Some Info on the Empties

[PhiHalcyon]

Besides the obvious absence of juice, there are only two visible differences between the empties and the pre-filleds: 1) There's no printing on the outer black label (such as 16mg, 24mg, etc.); and 2) The positive center contact on the battery-end is flat (rather than with a shallow slot or channel).

The benefit of the flat contact is a superior connection between the battery and the cart. The challenge of the flat contact is a reduced dripping target from a channel with a hole in the middle of it, to just the hole. Dripping into the hole can still be done; it just happens to require a little more focus and concentration. (To make dripping into the battery-end easier, I went and found a small funnel that snuggly slides onto the center contact. It ended up working out so well that I now use the funnel to top-off my pre-filleds as well.)

The empties come with the mouth-end open, so filling from the mouth-end is an easy alternative; but I felt more confident that the atomizer wick and blanket would get well-moistened by filling from the battery-end. It may not matter which way you fill a cart, but what DOES matter is that you avoid starting up a cart with a dry atomizer wick. For, if you do, then you will get a rather unpleasant taste that you may or may not be able to work out. So what I do when starting a new cart is block the air-holes to maximize juice-flow, and then rapidly and repeatedly puff until it is clear that I am getting a moist, good-tasting vapor.

Once I got my first cart successfully started up, it didn't take long to realize that I had just entered a whole new level of satisfaction with my Nebula. For, not only was it nice to enjoy the rich flavor of my favorite juice (without needing to mix it with some other juice), but the liberation of being able to start off my carts with whatever flavor I want made the Nebula seem like it was truly mine for the first time since I've had it.

From now on, I will be buying no other carts but the empties.

 

[Peaches]

Phil, have you had a chance to calculate how many refills are possible before the burning of the poly starts or you need to switch to a new cartomizer?

 

[PhiHalcyon]

Peaches,

Rather than making an effort to use my carts for as long as possible, I now just use them for as long as they are well-delivering the moist and tasty vapor that I love. There was a time, however, when I would get as much as a whole week out of a cart (or about 30ml of refills), but my why-settle-for-less-than-the-best attitude of late has me using 3 to 5 carts per week (or about 5-10ml of refills each).

Five carts and 30 mls of juice per week may sound expensive, but the cost is almost exactly what I'd otherwise be paying for two cartons of generic analogs. And considering how much more I am enjoying my vaping than I ever did my smoking, (not to mention all the other benefits), I'd say that it's like getting Starbucks Espresso for the same price as the store brand stuff. So, I couldn't possibly complain.

Anyway, hope this helps.

 

[MicciMan]

PhiHalcyon, as usual, great info!

I may have to break down and get the empties after all, from your comments and from my thinking about it this seems the best way to maintain a consistently great vape.

So tonight our dog decided to chew up one of my carts (he didn't get sick or act any weirder than usual). I noticed there was a small tube, almost straw-like, from the battery opening to the end of the batting. This indicates to me that filling from the battery end drips the liquid down this tube, presumably to the silicone ring, and from there back down the inner walls into the batting. Have you dissected a cart and noticed this? and how are the empties working w/o the silicone ring?

 

[MicciMan]

The empties come with the mouth-end open, so filling from the mouth-end is an easy alternative; but I felt more confident that the atomizer wick and blanket would get well-moistened by filling from the battery-end. It may not matter which way you fill a cart, but what DOES matter is that you avoid starting up a cart with a dry atomizer wick.

PhiHalcyon, I ended up dissecting 2 of my original carts this evening and here is what I found:

First, there is no way for liquid to get into the battery end of the batting when filling directly from the battery end - unless you drip liquid in, then immediately flip the cart so the mouth end points up, allowing liquid to be absorbed the length of the batting.

The carts have a small metal cylinder, almost like a funnel, that is either cast to or electrically soldered/welded to the battery contact on the cart - as is the heating element.

This cylinder is sheathed with a flat absorbent material, then the batting is outside of that. The cylinder, toward the mouth end, has a small wick.

Contrary to posts in other forums, I did not observe any burning of the sheathing or the batting. However, I did observe very clear signs of burning of the wick "sock" on the cylinder end.

Based on the scope of this burning and the number of times I used the carts, however, I have absolutely no concerns whatsoever about this very minute burning and potential health effects.

My theory on why carts go "bad" is the sheath and batting become so saturated with liquid that the unit simply cannot effectively vaporize liquid any longer. I am going to test allowing some to completely dry out for a week or so and see how they perform.

Of course, IMHO, YMMV and all that............

 

[syntaxevasion]

Always enjoy reading what my customers find.. You guys are like scientists

 

[PhiHalcyon]

Ben, We may or may not be scientists; but we are definitely curious, tinkering vaporists!

 

[PhiHalcyon]

Hey MicciMan, and thanks.

As for your question regarding the silicone ring ... I just used a few from some ditched carts. For experimental purposes, I tried using a cart without the ring; and the most obvious effect was an unwelcome increase in the amount of heat. So, at the very least, the ring serves as a heat shield. It may also serve to channel the internal juice-moving vacuum. Either way, the ring definitely serves one or more important purposes, and should therefore be used.

As for disassembling the carts, yeah, I've cut open a dozen or more. And you're right that when one drips into the battery-end, the juice goes down the metal tube you observed ... but I believe that it then travels into the thin blanket (i.e., flat absorbent material) you mentioned. So, if you add enough drops, then I believe that they find their way to all parts of this blanket; and then to all parts of the filler material, or batting. At least this is how it appears. Then again, I can't actually see the part of the batting material that surrounds the metal tube.

You are also right about the thin blanket being the primary thing that gets burned; but if you burn it enough, then the batting will also get burned. I've seen holes burned right through the blanket before. As to why it gets burned, I'm not 100% sure. It may very well be that a moist blanket won't burn, but a dry one will. Or, that the atomizer coil over-heats (and thus, burns the blanket) when an insufficient amount of juice is present. Either way, keeping the cart moist seems a logical goal.

As for carts going bad, the main reason I tend to ditch the use of a cart is poor juice movement. If I'm finding it a struggle to get a sufficiently juiced cart to produce a warm, moist, and tasty vapor, then, unless a fresh battery solves the problem, I'll stop using it. I want to enjoy the act of vaping as much I as do the vapor itself; and struggling is not enjoying.

Besides, even though the batting and blanket can both be removed without cutting open the cart, the batting appears to be the easiest to replace; so why run the risk of burning the blanket? I'd like to give my bin of ditched carts a fighting chance at being renewed with new batting alone.

As for your theory, the inevitable degradation of the batting material is a given, but I don't know what to think about the longevity of the thin blanket. I do know that I have extended the use of a couple of the pre-filled carts (that were giving me some very premature problems) by rinsing them out. I just filled them with distilled water, blew the water out the battery end, repeated a couple of times, and then let them dry overnight. The only time (out of 3) that it didn't turn out well was when the problem was a burned blanket. So, it's possible that this kind of rinse could extend the life of an unburned blanket; leaving only the replacement of the batting to be done in a cart renewal process.

One thing I know for sure: I have yet to have an atomizer die. How long they may be able to last is as of yet unknown; but I sure would like to find out.

 

[MicciMan]

Awesome info PhiHalcyon!!!!!!!!!!

 

[MicciMan]

PhiHalcyon, your synopsis of starting with the empties is spot on. It really does take this to a whole other level. Wow.

 

[vapordad]

Phi and Micci, I couldn't find anyone else using these empties, and the only place I found them was at cigeasy (a few days ago). Does Vapornine now have them? Also, it seems that you are suggesting the best way to fill is from the battery end. I wonder where you got the funnel? I have been having no luck with vapor, although throat hit is great. When I puff the vapor is there, but when I inhale, nothing, or very little (I am comparing to my Red Dragon--killer vapor, not throat hit). Anyone know where to get empties for the Red Dragon? I have heard that the V9's carts fit, which they do, but I can't get any vapor or throat hit on them.....thanks for this thread. been looking for it for awhile, and thought I may have to just give up and get an SD or a 510...

 

[MicciMan]

VaporNine has the empties, 60 at a time but with the Father's Day coupon it works out to ~$2/cart shipped. Check their site and see the thread here about 20% off.

PhiHalcyon said he put a few drops in the battery end, then filled from the mouthpiece end. I did the same, but carefully dripped 2-3 drops through battery end. I let each cart sit for a full day before using. Yeow, it is nice!

 

[PhiHalcyon]

I picked up a 2-pack of the funnels at my local Joann Fabric store, but the exact same item can be found here: Craft Supplies: Sunshine Discount Crafts: Featured Craft Items from your Online Craft Supplies Store

Just search for funnel.

Darice Crafter's Toolbox 2pc Mini Funnel, Item 1156-77, is what it says on the package.

The funnel fits so perfectly that it snaps right into place.

 

[PhiHalcyon]

MicciMan, Welcome to the world of empties!

 

[vapordad]

hey guys, I had that vapor problem, again. Sometimes I can only get vapor when I puff. I tried the cleaning of the threads etc. and the puffing while blocking the air holes in the battery. Is it something I do wrong in filling the carts? Although it frequently occurs with the prefilled ones, too.

Just looking for tips.

I think I am still getting something, as I get a throat hit?

 

[scottro]

PhiHalcyon, how many drops does it take to fill an empty cart?

I really want to try this as the Nebula is my only vape (and I love it). Erica told me she just uses the pre-filled carts, and I've been the same way lately, but i'd love to join the "dripping club" and start buying empties and juice.

Thanks for the great info!

 

[PhiHalcyon]

Scott,

Depending on the size of the drops, I'd say that it takes between 10 and 20 drops to fill an empty. But you don't need to invest in the empties in order to start dripping your own juice. Once you get past the necessary phase of vaping some sort of mixture of your juice and the juice that comes in the pre-filleds, you can pretty much enjoy all the flavors and savings of dripping your own juice using the pre-filleds. In fact, until quite recently, this is exactly what every one of us Nebula drippers did.

 

[scottro]

That's pretty much what i've ben doing. got some 24 mg Red Bull juice from Ben at Vapornine and I really like it, but I just don't get the throat hit I'm looking for when I refill with it. not like a fresh 24 mg cart anyway.

I guess I'm looking for a juice that gives me a really good throat hit, but one that is smooth. Make sense? I'm going to be ordering some more carts and juice soon, and I'm trying to figure out just what to get.

Any suggestions?

 

[theECB]

Hey Scottro,

I have a "Nebula" device from Smoketip. I just got my first order of juice from Johnson Creek. The throat hit is really good and the vapor production is good. I have the Artic Menthol and don't find it to be very mentholy at all. However it does have a decadent nutty taste to it, very full, very satisfying.

Also, I drip from the mouthpiece end. Haven't tried the battery end drip but I'll give it a try. Really been wanting to try the empties from Vapornine dot com.

~theECB

 

[GrimmGreen]

hey guys, I had that vapor problem, again. Sometimes I can only get vapor when I puff. I tried the cleaning of the threads etc. and the puffing while blocking the air holes in the battery. Is it something I do wrong in filling the carts? Although it frequently occurs with the prefilled ones, too.

Just looking for tips.

I think I am still getting something, as I get a throat hit?

i had the same problem with a redbull one i filled up the other day , amazing flavor and throat hit , but not much vapor. I let it sit overnight and the next day when i took a drag , BAM! huge vapor , same great flavor and throat hit... i don't know what sitting over night does to the cartomizer but it seems to help out