mean vs. r.m.s.

[jerseyman32]

I hear alot of differences in which is better. So im wondering which is better for me. 85 percent of the time i use kanger aerotanks with coils ranging from 1.5 to 1.8 on a mvp or istick, the other 15 percent im using a kayfun or dripping with a veritas , same coils as above..i dont plan on sub-ohm or cloud chasing. Which is better for my vaping prefreances?

 

[93gc40]

Fact is that for MOST vapers it will never really matter. RMS is a more stable form of regulation/measurment PERIOD. AT high watts and low ohms the stability is important. At the ranges you are working. The only way you could ever identify a difference is with the use of an oscilascope.

 

[BoomerFZ1]

I hear alot of differences in which is better. So im wondering which is better for me. 85 percent of the time i use kanger aerotanks with coils ranging from 1.5 to 1.8 on a mvp or istick, the other 15 percent im using a kayfun or dripping with a veritas , same coils as above..i dont plan on sub-ohm or cloud chasing. Which is better for my vaping prefreances?

Have you tried the Airflow Control 3.0 for the Aerotanks. I have an Aerotank Mega I wasn't using, put on one of these bases, and it vapes SO much better now

 

[jerseyman32]

Yes i should have clarified that, aerotanks v2.

 

[Ronald3638]

Mean vs. RMS applys to devices that pulse the voltage on and off to simulate a desired voltage.

The use of Mean (Average) came about because programmers logically thought that a given duty cycle (on time vs. off time) would result in a given voltage equivalent for example a 6 volt source pulsed with a 50% duty cycle would give a Mean voltage of 3 volts.

The problem with this is that heating elements (coils) retain some of the heat between the pulses so the amount of heat given off the coil would be the same as if a DC voltage of 4.24 volts were applied. Calculating the duty cycle based on RMS results in a more accurate DC equivalent.

Vrms = Vpeak * Sqrt(D) where Vpeak = the voltage being pulsed and D = the duty cycle.

6 volts with a 50% Duty Cycle = 6 * Sqrt(0.5) = 6 * .7071 = 4.2426
6 Volts with a 30% Duty Cycle = 6 * Sqrt(0.3) = 6 * 5477 = 3.2863

All this means is that you would have to adjust the voltage of devices that use Mean to a lower voltage reading than a device that uses RMS to get the same heating affect.

 

[twgbonehead]

Sometimes I really think we're getting too prissy with this stuff.

If it's too cool, press the '+' button. If it's too hot, press the '-' one. Works for VV, VW, RMS, Mean.

I do object to vendors that claim "VW" but measure it using mean. RMS is not only "more stable", it's the correct way to meter the output. That's not a preference, but a mathematical fact.

Mean is a feeble approximation, which will be very wrong in some cases.

Still, if it's too weak, turn it up, if it's too strong, turn it down. Not like you need an act of Congress to change the levels......

 

[crxess]

Simpler answer:

Most mods that use MEAN PWM cannot set low enough to get the temperature(power) down to acceptable limits for Basic Clearomizers.
This results in Hot/Burnt Taste
Mods that use RMS PWM actually put out what the screen says in a proper fashion and will do as expected.

MEAN is OLD SCHOOL
RMS is more accurate and was instituted at the Demand of Vapors looking for correct performing equipment.

Still, if it's too weak, turn it up, if it's too strong, turn it down. Not like you need an act of Congress to change the levels......

You will once the mod has reached its low point and it is still to hot.

 

[twgbonehead]

Simpler answer:

Most mods that use MEAN PWM cannot set low enough to get the temperature(power) down to acceptable limits for Basic Clearomizers.
This results in Hot/Burnt Taste
Mods that use RMS PWM actually put out what the screen says in a proper fashion and will do as expected.

MEAN is OLD SCHOOL
RMS is more accurate and was instituted at the Demand of Vapors looking for correct performing equipment.


You will once the mod has reached its low point and it is still to hot.

Yeah, but that doesn't really have much to do with mean vs. RMS. It's more an issue of how low the mod will go and what kind of regulator/converter it uses.

 

[jerseyman32]

All i know is that i can take the same eliquid put it in two of my aerotanks place one on a mvp,the other on a istick,set them both on say 4volts and the vape is completely different. Im not dogging either unit by any means , i enjoy both...but there is a difference

 

[crxess]

Yeah, but that doesn't really have much to do with mean vs. RMS. It's more an issue of how low the mod will go and what kind of regulator/converter it uses.

Actually that is not correct.
The mod will report a low setting and if using the MEAN calculations it will be accurate. Ths Vape will still be hot and cannot be reduced further. This is a Flaw in understanding, not equipment capabilities. The error is Human introduced through the calculation process not the parts involved.

 

[jerseyman32]

thanks for the breakdown Crxess, ill primary use the i stick for dripping and r.t.a., and the mvp for everything else..so if i were in the market for a mod i can use for both which would you reccomend..mvp 30watt, istick 30, clouper mini 30, or the ipv mini, or the smok 30?

 

[Maiar]

I gotta go with RMS here.... I mean why wouldn't you want your equipment to be as accurate as possible never mind if you're using basic clearos or an advanced dripper. But that's just me. If it isn't accurate then I'm not really interested.
What I'd like to see is vendors putting what kind it is in the information when you're shopping online for these things.

 

[Susan~S]

thanks for the breakdown Crxess, ill primary use the i stick for dripping and r.t.a., and the mvp for everything else..so if i were in the market for a mod i can use for both which would you reccomend..mvp 30watt, istick 30, clouper mini 30, or the ipv mini, or the smok 30?

Make yourself a spreadsheet and put all the mods in the columns and all the specifications in the rows. Then go out to YouTube and watch PBusardos reviews on all the mods you are interested in all fill in your spreadsheet with all the relevant information.

In the end you will at least be able to compare all the mods you are interested in and be able to "weed out" the ones that no longer meet you needs.

That's what I do. Without that, you will just run yourself in circles and get nowhere. Or you will end up buying something that doesn't meet your needs because you have not "fine tuned" what it is you want/need.

 

[jerseyman32]

I really wish that the vendor would include if the mod was rms or mean in the product description more often.

 

[Ronald3638]

Ideally all MODs should rectify and filter the output to DC then the whole Mean vs. RMS thing goes away. There are many MODs that do this already such as the ProVari, all Evolve DNA based devices and YiHi SX series based devices.

I have a Dovpo DT-50 and although I haven't put it on a scope it vapes like a DC device so I'm pretty sure it does have a DC output. Does anyone know what board this uses?