Tobacco Absolute
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I would suggest more PGA to the dilution if you're using the 1.5ml vial.
Here's the recipe that I've used for years with tobacco Absolute. Scubabatdan posted this quite a long time ago and it's still a favorite of mine:
2 drops tobacco Absolute
10ml PGA
1/4 tsp Ethyl Maltol
As you can see that's not much TA to PGA, so if you were using a 1.5ml vial of TA in 15ml of PGA, that would provide a very strong Tobacco Flavoring, almost too much concentration per drop unless you're mixing larger batches of e-liquids.
Personally I would suggest to use the 2 drops to 10ml ratio as it's a lot more manageable and easy to fix if the flavor is too strong.
Here's the recipe that I've used for years with tobacco Absolute. Scubabatdan posted this quite a long time ago and it's still a favorite of mine:
2 drops tobacco Absolute
10ml PGA
1/4 tsp Ethyl Maltol
As you can see that's not much TA to PGA, so if you were using a 1.5ml vial of TA in 15ml of PGA, that would provide a very strong Tobacco Flavoring, almost too much concentration per drop unless you're mixing larger batches of e-liquids.
Personally I would suggest to use the 2 drops to 10ml ratio as it's a lot more manageable and easy to fix if the flavor is too strong.
It sounds like you're describing a tincture. Do you have to create a base with the TA first, and then use it in juice?
Or can you use small quantities in a juice, maybe with a little warmth to thin it (and the VG) and a few days to all work itself out.
I'm very new to all of this. I'm thinking of getting into making juice, and I've only just come across TA. It sounds like an intriguing additive.
Does it combine well with other flavors, or should it be used on its own with some sweetener?
Hi potts_d,
The TA and Ethyl Maltol will infuse the PG or PGA. Much faster with the PGA however it will also infuse into the PG when the PG is warmed. In the recipe that I listed, that can be used as-is as a flavoring to your e-liquids, it's not overly strong however I would still suggest to use it in approx 5-10% range (err on the lower end and add more if taste demands it). One thing to keep in mind with TA flavored liquids, these juices need to steep for at least 3 days (if not longer) to give their full flavor.
I have a recipe that I made which is a nice creamy maple tobacco e-liquid where the tobacco combines quite well, the juice has some sweetness to it too, mostly from the ethyl maltol contained in the other flavors:
This recipe makes 15ml of 36mg 63% PG / 37% VG e-liquid.
11.10ml Flavor-It-Yourself 48mg 50/50
2.55ml TFA Bavarian Cream
0.45ml TFA Tobacco Blend (PG)
0.45ml TFA Hazlenut
0.45ml TFA Maple Syrup
The TA and Ethyl Maltol will infuse the PG or PGA. Much faster with the PGA however it will also infuse into the PG when the PG is warmed. In the recipe that I listed, that can be used as-is as a flavoring to your e-liquids, it's not overly strong however I would still suggest to use it in approx 5-10% range (err on the lower end and add more if taste demands it). One thing to keep in mind with TA flavored liquids, these juices need to steep for at least 3 days (if not longer) to give their full flavor.
I have a recipe that I made which is a nice creamy maple tobacco e-liquid where the tobacco combines quite well, the juice has some sweetness to it too, mostly from the ethyl maltol contained in the other flavors:
This recipe makes 15ml of 36mg 63% PG / 37% VG e-liquid.
11.10ml Flavor-It-Yourself 48mg 50/50
2.55ml TFA Bavarian Cream
0.45ml TFA Tobacco Blend (PG)
0.45ml TFA Hazlenut
0.45ml TFA Maple Syrup
Thanks Renaissance. That makes much more sense to me now.
And your recipe sounds delicious! What does the TFA stand for?
Thanks again.
Also... I know the ideal alcohol to use for tinctures is pure grain, and you can also use 151 proof vodka.
But all I can find close by is 151 proof rum. Will this work as well?
I'm thinking the rum might give a little something extra to a few of the extract flavors... or am I way off?
Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks.
But all I can find close by is 151 proof rum. Will this work as well?
I'm thinking the rum might give a little something extra to a few of the extract flavors... or am I way off?
Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks.
Potts_d
TFA stands for The Flavor Apprentice, the name of the company those flavors come from.
I would suggest using a clear alcohol, we cannot get higher then 80 proof vodka locally here so that is what we use. The rum would contain caramels, and those sugars can ruin your atty.
Happy Mixing!
TFA stands for The Flavor Apprentice, the name of the company those flavors come from.
I would suggest using a clear alcohol, we cannot get higher then 80 proof vodka locally here so that is what we use. The rum would contain caramels, and those sugars can ruin your atty.
Happy Mixing!
Thanks a lot, Kimerpuff. That makes sense, about the rum.
Does the 80 proof work well? Is there a longer recommended steeping time with the lower alcohol content?
I've used 80 proof vodka and it works fine, however I prefer to dissolve the TA in warmed PG since I don't care to thin my juice out. As for longer steeping times, I've not noticed any. Generally any mixture that I use some form of TA in I let steep for 3 days minimum before I even try it, and then over the course of the next two weeks it matures.
That's what I was thinking initially, that I could just use the TA like any other flavor.. but with some thinning of the juice with slight heat (warm water, microwave... whatever). And the steeping time makes a lot of sense to me. Although I haven't made juice yet, I think I will want to let them steep for a few days, regardless of the flavor.
Thanks a lot for the info, Renaissance. I knew nothing about TA, now I know something! The beauty of ECF.
You also mentioned a thinning of your juice due to the alcohol, which never occurred to me!
I've been curious about how tinctures and essential oils might affect the flavor profile. Should these be used in conjunction with normal flavor to maintain a decent consistency? Or should I just try to steer clear of them altogether?
Or is this kind of a moot question? I mean to say: are these tinctures and essential oils the main ingredients in the very flavor concentrates to which I'm comparing them?
In essence, is an essence different from its derived essence; or is that very essence the self-same essence as that to which it is derived?
There is an important question looming above this post: have I taken too many drugs, or do I need more?
Just kidding... I hope the "essence" of my question wasn't lost in all the nonsense.
Thanks again, Renaissance.
Peace.
Thanks a lot for the info, Renaissance. I knew nothing about TA, now I know something! The beauty of ECF.
You also mentioned a thinning of your juice due to the alcohol, which never occurred to me!
I've been curious about how tinctures and essential oils might affect the flavor profile. Should these be used in conjunction with normal flavor to maintain a decent consistency? Or should I just try to steer clear of them altogether?
Or is this kind of a moot question? I mean to say: are these tinctures and essential oils the main ingredients in the very flavor concentrates to which I'm comparing them?
In essence, is an essence different from its derived essence; or is that very essence the self-same essence as that to which it is derived?
There is an important question looming above this post: have I taken too many drugs, or do I need more?
Just kidding... I hope the "essence" of my question wasn't lost in all the nonsense.
Thanks again, Renaissance.
Peace.
-eyes sway around the words trying to understand the essence of the question-
potts_d,
There's a lot of threads out there regarding steeping, and the opinions vary on how and when it should be done, and also the order in which the ingredients should be added to the juice before and after steeping. You can do a search regarding steeping and spend the good portion of an evening hearing of all those opinions.
Thinning the juice is not as big of an issue if you use a heavy VG base, but for me, I don't care for it since the flavor percentage generally needs to be higher. I normally run 85/15 (85% PG / 15% VG) in my mixtures, so any distilled water or ethyl alcohol based flavorings will kill that ratio unlike a PG based flavor. Something to consider when mixing. The lower your VG ratio, the less vapor. Pure PG mixtures will have very little vapor, and if ethyl alcohol based flavorings are used, even less vapor. It will still work in your e-cig, unless it is thinned out too much, thus just creating steam.
My personal recommendation is to steer clear of tinctures and essential oils. I use TA fairly sparingly, it's not water soluble. My atty's last usually 4-6 weeks (even low resistance), and that's just how I vape. Some have reported shorter atomizer life when using oils. That and, who knows how healthy it is to breath in those vapors. It's a personal choice you have to make, but mine is to use only TA. There is of course also Tobacco Extract, which is water soluble. I prefer TA over TE. The taste is a bit better IMO.
As for the main ingredients of the flavors, most of them are made with artificial flavoring molecules. I'm not a flavorist so I don't know the exact science behind it. Some are natural flavorings as well.
To give you a short answer: TA is good. I've not experimented with other tinctures or essential oils. With the wide variety of food grade flavorings out there, I would highly recommend to work with those primarily and enjoy the wonderful world of DIY vaping
potts_d,
There's a lot of threads out there regarding steeping, and the opinions vary on how and when it should be done, and also the order in which the ingredients should be added to the juice before and after steeping. You can do a search regarding steeping and spend the good portion of an evening hearing of all those opinions.
Thinning the juice is not as big of an issue if you use a heavy VG base, but for me, I don't care for it since the flavor percentage generally needs to be higher. I normally run 85/15 (85% PG / 15% VG) in my mixtures, so any distilled water or ethyl alcohol based flavorings will kill that ratio unlike a PG based flavor. Something to consider when mixing. The lower your VG ratio, the less vapor. Pure PG mixtures will have very little vapor, and if ethyl alcohol based flavorings are used, even less vapor. It will still work in your e-cig, unless it is thinned out too much, thus just creating steam.
My personal recommendation is to steer clear of tinctures and essential oils. I use TA fairly sparingly, it's not water soluble. My atty's last usually 4-6 weeks (even low resistance), and that's just how I vape. Some have reported shorter atomizer life when using oils. That and, who knows how healthy it is to breath in those vapors. It's a personal choice you have to make, but mine is to use only TA. There is of course also Tobacco Extract, which is water soluble. I prefer TA over TE. The taste is a bit better IMO.
As for the main ingredients of the flavors, most of them are made with artificial flavoring molecules. I'm not a flavorist so I don't know the exact science behind it. Some are natural flavorings as well.
To give you a short answer: TA is good. I've not experimented with other tinctures or essential oils. With the wide variety of food grade flavorings out there, I would highly recommend to work with those primarily and enjoy the wonderful world of DIY vaping
That is a very reasonable answer.
I am going to make an order from Perfumers Apprentice, and I am only including minimal ingredient flavors. It's hard to choose, so I'm sure I'll be getting a bunch.
I had 70/30 in mind for a ratio to try. It seems nicely balanced.
I will have to experiment with TA, and see if it's up my alley.
It is really exciting to think that any little adjustments I make can have different effects on the juice. I can't wait to try all kinds of concoctions.
Thanks, Renaissance. You've been a huge help!
Take care.
I am going to make an order from Perfumers Apprentice, and I am only including minimal ingredient flavors. It's hard to choose, so I'm sure I'll be getting a bunch.
I had 70/30 in mind for a ratio to try. It seems nicely balanced.
I will have to experiment with TA, and see if it's up my alley.
It is really exciting to think that any little adjustments I make can have different effects on the juice. I can't wait to try all kinds of concoctions.
Thanks, Renaissance. You've been a huge help!
Take care.
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