

 

[zoiDman]

I get a bit frustrated when somebody posts what seems like a delicious recipe but turns out to be relying upon 'drops', which is a huge turnoff for me. Different sized droppers, varying degrees of viscosity, and smaller test batches makes things weird. If you're working under the assumption that 20 drops = 1ml, yet in actuality a ml contains, on average, 11 drops from the particular dropper you're using, and you've only mixed a 3ml test batch, that results in a big difference in end-result flavor %'s, too big for me to want to attempt your recipe.

How do you Know you would Like the Recipe if it was Given in Percentages verses Drops?

Don't you have to make a Recipe, Taste it, and then either Tweak it, or Leave it as is?

Why then wouldn't you Try it Via Drops? There is about as Much Chance you will Like it if you Used Drops as there is if you Used Percentages.

 

[SASmith]

LOL! Nobody said you had to like it. But you can read and use the nifty online calculators that figure nic percentage for you, right?

I absolutely agree, I have not been that interested in DIY yet, as I struggle with the Canadian Tax code for a living, I'm pretty sure I could figure it out. But seriously I have an aversion to the word "Algeba" since childhood. Anyway if I made you smile....I'm glad I posted.

 

[zoiDman]

The drops method is a bit sketchy to duplicate, but not particularly dangerous. It doesn't bother me nearly as much as someone who buys 60 or 100mg nic but can't figure out how to dilute it.

Yeah... for another person, they would need to know the Dropper Size the Original Person used.

But if the Original Person uses the Same Dropper whenever a Drops is Called Out, they can Duplicate their Own Recipes with Surprisingly Accurate and Precise Results.

 

[shakeytails]

What about a recipe that calls for something like this: "One drop of Acetyl Pyrazine per 10mL"?

I use such measurements because, unless you're making a giant batch, such measurements are too small to accurately calculate. That's allowed, right?

Nope, not allowed only 'cuz in my minimal experience with AP I think it's nasty. So even 1 drop is verboten! BUT, I'd be happy to try 1 or 2 drops of caramel cappuccino in 10 ml if someone wants to send me some!

 

[Spazmelda]

Ha, whatever works for you. I'm not so .... about the flavorings, except for reproducibility and scaling up purposes. The nicotine is what I hope that people get at least in the right ball park. When I'm doing little recipes for trials, I don't really care as long as the nic is between 12-18 mg/ml. That's a pretty big range, and I know it is fine for me. If someone was shooting for 6 and made something closer to 18 or 30 by accident though, that would be a big mistake.

 

[eHuman]

OP:

Ratios and percentages are taught before intro-algebra, alas math does not come natural to everyone . But I digress, rather than ranting on or about those less educated than yourself there are other options, like teaching and passing on your knowledge... (If you don't like the problem don't be part of the problem or make it worse).

ECF is a community where people of all walks of life and levels of education and intelligence can come together and share our knowledge or learn from others. It's not really intended to be a place to burn those who don't live up to your expectation of minimum required intelligence. Give people more credit, everyone can learn though at different paces. Freely pass on some of the wisdom that was freely given to you.

Volume ratios are the most common way to mix flavors. Weight percent method is much more accurate but has a larger initial investment cost.

If you don't know how or are not comfortable or confident in DIY, read and ask questions, and ignore the random troll who tries to discourage you before you get it down. Anyone can do it with the right amount of instruction and practice.

 

[FACE MEAT]

When I'm doing little recipes for trials, I don't really care as long as the nic is between 12-18 mg/ml.

Same here, except I'm okay with anything between 16 and 24. Not being overly fussy about nicotine content makes DIY soooo much easier.

 

[Aheadatime]

How do you Know you would Like the Recipe if it was Given in Percentages verses Drops?

Don't you have to make a Recipe, Taste it, and then either Tweak it, or Leave it as is?

Why then wouldn't you Try it Via Drops? There is about as Much Chance you will Like it if you Used Drops as there is if you Used Percentages.

True, but it's much easier to lower something from 4% to 2% then to figure out what % '17 drops' equates to in a 3ml test batch and then lower from there. Given that the syringes are less than a dollar a piece, and the calculator is free, using drops just seems like the lazy way to me. Although, sometimes I'll replicate a recipe if somebody says "12 drops TFA Brown Sugar (4%)", as I trust they did the math on their particular dropper.

What about a recipe that calls for something like this: "One drop of Acetyl Pyrazine per 10mL"?

I use such measurements because, unless you're making a giant batch, these types of measurements are too small to accurately calculate. That's allowed, right?

Yeah i do that to lol. I've been trying to slowly translate those butterfly farts into concrete %'s but I'm still getting there.

 

[zoiDman]

True, but it's much easier to lower something from 4% to 2% then to figure out what % '17 drops' equates to in a 3ml test batch and then lower from there. Given that the syringes are less than a dollar a piece, and the calculator is free, using drops just seems like the lazy way to me. Although, sometimes I'll replicate a recipe if somebody says "12 drops TFA Brown Sugar (4%)", as I trust they did the math on their particular dropper.
...

I'm a Firm Believer of Do What Works for You.

I you find working with Percentages works Best, and don't mind Buying and Washing Pipettes or Syringes, then that is the way to go.

Absolutely Drops are "Lazy". That's why I use them. Pulling out a Recipe Card that Says 30ml of "Pre-Mix", 18 Drops of ____, 6 Drops of ____, etc is about as Lazy/Easy as it Gets.

And the Cool thing is there is Nothing to Wash when I'm Done.

 

[Wow1420]

No one is saying you need to be a math wiz to DIY, but if someone isn't confident is calculating percentages or using one of the e-liquid calculators, they really should stick to using lower nic concentrations, or pre-mixed bases to start off with.

 

[Aheadatime]

I'm a Firm Believer of Do What Works for You.

I you find working with Percentages works Best, and don't mind Buying and Washing Pipettes or Syringes, then that is the way to go.

Absolutely Drops are "Lazy". That's why I use them. Pulling out a Recipe Card that Says 30ml of "Pre-Mix", 18 Drops of ____, 6 Drops of ____, etc is about as Lazy/Easy as it Gets.

And the Cool thing is there is Nothing to Wash when I'm Done.

lmao, there's nothing wrong with that at all. Nothing against you or the method personally, just a huge caution sign for me when I'm reading through recipes and the word 'drops' pops up.