The most pivotal person in vapings future ?

[Mazinny]

With the recent consolidation of the Nicopure ( Halo ) lawsuit and the so called " Industry Lawsuit " in the Washington D.C. district court, presiding judge Amy Berman Jackson, has the power to save vaping as we know it. Court proceedings start on Oct. 19.

Amy Berman Jackson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Fun fact : Jeopardy fans might be familiar with her son ( Matt Jackson ), who had the fourth longest winning streak in the show with winnings of over $ 400,000.

 

[DC2]

Fun fact : Jeopardy fans might be familiar with her son ( Matt Jackson ), who had the fourth longest winning streak in the show with winnings of over $ 400,000.

That IS a fun fact!

I not only remember that guy...
I'm unlikely to forget him anytime soon...

 

[Eskie]

So there's a good chance her son could have answered "a mixture of PG and VG is commonly associated with this activity".

 

[Mazinny]

That IS a fun fact!

I not only remember that guy...
I'm unlikely to forget him anytime soon...

Yeah, his personality was ... how can i state it ... not meek ! Not short in confidence.

 

[DC2]

Yeah, his personality was ... how can i state it ... not meek ! Not short in confidence.

And he had quite the, ummm, charming smile.

 

[smacuser]

 

[Mazinny]

And he had quite the, ummm, charming smile.

 

[Tommy-Chi]

With the recent consolidation of the Nicopure ( Halo ) lawsuit and the so called " Industry Lawsuit " in the Washington D.C. district court, presiding judge Amy Berman Jackson, has the power to save vaping as we know it. Court proceedings start on Oct. 19.

Amy Berman Jackson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Fun fact : Jeopardy fans might be familiar with her son ( Matt Jackson ), who had the fourth longest winning streak in the show with winnings of over $ 400,000.

I hope she rules on the side of the people. The US FDA is overstepping it's authority and is not our moral compass.

 

[rico942]

"a mixture of PG and VG is commonly associated with this activity".

What is DIY ?

 

[ScandaLeX]

Reminds me of Eddie Munster.

 

[retired1]

I hope she rules on the side of the people. The US FDA is overstepping it's authority and is not our moral compass.

While some bemoan the fact she's an Obama appointee, she's pretty much a no nonsense judge and tends to follow the letter of the law. She's the one that spanked the Obama Administration when they were trying to claim executive privilege over submitting documents relating to Fast and Furious.

A White House Concession on Fast and Furious

I think there's a very good chance that she'll spank the FDA as well.

 

[Racehorse]

While some bemoan the fact she's an Obama appointee

Well most people with critical thinking skills do realize that a nominee or appointment isn't an ideological clone of the president who chose them....

Anyway, I think you characterize her correctly, an hopefully you are right about the outcome.


(Glad it's not Pence, Trump's VP selection, who is the judge in this case )

 

[Bob Chill]

Obama is an ex smoker or still a closet smoker. Heck he may even be a closet vaper. Obama has never taken an anti vape stance publicly unless I missed it.

I believe this trial will be heard with neutral ears either way. I hope it doesn't drag on forever thought. Since the case is consolidated there is going to probably be thousands of pages of testimony.

 

[Eskie]

I believe this trial will be heard with neutral ears either way. I hope it doesn't drag on forever thought. Since the case is consolidated there is going to probably be thousands of pages of testimony.

However, if a temporary stay is issued, it can drag on as long as it wants to.

 

[Bob Chill]

However, if a temporary stay is issued, it can drag on as long as it wants to.

The optimistic side of me believes a temp injunction will happen. But I was caught with my optimistic pants down when the regs were released. I expected some pain but nothing nearly as severe.

Back in 2009, vaping wasn't on the radar at all compared to the opposition now. An injunction would rile up quite the crowd including the majority of the general public. It won't be well received. I know that shouldn't influence a judge but it's a big deal to order one on this issue now. I assume an injunction stops the implementation of the entire reg package? If so, age restrictions wouldn't go into affect. That really won't be well received at all even though the vape industry basically self imposed one at the B&M level pretty much everywhere.

 

[Eskie]

Back in 2009, vaping wasn't on the radar at all compared to the opposition now. An injunction would rile up quite the crowd including the majority of the general public. It won't be well received. I know that shouldn't influence a judge but it's a big deal to order one on this issue now. I assume an injunction stops the implementation of the entire reg package? If so, age restrictions wouldn't go into affect.

I understand your reasoning. however, I can't see much of a public backlash, as I've yet to meet one non-vaper who knew anything about these regulations. However, I'm quite sure the professional anti-smoking brigade will kick and scream. Age restriction can still be applied at the state level, and I would expect that to occur regardless of any stay or ultimate outcome from the litigation. Even the plaintiffs in this suit (essentially us) already ceded that age restrictions and child resistant packaging should be required, and as you said, is already being voluntarily applied by retailers.

 

[Jonner]

These 2 sentences give me hope that she tells the FDA that they have overstepped their bounds:

"Jackson ruled that the National Labor Relations Board had limited authority...."
AND
"Jackson overturned a decision by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) that revoked a permit for the Spruce 1 mine project in Logan County, West Virginia, on the ground that the EPA did not have power under the Clean Water Act to rescind the permit."

 

[Eskie]

These 2 sentences give me hope that she tells the FDA that they have overstepped their bounds:

"Jackson ruled that the National Labor Relations Board had limited authority...."
AND
"Jackson overturned a decision by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) that revoked a permit for the Spruce 1 mine project in Logan County, West Virginia, on the ground that the EPA did not have power under the Clean Water Act to rescind the permit."

Unfortunately, her ruling on the EPA was overturned on the appellate level and she had to reverse her decision. Which is indicative that no matter how she rules in this case, it will be appealed by the losing side. And so on, and so on..............

 

[Jonner]

Unfortunately, her ruling on the EPA was overturned on the appellate level and she had to reverse her decision. Which is indicative that no matter how she rules in this case, it will be appealed by the losing side. And so on, and so on..............

Agreed, however, if "we" win, that will make the FDA 0-3 in Federal Court (correct me if I'm wrong), which might give them pause as to whether they should appeal, although they probably will anyway.
I'm not a judge (federal or otherwise), but to me, it boils down to this, e-cigs, vaporizers, whatever you want to call them, are not a "tobacco product," nor are they a "drug." Therefore, the FDA has no power to regulate them, except for possible packaging and advertising limitations, if classified as a "supplement." This is all new territory for everyone, so it will definitely drag on for years. But an injunction or a "win" in this court will definitely give us the upper hand, especially if the deeming regs are pushed back to 2007 by Congress.
I'm not an optimist or a pessimist, I'm a "realist," I see some hope in this, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

[Mazinny]

No summer break for FDA’s lawyers as deeming cases mount up | ECigIntelligence