SafeCig vs Cameron (H.A. Gilbert is alive?)

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The Ocelot

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I was hijacking another thread with this topic, so I thought I'd start one of its own. This is really just an FYI of the information that piqued my curiosity.

I'm late to the party, as usual, since this situation has been going on for a few years, but it just came to my attention with today's news reports.

James Cameron Sued for $1 Billion Over Alleged E-Cigarette Swindle

After researching a bit more, it appears John Carmeron is the defendant allegedly most culpable and his brother James (the director) is only peripherally involved due to his connection with the James Cameron Family Trust. My take on it is that SafeCig named James, personally, as a defendant for publicity and his deep pockets.

A letter written by one of the owners of SafeCig outlines the allegations (scroll down for the letter):

Avatar Director James Cameron & His Brother John Cameron Destroy Small Family Business -Safe Cig

Be aware, the letter is long and very detailed, but I think it's worth at least a skim. What caught my attention was the amounts of money he listed. SafeCig is a mall-based cig-a-like company and while we, on various forums, were debating the latest mods they were raking in $500,000 per month. I think this underscores that the majority of e-cigarette users, even now, don't give a flying fruit bat about most things we are obsessed with.

Part of the lawsuit alleges the Camerons conspired to run SafeCig into the ground, while "they" created a competitor. The parent company is named as Human Health Organization, but the business name isn't. However, it doesn't take much poking around to find that HHO is doing business as Vaporcade.

For me, this is where things get weird. Do you remember Herbert A. Gilbert? He's the guy who got a patent in 1963 for a "Smokeless Non-tobacco Cigarette" that is conceptually close to what we use today. Gilbert never got much further than the patent.[1]

(FYI: Gilbert actually wasn't the first person to patent an electric vaporizer, but apparently he was the first one to specifically mention tobacco.)

Anyway, since I don't recall a peep out of Gilbert since the advent of vaping, I thought he was dead. I was wrong.

Enter Vaporcade. They apparently tracked him down and (it seems to me) may have played on his vanity.

(From a 2013 interview with Gilbert, "As John Cameron pointed out to me, timing can be everything and I was ahead of my time, and in the midst of what some might say was the most powerful advertising period of big tobacco."[2]

Gilbert has since lent his name to Vaporcade[3]:

"HERBERT A. GILBERT
As the inventor and patent holder of the very first Electronic Cigarette in 1963, H.A. serves on the Patent and Development team for the Human Health Organization."


After Vaporcade got Gilbert onboard they produced a product called "1963®" (I'm unclear on how one can trademark a year, but whatever.) "Evoking the spirit of the year the first electronic cigarette was invented. The 1963® utilizes the creative development of tech and style in the vaping industry to create a smooth, elegant smoke. Engineered in the United States we’ve employed the most advanced technology for a consistent puff every time."

"
[Gilbert]...is proud to be a part of H2O and the launch of the 1963® brand, an homage to his invention."

Mmmmm-kay. So far Vaporcade doesn't appear to have put a lot into marketing, I imagine they are busy with lawsuits. However, once that problem is over I can see them really pushing the Made-in-America angle, which I doubt it will actually be.

#.justsaying
Rawr

.....
cheetah_icon_by_topazdragon19-d35u537.gif


[1] Patent US3200819 - Smokeless non-tobacco cigarette - Google Patents
[2] An Interview with The Inventor of the Electronic Cigarette
[3] 1963 Electronic Cigarette - Vaporcade
 
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The Ocelot

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ETA: "LOS ANGELES, CA, Jun 02, 2015 (Marketwired via COMTEX) -- John Cameron, Founder of Vaporcade(TM), today announced the official launch of Zeus by Vaporcade(TM)* -- the world's first and only cellphone that vapes."

Mmmmm-kay.

Further down: "This device has not been authorized as required by the rules of the Federal Communications Commission. This device is not, and may not be, offered for sale or lease, or sold or leased, until authorization is obtained."

How could it be "officially launched?"

John Cameron Announces the Launch of Zeus by Vaporcade(TM) -- the World's First Cellular Vaping Device - MarketWatch
 

The Ocelot

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Launched as in "ready for investor."

John Cameron is a scam artist riding on his last name, and SafeCig sold their soul to the devil and got burned.

I'm curious to see what the Zeus will be like, considering the VapeCase already exists. Lotus VapeCase SUB-OHM V2.0 | Cloudscape Vape Could he be actually trying to make a phone?

I need to find the diagrams, since from the text I can't figure out what is being patented: Patents by Assignee The Safe Cig, LLC - Justia Patents Database (Although I guess if you can trademark a year, you can patent anything you like.)

And selling their soul? When it's claimed they were "required" to sign documents, then later states they have no copies of contracts they had signed, it gives me pause.
 
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Bad Ninja

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Just read the letter

They had stars in their eyes when they though the Cameron name would " open Hollywood doors" and get them exposure.
They had an "8 million dollar company" with a "dozen or so" employees" and a surplus of cash.
Then they invited John Cameron in.
Because of his name and the Tru$t.

They invited the Devil to dinner.

I feel sorry for them, as they got scammed hard, but they didn't need Cameron... Yet they welcomed him in, and he robbed them.
 

The Ocelot

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Just read the letter

They had stars in their eyes when they though the Cameron name would " open Hollywood doors" and get them exposure.
They had an "8 million dollar company" with a "dozen or so" employees" and a surplus of cash.
Then they invited John Cameron in.
Because of his name and the Tru$t.

They invited the Devil to dinner.

I feel sorry for them, as they got scammed hard, but they didn't need Cameron... Yet they welcomed him in, and he robbed them.

I agree. SafeCig was not a small business. Even at their reported low point of $200,000 a week I wouldn't consider it a small business. I find it hard to believe they were operating for so long without being savvy. Who signs documents they don't understand the ramifications of when there's that much money at stake? Shrug.

My fascination is with Gilbert. I thought the guy was dead. Where has he been?
 

FlamingoTutu

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Interesting. I'll have to do my reading "homework" tomorrow. Am I correct in my assumption from your post, Gilbert is trying to assert his right to the patent something like 52 years later?

I'm very, very sorry about your father. :( I can't even imagine. Thankfully my parents didn't smoke. The bad part is, I can't blame them for me starting either. At least not with any validity.
 

The Ocelot

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Interesting. I'll have to do my reading "homework" tomorrow. Am I correct in my assumption from your post, Gilbert is trying to assert his right to the patent something like 52 years later?

I'm very, very sorry about your father. :( I can't even imagine. Thankfully my parents didn't smoke. The bad part is, I can't blame them for me starting either. At least not with any validity.

From what I've read, Gilbert never made any claims of patent infringement. In any case, the patent has expired. What I'm puzzled about is why he apparently wasn't interviewed or quoted as the "inventor" of e-cigarettes until Cameron got ahold of him. Perhaps no one with a P.R. department ever offered him money before to be a poster child. And although his patent has expired I wonder if (I really should say how and when) Cameron plans to exploit him?

http://www.economist.com/blogs/schumpeter/2014/03/e-cigarette-patent-wars

Thank you for your condolences about my father. I can't blame him, everyone was smoking at the time. I don't blame my mother either, even though she smoked when pregnant with me. It was considered safe at the time. The result, however, is that I believe I was born with a predisposition to nicotine addiction - a "nic-baby" if you will.
 

crxess

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It was considered safe at the time. The result, however, is that I believe I was born with a predisposition to nicotine addiction - a "nic-baby" if you will.

Sadly you and a couple million of us. :( I was from couple of generations of smokers. only took a couple of packs and I was stuck for life.........well, almost;) Thank goodness someone thought of a solution for the most hard core.:)

As to the Rich being swindled.......... Entertainment or the rest of us. Mall Kiosk are an affront to Vaping and likely lost more Vapers than they helped due to Highway Robbery.

What comes around...........
 

The Ocelot

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Sadly you and a couple million of us. :( I was from couple of generations of smokers. only took a couple of packs and I was stuck for life.........well, almost;) Thank goodness someone thought of a solution for the most hard core.:)

As to the Rich being swindled.......... Entertainment or the rest of us. Mall Kiosk are an affront to Vaping and likely lost more Vapers than they helped due to Highway Robbery.

What comes around...........

Kiosks are an affront now, but in the beginning that's mostly where they were sold. Other than that, tobacco shops and head shops might have a few, but they weren't promoted to any degree. Reportedly, one of SafeCig's founders received a prototype from Ruyan in 2005, then started importing the devices in 2006. Initially sold in bars and pubs in the Philly area, their first retail "store" opened in approximately 2007. I have a sneaking feeling it was a kiosk, since that would fit more with their business plan.
 

crxess

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Kiosks are an affront now, but in the beginning that's mostly where they were sold. Other than that, tobacco shops and head shops might have a few, but they weren't promoted to any degree. Reportedly, one of SafeCig's founders received a prototype from Ruyan in 2005, then started importing the devices in 2006. Initially sold in bars and pubs in the Philly area, their first retail "store" opened in approximately 2007. I have a sneaking feeling it was a kiosk, since that would fit more with their business plan.

Yes, I'm sure there was some good intent somewhere in there in the beginning, however I feel it was lost in a hostile For Profit maneuver that just escalated over time. Even the early online vendors took the same concept, selling 510 sual battery kits for $79.99 for literally the same items I piece purchased for under $30.(now about $8-$12) For online that equated to higher than Kiosk profits due to minimal operational cost.

I am Sooooooooo.....glad the market has finally Exploded. Maybe now we can pick, choose, weed out the bad and actually increase Vapers in never before believed numbers. Doing so at a reasonable and appealing expense.

Sorry, thinking of the introduction of the patch. Why pay more for something that might maybe if lucky hopefully work?
Make it appealing and affordable. Some people work for a living.:)

_____________________________________________________________

On topic: Wonder how many realize SafeCig's made most of their money from Starry eyed hopeful Entrepreneurs buying Franchises, only to be quickly replaced as they failed? Mall spots are not cheap and low sales volume doesn't pay the rent for long.

Getting taken seems to be a way of life for many.:eek:
 

The Ocelot

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On topic: Wonder how many realize SafeCig's made most of their money from Starry eyed hopeful Entrepreneurs buying Franchises, only to be quickly replaced as they failed? Mall spots are not cheap and low sales volume doesn't pay the rent for long.

Getting taken seems to be a way of life for many.:eek:

TKO a.k.a. Totally Knockout Vapor did the same franchise scheme and sold their products for criminally high prices. A couple of years ago, I was poking around for information about them and discovered a weird letter they made customers sign and (compared to their actually business operation) one of the most disingenuous videos I have ever seen. I must have been in a mood that night, because it ticked me off more than usual. I started a scathing thread about them, that is still one of the top results on Google. It used to be the second, right after their website. I can't take all the credit, but I think I shamed them, since it wasn't too long after that they changed their website, lowered some of their prices, took down the pdf of the letter and removed the video from youtube.

Just now I checked and their website isn't working, but they have videos on youtube from 2015 and you can pull up caches of the web pages, so it may just be temporary. They are (or were) really up on things: holding cloud competitions and selling mechanicals and RDAs. I just hope they aren't selling them through mall kiosks.

In case you're so inclined (although it's not nearly as fun without the letter or video): You're telling customers what?! TKO Knockout Vapor | E-Cigarette Forum
 
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The Ocelot

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Oh eek, eek! TKO is still at it, their website is working again.

"... one cost-effective package for the beginner Mech Mod/Dripper"

A Complete TKO 18500 Mechanical Mod Kit - Everything you need!

In small print: "Rebuildable Atomizers are intended to be used on Mechanical Mods only"

Why?

trinity18500-kit1.jpg


This sweet set-up can be yours for just $112.95.
 
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fourthrok

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I'm just a little embarrassed to admit it...but SafeCig was my first e-cigarette. It was the first one I got when I decided to try the new e-cig thing I'd heard about online. That was September 2011. I did quit smoking the day my SafeCig kit arrived. Not having anything to compare it with...I liked it fine! But by the end of that year I'd started looking elsewhere, feeling that the SafeCig products seemed a bit overpriced. I ended up for a short time with V2 (but mostly on their forums, wasn't impressed, really, with their product), then went to Smokeless Image, leaving SafeCig far behind. Eventually, in early 2012, I moved to the eGo type set up and evolved from there. I still feel a little sentimental about SafeCig. They had a good little cigalike. Really...it was a nice little thing. It worked for me. When I found out they'd gone out of business I felt a bit of a twinge of regret for them.
 

The Ocelot

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I'm just a little embarrassed to admit it...but SafeCig was my first e-cigarette. It was the first one I got when I decided to try the new e-cig thing I'd heard about online. That was September 2011. I did quit smoking the day my SafeCig kit arrived. Not having anything to compare it with...I liked it fine! But by the end of that year I'd started looking elsewhere, feeling that the SafeCig products seemed a bit overpriced. I ended up for a short time with V2 (but mostly on their forums, wasn't impressed, really, with their product), then went to Smokeless Image, leaving SafeCig far behind. Eventually, in early 2012, I moved to the eGo type set up and evolved from there. I still feel a little sentimental about SafeCig. They had a good little cigalike. Really...it was a nice little thing. It worked for me. When I found out they'd gone out of business I felt a bit of a twinge of regret for them.

No need to be embarrassed, we all had to start somewhere. And from what I've read SafeCig got good reviews for a cig-a-like.
 
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DPLongo22

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I'm just a little embarrassed to admit it...but SafeCig was my first e-cigarette. It was the first one I got when I decided to try the new e-cig thing I'd heard about online. That was September 2011. I did quit smoking the day my SafeCig kit arrived. Not having anything to compare it with...I liked it fine! But by the end of that year I'd started looking elsewhere, feeling that the SafeCig products seemed a bit overpriced. I ended up for a short time with V2 (but mostly on their forums, wasn't impressed, really, with their product), then went to Smokeless Image, leaving SafeCig far behind. Eventually, in early 2012, I moved to the eGo type set up and evolved from there. I still feel a little sentimental about SafeCig. They had a good little cigalike. Really...it was a nice little thing. It worked for me. When I found out they'd gone out of business I felt a bit of a twinge of regret for them.

Met some good people on that old forum. One of them is still around in my life. ;)

Friendships are precious.
 
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