Boge for me also. They aren't perfect but for lasting consistency and ease of use none of the others get it for me. I also have used the LRs on a Riva. Boge LR Cartos are rated at 2.0 that's not really that low considering a standard Joy Atty is 2.3. Most LRs are closer to 1.5 so while it is designated as LR I don't worry about using it on the fat bats. I wouldn't go below that though.