Using PVs at work claimed to show lack of focus

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DrMA

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BBC News said:
When and where to "vape" was the second most asked question asked [sic]. The advice given is to never use e-cigarettes in the workplace, as it shows you are not "focused".

BBC News - Manners are still a minefield as modern technology confuses

What a load of crock! As we all can attest, vaping (particularly nicotine) helps enhance and maintain focus, as well as making us a lot more pleasant to be around than a smoker going thru (temporary) withdrawal or carrying around the smell of his/her last smoke break. vaping should be celebrated and encouraged as one of the most significant public health development of our generation.
 
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Augmented Dog

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I'll gladly go along with considering it a profoundly important development, and agree that its use should be encouraged as a smoking alternative and device for quitting. However calling it the " most significant " development of our generation goes a bit overboard.
But I get your meaning.
 

Kent C

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Please name a more significant development in public health in the last 50 yrs.

Worldwide, the use of DDT It was discovered earlier, but used extensively in the 50's to 1995 when it was banned by the WHO, UN, et. al. in some 28 countries. In 2000, a few countries (S.A., Zimbabwe, Zambia) hit the worst by the ban - ie. millions of cases and thousands of deaths per year - went against the UN (and lost funding) by reintroducing DDT. The cases and deaths dropped to pre-'95 levels - virtually wiping out the disease in some areas. Kenya, continuing the ban, has 8.2 million cases a year.

http://wattsupwiththat.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/malaria_fig1_goklany_2007.png
In Africa, DDT Makes A Comeback To Save Lives

That said, the CDC lists 'tobacco control' in the top ten significant changes in public health - certain vaccines, HIV meds, heart meds, etc. as some of the others. IF tobacco control is that high up in ratings, then vaping would be a significant development indeed. Perhaps the biggest in the US, if you look at the actual numbers (rather than the percentage change) involved in the other developments noted.

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6019a5.htm
 
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TyPie

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I'm thinking that mapping the human genome / DNA may be way up there on the list. Was just talking with an in-law today of a documentary recently where 2 parents known to each carry a gene for separate serious diseases, with a long history of death in the respective families from each, would likely guarantee an early death from said diseases for any children they had. Long story short, they consulted a geneticist (I believe), who REMOVED the offending genes from their DNA prior to in-vitro fertilization, and went on to GUARANTEE that any children would NOT contract the offending diseases, at least genetically. Just amazing.......can you imaging being able to eradicate genetic diseases and afflictions prior to fertilization?

Then again, the e-cig is likely to rank as one of the most important public health developments in the last 50-100 years. The potential impacts are HUGE.
 
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dragonpuff

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I would say it's a really close call between all of the above, to be honest. The last 50 years have brought about so many medical and technological innovations that it's almost impossible to realistically determine which one would have / have had the greatest impact on the world population. This is especially true given that they overlap and interact with each other - for instance, vaping has the potential to save many more lives than it would had the vaccine for small pox never been invented.

That said, the invention of the modern electronic cigarette (I say "modern", of course, to distinguish it from all similar inventions dating back to the 60's that never took off...) is right up there with all of the best technological innovations of the last century, especially given that it's full potential hasn't even come close to being reached yet. A safe, user-controlled delivery system such as this has many more potential applications than simply replacing smoking, that is for sure. I'm not even talking about drug delivery either (though no doubt that is the case) - there's already been talk about vitamin inhalation, and many of us here have mentioned using vape flavors as an alternative to snacking... so vaping may have potential to not only impact the smoking epidemic, but the obesity epidemic as well. Certainly there are many applications none of us have even thought of yet...

The truth is, all we can do at this point is speculate about what impact vaping will have on the future. None of us really know its true potential yet, and it will probably be a very long time before we do.
 

skoony

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Worldwide, the use of DDT It was discovered earlier, but used extensively in the 50's to 1995 when it was banned by the WHO, UN, et. al. in some 28 countries. In 2000, a few countries (S.A., Zimbabwe, Zambia) hit the worst by the ban - ie. millions of cases and thousands of deaths per year - went against the UN (and lost funding) by reintroducing DDT. The cases and deaths dropped to pre-'95 levels - virtually wiping out the disease in some areas. Kenya, continuing the ban, has 8.2 million cases a year.

http://wattsupwiththat.files.wordpress.com/2010/09/malaria_fig1_goklany_2007.png
In Africa, DDT Makes A Comeback To Save Lives

That said, the CDC lists 'tobacco control' in the top ten significant changes in public health - certain vaccines, HIV meds, heart meds, etc. as some of the others. IF tobacco control is that high up in ratings, then vaping would be a significant development indeed. Perhaps the biggest in the US, if you look at the actual numbers (rather than the percentage change) involved in the other developments noted.

Ten Great Public Health Achievements --- United States, 2001--2010

of interest is the correct use of DDT is no more harmful than anything on the market today.
the politics and science behind the ban is reminiscent of what still passes for science today.
in the book "Silent Spring" DDT was touted as the single source of many environmental
problems and totally responsible for the demise of the peregrine falcon,claiming it made
their eggs so frail and brittle they would break before the hatchling could develop.
the real reason of course was every farmer and his brother would kill them on sight if
possible and wreck their nests when found as they and to some extent other birds of prey are notorious
chicken thieves for lack of a better word.
with the advent of modern indoor farming,laws,protection status and breeding programs they have
made a great come back..their eggs are still rather thin though.
ask any free range chicken farmer what he thinks of birds of prey in general.
:2c:
regards
mike
 

williamclarkonet

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BBC News - Manners are still a minefield as modern technology confuses

What a load of crock! As we all can attest, vaping (particularly nicotine) helps enhance and maintain focus, as well as making us a lot more pleasant to be around than a smoker going thru (temporary) withdrawal or carrying around the smell of his/her last smoke break. Vaping should be celebrated and encouraged as one of the most significant public health development of our generation.

I agree with you 100%!
 

Kent C

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Ok, you guys convinced me. It is probably not "the most" significant, but I'm keeping it as "one of the most." I edited the OP to reflect this discussion.

In case you were wondering, I agree that vaccines probably rank higher than ecigs for public health impact.

One of the problems of determining beneficial effects is that in many cases there's no good way to count them. In economics you have concepts of 'externalities', 'unintended consequences' and 'alternative uses' - as in, for example, a local tax to fund the schools or build a bike path, etc. etc. The alternative use of that money per individual taxpayer could be used more beneficially (or not) by the taxpayer themselves. In 'campaigns' for the tax, sometimes it is described in order to minimize the effect - as 'one carton of cigarettes' or a '6 pack' or 'a few less trips to McDonalds, etc. ie any politically incorrect use. Where in reality, it may be putting away a few more bucks for college tuition, retirement, health care, vacation, etc. But those are not so easily counted.

The ban on DDT only became so evident by the renewed cases and deaths from malaria once the ban was in place (and when it was lifted by certain countries) - but prior to that - the advocates to ban DDT did not take those effects into consideration. In fact they totally dismissed them.

In my link above from the CDC - 2 more recent (within our generation) vaccines figured to save 13,000/year (an extrapolation from prior data and only AFTER the vaccines were distributed), but if you use the 450,000/year deaths from cigarette smoking and the percentages (if we had good data) of vapers who quit smoking and other factors of the less effects on certain body parts from vaping vs. smoking, then you could come up with an estimate of how many of those 450,000 deaths would decrease (or how many years longer a vaper would live) and it wouldn't take that much to overcome the 13,000 'saved' by vaccines.
 

DrMA

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One of the problems of determining beneficial effects is that in many cases there's no good way to count them. In economics you have concepts of 'externalities', 'unintended consequences' and 'alternative uses' - as in, for example, a local tax to fund the schools or build a bike path, etc. etc. The alternative use of that money per individual taxpayer could be used more beneficially (or not) by the taxpayer themselves. In 'campaigns' for the tax, sometimes it is described in order to minimize the effect - as 'one carton of cigarettes' or a '6 pack' or 'a few less trips to McDonalds, etc. ie any politically incorrect use. Where in reality, it may be putting away a few more bucks for college tuition, retirement, health care, vacation, etc. But those are not so easily counted.

The ban on DDT only became so evident by the renewed cases and deaths from malaria once the ban was in place (and when it was lifted by certain countries) - but prior to that - the advocates to ban DDT did not take those effects into consideration. In fact they totally dismissed them.

In my link above from the CDC - 2 more recent (within our generation) vaccines figured to save 13,000/year (an extrapolation from prior data and only AFTER the vaccines were distributed), but if you use the 450,000/year deaths from cigarette smoking and the percentages (if we had good data) of vapers who quit smoking and other factors of the less effects on certain body parts from vaping vs. smoking, then you could come up with an estimate of how many of those 450,000 deaths would decrease (or how many years longer a vaper would live) and it wouldn't take that much to overcome the 13,000 'saved' by vaccines.

Here you go: scientific estimates for lives saved by vaping
http://bjgp.org/content/64/626/442

West & Brown (2014) (linked above) estimated that for every million smokers who switch from tobacco to e-cigarettes, over 6,000 premature deaths each year would be avoided, even if people continue to use e-cigarettes for life and e-cigarettes are assumed to carry significant risk of fatal diseases. Using West & Brown (2014) estimates, if all 44 million American smokers switched to e-cigarettes, the widely cited number of over 400,000 premature smoking-related deaths per year, could be reduced to 20,000 conservatively, but likely it would be much lower, so, roughly, 380,000/year lives saved.
 
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Kent C

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Here you go: scientific estimates for lives saved by vaping
http://bjgp.org/content/64/626/442

West & Brown (2014) (linked above) estimated that for every million smokers who switch from tobacco to e-cigarettes, over 6,000 premature deaths each year would be avoided, even if people continue to use e-cigarettes for life and e-cigarettes are assumed to carry significant risk of fatal diseases. Using West & Brown (2014) estimates, if all 44 million American smokers switched to e-cigarettes, the widely cited number of over 400,000 premature smoking-related deaths per year, could be reduced to 20,000 conservatively, but likely it would be much lower, so, roughly, 380,000/year lives saved.

Good stuff. I liked:

"The latest study, involving almost 6000 respondents, found that use of an e-cigarette in the most recent quit attempt was associated with a 60% increase in the odds of still being abstinent compared with using no aid and with using a licensed nicotine product bought over the counter."

Relatively (esp. compared to some recent silly ANTZ studies), 6000 respondents is a fairly good sample.
 

NorthOfAtlanta

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Here you go: scientific estimates for lives saved by vaping
http://bjgp.org/content/64/626/442

West & Brown (2014) (linked above) estimated that for every million smokers who switch from tobacco to e-cigarettes, over 6,000 premature deaths each year would be avoided, even if people continue to use e-cigarettes for life and e-cigarettes are assumed to carry significant risk of fatal diseases. Using West & Brown (2014) estimates, if all 44 million American smokers switched to e-cigarettes, the widely cited number of over 400,000 premature smoking-related deaths per year, could be reduced to 20,000 conservatively, but likely it would be much lower, so, roughly, 380,000/year lives saved.

So if after 20 years they figure out that 50% of the deaths they claimed were smoking related actually were caused by genetics or pollution, that would mean "only" 190,000 lives saved per year.

:facepalm::vapor:
 

ISGRidge

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BBC News - Manners are still a minefield as modern technology confuses

What a load of crock! As we all can attest, vaping (particularly nicotine) helps enhance and maintain focus, as well as making us a lot more pleasant to be around than a smoker going thru (temporary) withdrawal or carrying around the smell of his/her last smoke break. Vaping should be celebrated and encouraged as one of the most significant public health development of our generation.

I'm vaping at my desk right now and is really helping me focus... on reading this ;-)
 

DrMA

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So if after 20 years they figure out that 50% of the deaths they claimed were smoking related actually were caused by genetics or pollution, that would mean "only" 190,000 lives saved per year.

:facepalm::vapor:

I think the estimate of 6,000/y premature deaths avoided for each 1MM smokers who switch to vaping already acknowledges the fact that smoking is far less deadly than widely claimed by the tobacco control industry. Think about it, do some back of the envelope calculations, and you'll see what I mean - I give West & Brown a lot of credit for subtly giving a wink of their understanding that the TCI propaganda is grossly overestimating the health impacts of smoking.

That being said, various figures from ASH-UK suggest that there some 2.1MM vapers in the UK. That's over 12,000/y lives saved already. In the US, we don't really have any authoritative numbers for the size of the vaping population, but various estimates are floated in the range of 6MM, so 36,000/y lives saved.
 

Nate760

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The trouble with trying to calculate "lives saved" is that we have no reliable baseline figure for the number of deaths caused by smoking. It's not unreasonable to assume the yearly total in the US is probably over six figures, but the 450,000 number that gets routinely tossed around by the ANTZ/CDC is a self-evident fiction. If someone smokes or has a history of smoking, and dies from a cause that can be even tangentially associated with smoking, they go down in the books as a smoking-related death.
 
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