New member. Need help with Stingray

[insaneredrooster]

Hello, fellow vapers!

I guess I'll do some sort of intro. I started with a "pen-style" ecig some time early this year. Bought a couple more, and puffed on those for a while. My little brother then introduced me to mechanical mods. I was fascinated by the clouds those things could make, so when he asked if I could take him to Vape Blast in San Antonio, I told him I'd trade him a tank of gas for one of his prized possessions; a copper Panzer clone (I'm new to all of this, so bear with me on the correct terminology). I had always loved hitting this mod, and it looks badass.



This is the build I currently have on it. Double coils (?) with five wraps using 22awg kanthal. Puts it at 0.08 ohms.


Although school is my priority, I want to learn more about these mods. Any advice/tips/informative links would be appreciated.

Now about the Stingray...
My girlfriend also fell in love with the clouds these things can make, and decided she should get one for herself. We went to the local Vape shop (Tex-Smoke) just to get an idea of how much a complete setup would cost. Well, we (me, my parents, and little brother) are really cool with the guy, so since his wife just got a Manhattan, he offered us her Stingray for $45. Couldn't pass that up, so we bought it plus some batteries and a charger. This things hits very smooth. My brother helped us build it to 0.1ohms using single coils with, I believe, 4 wraps on 24awg kanthal.

The only issue is that the guy's wife decided to get rid of the locking mechanism, so the spring (which gets hot and has burned my gf) is exposed, and, obviously, there's no way to lock it. We've been Googling like crazy trying to find a replacement but have had no luck. I really want to fix this on hers because I don't like that she gets burned and it can't lock. Help please!

 

[Zeroinflux]

First of all congrats and welcoming to the vaping life . Now, about that stingray.. all i can say is wow. I haven't dealt with anything like that before. I'm surprised that the button actually stays attached to the device. Only thing i can think of is maybe try to find a whole new fire button some where. Sorry i can't help more. Good luck.

 

[Susan~S]

Hello and welcome!

There are SO MANY things wrong with what you are doing that I don't know where to start. You should NOT BE OPERATING a mech mod until you educate yourself on how to vape safely.

Did your brother tell you anything about battery safety, ohms law, amp limitations or does he not know any of this either? What batteries are you using in this mod?

 

[CreepyLady]

First off hi and welcome to ECF

Here is a button and lock ring Vaperev Shop - Stingray Locking Ring - Accessories - JD Tech - Mechanical - Devices and Vaperev Shop - Red Copper Stingray Bottom Button - Accessories - JD Tech - Mechanical - Devices

Nextly - the reason its burning hot may be because a 0.1 something coil is crazytown. MNKE 26650 has a 20 amp rating and the Sony 26650 has a 26 Amp C rating...at 0.1 is a 42 amp draw....That is WAY beyond the battery's capabilities.



Edit to Add- here is a VERY helpful IMPERATIVE read http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-explain-dumb-noob-ohms-law-calculations.html

 

[xxJollyRogerxx]

... and that is why your GF is getting burned as well!

What battery do you have?

 

[Susan~S]

Until you have read AND UNDERSTAND all of this information you should put away that mech mod (take the batteries out of it, tear out that coil). Basically you have what could be a pretty "badass" copper pipe bomb!

This was from a post by Baditude (our resident battery/safety expert) on another thread.

Definition of a hard short

Battery Basics for Mods: IMR or Protected ICR?
- choose the safest and right battery for your applications here. Includes a list of name brand, high-drain, safe-chemistry batteries with mAh & amp ratings in 18350, 18490/18500, and 18650 sizes.

Rechargeable Batteries
- blog post on the preferred chemistry of batteries for mods by our forum administrator and resident battery expert Rolygate.

Deeper Understanding of Mod Batteries pt 1
- what do the letters & numbers on batteries mean? What's the difference between ICR, IMR, and hybrid batteries?

Deeper Understanding of Mod Batteries pt 2
- protected vs unprotected batteries, what is Ohm's Law, inline battery fuses, what is an AW battery, stacking batteries.

Technical: Why High Drain Batteries?
- technical explanation on why high drain batteries are required for a regulated VV/VW battery device.

Question for the Tech Engineers at Provape
- explanation of battery amp limits, internal resistance, and battery chemistry pertaining to regulated VV/VW mods.

Battery Specifications and Calculators
- self explanatory.


How to Use Your Multimeter

Video on How to Use Your Multimeter

Ohm's Law Calculator

Information Resources for Your First RBA

Mechanical Mod Proper Useage Guide

 

[Topwater Elvis]

If you went to vape blast surely you heard about the mechanical explosion that took place.
If not, watch this video from at least from the 1:30 to 8:30 minute marks



4.2v / .08 ohm = 52.5 amps & 220.5 watts.
There is no way to vape .0 anything safely.
4.2v / .1 = 42 amps & 176.4 watts.
I am unaware of any battery that has a high enough continuous discharge rating to safely power either of these build.

If any part of it gets hot enough to burn, you are using a unsafe build.
The tube without the lock ring shouldn't be used at all until after it is repaired, in its current condition it is unsafe to use.

 

[xxJollyRogerxx]

She's gonna blow Capt!

 

[insaneredrooster]

Thanks for the replies.

I will admit, I have not been properly educated in the field of safe vaping. I would love to learn more before I start doing any different builds.

I don't recall what batteries she has, but I can report back with that when I see her later today.

And $45 just for the button assembly? I found a complete one for $35 on thriftyecig (I can't post links or upload photos anymore for some reason...).
Also, that site for the button says out of stock :/

 

[insaneredrooster]

Wow lots of links to check out! Thanks, everyone. I'll be sure to read all of those and make safer builds on both of our mods.

 

[xxJollyRogerxx]

Thanks for the replies.

I will admit, I have not been properly educated in the field of safe vaping. I would love to learn more before I start doing any different builds.

I don't recall what batteries she has, but I can report back with that when I see her later today.

And $45 just for the button assembly? I found a complete one for $35 on thriftyecig (I can't post links or upload photos anymore for some reason...).
Also, that site for the button says out of stock :/

But please do post what battery she has. I really think the build you are using is going to go way over the safety limit of it

But on the other hand ... Was it an authentic Stingray or a clone? If it was authentic then you got a pretty good deal if it wasn't all banged up.
And what atty are you using on it? Just curious

 

[insaneredrooster]

I'm not 100% sure, but I doubt it's an authentic. I think he would've sold it for a lot more than $45 with RDA.

Excuse my lack of knowledge, but what is an atty?

 

[realsis]

This might help you . Please read.
Ohm’s Law

Ohm’s law can be stated in words as “current equals voltage divided by resistance,” and more mathematically as:

I = V / R

Where I is current, V is voltage and R is resistance.

This concurs with the description above, where the voltage provides the raw potential, which is reduced (hence divided by) the resistance to produce the final current. Placing values into the spaces, you could work out the electrical current when you vape at 3.4 V with a 1.8 Ω resistance. This is simply 3.4 divided by 1.8, which comes out to around 1.9 A (after rounding).

Similarly, the equation can be re-arranged if you need to work out something else. You could additionally say that voltage is equal to current multiplied by resistance (V = IR) or that resistance is equal to voltage divided by current (R = V/I).

Extending Ohm’s Law

However, people generally talk about vaping in terms of the wattage, which is a measure of power. This is a measure of energy over time, and the unit of power is the watt (W).

To work out power using the quantities of Ohm’s Law, you can use these equations:

P = V^2 / R P = I^2R P = VI

Power is P in these equations. So if you want to work out how many watts you’re vaping at, you simply work out the voltage squared (at 3.4 V: 3.4^2 = 3.4 × 3.4 = 11.56) and then divide the result by the resistance (at 1.8 Ω, 11.56 / 1.8 = 6.4222… so around 6.4 W). Additionally, you can use the value of the current you’ve worked out previously with either of the remaining two equations (remembering that P = VI means power equals voltage multiplied by current).

So What Does This Mean for Vaping?

The atomizer which powers the vapor-producing on your e-cig is basically a heating coil. It works because electrical resistance (the energy lost to the metaphorical “friction” on the circuit) creates heat, which can be thought of as “waste” energy.

Rebuildable Atomizer Wick

You might assume that a higher resistance atomizer would produce more heat and therefore more vapor, but in actuality the power is more important. You can think of the resistance in the atomizer as converting a proportion of the energy flowing through the system into heat. So whilst a higher proportion is good, what’s much more important is the amount of energy flowing through the system in the first place.

With electrons flowing through the wire at a greater rate, more of them bang into stuff (encounter resistance) and produce heat. This is why power (the wattage) is the most important measure of the amount of vapor you’ll get.

This is confirmed by the equations above, where the initial voltage is squared before being divided by resistance to produce the power. This means that the best vapor production would come from a low resistance with a high voltage. However, an important caveat is that increasing energy going through the system means that your atomizer will wear out more quickly.

The best thing to do is to experiment, but if you’re looking for a better vapor output always choose a low resistance atomizer over a high resistance one on your APV.

A Note on Battery Safety

Whereas mods like the ProVari come with in-built safety mechanisms to protect you from vaping-related accidents, mechanical mods and other APVs may not have these same safety precautions. Thankfully, the knowledge of Ohm’s law you’ve gained – combined with a little bit of information about batteries – can help you ensure you’re always operating within your specific battery’s limitations.

The most important additional information you need (besides the stuff you can determine from Ohm’s Law) is the C rating of your battery and the cell capacity (which is shown in mAh on the battery itself). The C rating isn’t always easy to find, but you’re looking for the maximum continuous discharge rating (burst discharge is no use for vaping) of the battery. Forum posts are a good place to look for the information, particularly if your supplier or a Google search doesn’t return useful information. A post here has the maximum discharge ratings for common mod batteries (in Amps).

To work it out yourself, you simply multiply the C rating of the battery by the cell capacity. For example, if you have a 700 mAh (milliamp hours) battery with a C rating of 8 C, this means it can deal with up to 700 × 8 = 5,600 milliamps of current. A milliamp is 1/1000 of an amp, which means you simply divide this by 1,000 to get the answer in amps, so in this case the maximum operating current would be 5.6 A.

Using the calculation above (at 3.4 V and with a 1.8 Ω atomizer – which works out to 1.9 A), you can see that this is only likely to become an issue when you get into the realms of sub-Ohm coils. If you were working at the same voltage with a 0.7 Ω coil, you’d be getting towards 5 amps, so whilst it would still technically be fine it would probably be wise to drop the voltage for the sake of safety. You’d get a ton of vapor even at 2.9 V with this resistance, but in practice you should keep the resistance over 0.8 Ω on any coil you use – there’s really no need to take a risk!

In reality, if you buy a high-quality battery there will likely be safety precautions built in to prevent catastrophe even in the worst case scenario. As mentioned above, this won’t really present much of an issue unless your resistances get very low, but if you’re rebuilding atomizers with low resistance you should do the math before you start to vape –

 

[ChuckTooter]

^^^ That hurt my brain

 

[iClearoman]

Holy crap you just started Vaping mods and your starting at .08 ohms?! That's like a 16 year old trying to drive in NASCAR! Way too low of a resistance for a beginner imo. As for the locking ring I'd say your best bet is to look for a whole new switch assembly. Maybe try fasttech.com. I am surprised that mystery battery you have hasn't blown up in your hand. It's very important that you know ohms law and the importance of your amp limits. Good luck and vape safe!

 

[Susan~S]

Holy crap you just started Vaping mods and your starting at .08 ohms?! Way too low of a resistance for a beginner imo.

Way too low for anyone, IMHO (given our current batteries continuous amp rating and the accuracy of the meters we use).

 

[starscream22]

nice i like it . you enjoying the stingray

 

[Topwater Elvis]

When using a mechanical and any vape calculator or ohms law math you should use 4.2 V, the voltage of a fully charged battery.
The 3.4v reference could be very confusing to someone new to mechanicals.

Way too low for anyone, IMHO (given our current batteries continuous amp rating and the accuracy of the meters we use).

This times eleventyhundredthousand.

 

[tayone415]

First of all if that's the MOD you bought for $45 do NOT try to fix it, do NOT even try to use it. That MOD obviously had a battery vent inside and possibly explode with in the mod.

Cloud chasing can be fun and addicting, but can also be very dangerous if you don't know what you're doing and don't have the right hardware and understanding of how ohm's law work and how you're batteries work. There is NO battery on the market yet that is designed to safely handle a .1 ohm coil especially not a 0.08 ohm coil. As a new vapor or even just a new mech user, you should NOT be doing any sub-ohms build close to that. You're brother is putting you in a dangerous situation.

What batteries did you get? The safest batteries for sub-ohm builds is the Sony VTC series BUT your build is NOT recommended even with those batteries since it is way above the 30 amp continuous draw. You also need to make sure your batteries are IMR batteries, and avoid other brands besides Sony for the best safety and reliability and not batteries with exaggerated specs. You also need a smart battery charger, and a volt reader to check your batter's voltage in between vaping, so you don't run your battery to an unsafe level, where you won't be able to use that battery safely or at all assuming nothing bad happened already.


Keep in mind a reading for your coils can be off +/- 0.02-0.04+ ohms so your .08 ohm coil could be .04 ohm coil and cause a dead short and thermal run away.

 

[valooper]

Thats crazy lol vape safer freind