Using VV/VW device does it matter which replacement coil heads I buy?

[Silent Scream]

Hi folks,

I'm using an Ego V V3 and I have it set to watts the whole time and was wondering what difference (if any) it makes what coil heads I buy. I've been using 2.5 and 2.2. I heard lower ohms gives you a tighter draw does that still hold true using VW?

Thanks.

 

[Anjaffm]

I do not know the eGO V V3.

But:
lower ohm (e.g. 1.8 ohm) means that you have to put less volts into the atomizer to get a nice vapor = battery lasts longer until you have to re-charge it.

higher ohm (e.g. 2.5 ohm) means that you have to put more volts into the atomizer to get the same amount of vapor as with lower ohm and lower voltage = the battery does not last as long until you have to re-charge it.

(sorry if I talk funny, German lady here... )

That is the main difference for vapers who use purchased heads.
Once you get into making your own coils and things, it may be different. But for those of us who use purchased heads, that is the main difference.

(matter of fact, I had this nice little T3 atomizer the other day with a 1.5 ohm head that produced great vapor at 3.2 volts )

 

[Silent Scream]

That's interesting Anja, thanks. The V3 is a 1300 mah battery with VV/VW and it doesn't last more than 6/7 hours with a 2.5 head, that must be why.

 

[TheJakeBailey]

I believe it's 800mAH, unless there is a new, new version. Great little unit that I use every day.

 

[Silent Scream]

I believe it's 800mAH, unless there is a new, new version. Great little unit that I use every day.

Yes it's new, it hasn't been out very long. I believe it's similar to the V2 except this one has VW as well as VV.

eGo-V V3 Passthrough 1300mAh Battery - Black/Stainless - eGo Batteries - E-Cig Starter Kits

 

[Anjaffm]

That's interesting Anja, thanks. The V3 is a 1300 mah battery with VV/VW and it doesn't last more than 6/7 hours with a 2.5 head, that must be why.

Yup, that's the reason. 1300 mAh last one day, comfortably, at about 4 volts.

As a non-techy, I do not bother with watts. I turn the volts up / down manually, so I know how many volts a certain head needs.
(and if I do not know off the top of my head, then adjusting the volts slowly will do the trick )
If the battery does the adjustment automatically, I think that the vaper has no idea how many volts he / she is using (and draining battery life). And will have no idea how many volts he / she should use when using a battery that is only VV.

In addition, a brand new head should usually be "vaped in" (= broken in) slowly and with lower volts at first. Kind of like a brand new car engine...

I burned up a brand new IMIST atomizer once. On the first use, after about 1 minute.
Yeah, put it on a brand new silver-plated (clone) battery which fires at 4.3 volt when fully charged (and then goes down in volt delivered). While IMIST atomizers can take 4.3 volt when fully "vaped in" but not when brand new.
--- Cursed like a truckdriver, threw away a brand-new (now broken) IMIST atomizer bottom - and learned my lesson

For reasons like that, I prefer to be in control. Not the battery electronics

As one of my professors used to say:
Better simple and correct than complicated and wrong

/edit:
oh, nice battery!
I got me a Vision Spinner 1300 mAh the other day. VV. eGo batteries go up only to 1100 mAh in Europe, last time I looked.

 

[Silent Scream]

Yup, that's the reason. 1300 mAh last one day, comfortably, at about 4 volts.

As a non-techy, I do not bother with watts. I turn the volts up / down manually, so I know how many volts a certain head needs.
(and if I do not know off the top of my head, then adjusting the volts slowly will do the trick )
If the battery does the adjustment automatically, I think that the vaper has no idea how many volts he / she is using (and draining battery life). And will have no idea how many volts he / she should use when using a battery that is only VV.

In addition, a brand new head should usually be "vaped in" (= broken in) slowly and with lower volts at first. Kind of like a brand new car engine...

I burned up a brand new IMIST atomizer once. On the first use, after about 1 minute.
Yeah, put it on a brand new silver-plated (clone) battery which fires at 4.3 volt when fully charged (and then goes down in volt delivered). While IMIST atomizers can take 4.3 volt when fully "vaped in" but not when brand new.
--- Cursed like a truckdriver, threw away a brand-new (now broken) IMIST atomizer bottom - and learned my lesson

For reasons like that, I prefer to be in control. Not the battery electronics

As one of my professors used to say:
Better simple and correct than complicated and wrong

/edit:
oh, nice battery!
I got me a Vision Spinner 1300 mAh the other day. VV. eGo batteries go up only to 1100 mAh in Europe, last time I looked.

I started off using VV but switched to watts when I realised I didn't have to worry about which heads were in my EVODs or Mini Protank 2 and decided to stick with that because I won't be going back to VV after this. I'm lazy and am happy for the battery to do the work

The link I put above is for the UK. It's a new Ego battery there are hardly any reviews for it still. You should have no problem buying it in Germany. They're cheap as well (considering the features).

I'm still wondering if there are any other reasons to choose certain heads when using VW. I'll have to look it up, if not I'll go for something like 1.8 so the battery lasts longer

 

[The Ocelot]

I started off using VV but switched to watts when I realised I didn't have to worry about which heads were in my EVODs or Mini Protank 2 and decided to stick with that because I won't be going back to VV after this. I'm lazy and am happy for the battery to do the work

The link I put above is for the UK. It's a new Ego battery there are hardly any reviews for it still. You should have no problem buying it in Germany. They're cheap as well (considering the features).

I'm still wondering if there are any other reasons to choose certain heads when using VW. I'll have to look it up, if not I'll go for something like 1.8 so the battery lasts longer

Actually, it won't. Battery life is determined by the amps you're pulling.

As an "average" vaper the following really isn't very important, but I wanted to clarify the technical info. I'm sorry, but there's math involved.

(I changed the order of quadrants around on the wheel, but the formulae are all still correct.)

P = power (watts)
V = volts
R = resistance
I = current (amps) I forgot why it's "I"

Voltage x voltage ÷ resistance (ohms) = power (watts)

4.5v²/2.2Ω = 9.2w

Voltage ÷ resistance (ohms) = I (current/amps)

4.5v/2.2Ω = 2.05 amps

3.7v²/1.5Ω = 9.1w

3.7v/1.5Ω = 2.47 amps

Even though a 2.2Ω atty at 4.5v and a 1.5Ω atty at 3.7v are producing the same amount of watts (+/- 9), when vaping low-res the amps increase, which draws more from the battery.

Since 9 watts is 9 watts, an average vaper isn't going to notice a difference in the temperature of their vape (I'm sure I will be corrected about this by someone really smart, but I am an "average" vaper writing for other average vapers); however, if the vaper is watching the clock, they might theoretically be able to tell the battery isn't lasting as long, but these are similar to people who can calculate the exact moment a microwave begins to generate heat in a potato.

 

[generic mutant]

This thread gets very technical, but the theory seems sound to me (not that I have a background in physics or anything... But I'm an interested layperson)

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-not-matter-its-all-about-wire-temp-read.html

The upshot is that a thicker wire (lower gauge, lower resistance) has greater surface area, and thus for the same surface temperature will create more even heating of the wick. This allows you to heat it up more without burning, creating 'better' vapour (scare quotes because better is ultimately subjective).

The larger mass of the wire requires more power to drive it, so you're stressing the battery more.

However, the difference between prefabricated atomisers is going to be less than custom built ones, on average. Whether the extra battery drain is worth it to you is something only you can tell.

There may be other advantages to thicker wire too - you're less likely to burn through it (so less failure, easier to dry burn), less likely to knock it out of position by accident (probably not a realistic scenario in a prefabricated atomiser).

One final caution - don't go below ~1.8 ohms without doing your research on battery safety (that figure not entirely plucked out of thin air - the prefabs are available at 1.8, and they run safely though not always well on an ego. No idea if you can get one to fire on a cigalike, but I wouldn't advise trying).

 

[The Ocelot]

This thread gets very technical, but the theory seems sound to me (not that I have a background in physics or anything... But I'm an interested layperson)

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...-not-matter-its-all-about-wire-temp-read.html

The upshot is that a thicker wire (lower gauge, lower resistance) has greater surface area, and thus for the same surface temperature will create more even heating of the wick. This allows you to heat it up more without burning, creating 'better' vapour (scare quotes because better is ultimately subjective).

The larger mass of the wire requires more power to drive it, so you're stressing the battery more.

The thread is worth pondering, kind of, (I've been told I have the attention span of a guppy), but it's overkill if you're just trying to figure out what coils to buy. I suggest buying some coils of whatever resistance you choose (I have a feeling your options are probably only from 1.8Ω to about 3.0Ω), fill up a tank with your favorite juice, click on a the link and have a nice read.

 

[generic mutant]

I think it's down to the individual - different things stick for different people.

I have quite a systematic mind in some ways, so if I don't understand why something is, I'm unlikely to grasp it intuitively. That thread really made sense to me (not that I've read it all), and was one of those "Aha! I get it now" moments in my early vaping explorations.

Others may find it dull, baffling or both.

 

[The Ocelot]

I think it's down to the individual - different things stick for different people.

I have quite a systematic mind in some ways, so if I don't understand why something is, I'm unlikely to grasp it intuitively. That thread really made sense to me (not that I've read it all), and was one of those "Aha! I get it now" moments in my early vaping explorations.

Others may find it dull, baffling or both.

I wasn't dismissing your reply, I hope I didn't come across that I was. If I did, I apologize. I was just suggesting the OP get whatever he needs to vape and vape while he reads the thread, rather than read the thread and try to use it as a basis for what to buy now.

 

[generic mutant]

You didn't - no worries.

I wasn't dismissing your point either (I edited in the bit where I said "the difference in prefabs isn't as great" while you were posting, so your reply made even more sense in the context when you were posting it... damn it, need to learn to stop ninja-editing)

I think we basically agree, just looking at things from a different angle.

 

[Stosh]

The Ocelot is quite correct in pointing to amperes as the deciding factor. Batteries are rated in how many mah they have, that stands for milli-ampere-hours, or how many milliamps can you expect to have over time.

The amps vs. heat is an interesting discussion, and very hard to quantify. The amps are used to heat up the wire which vaporizes the juice, very simple right? Not so much, ever notice when you're vaping the second or third puff you take the atty / carto starts to heat up somewhat. The coil may cool quickly, but depending on the surrounding ceramic - metal - wick material and juice density all will contribute to residual heat. Your first couple puffs may need a bit more power to heat not only the juice but your whole topper.
And to make it even more quirky, every 'topper' style will heat up a bit faster or slower.

Personally I prefer VV over VW, because of these changes as you vape, a constant wattage does not necessarily mean a constant heating. I use "how it tastes, how warm is it" as I vape and adjust it to whatever tastes good to me, instant feedback loop...

 

[generic mutant]

One other addendum (which probably has nothing to do with prefab atomisers) - for a given length of coil and total resistance, if the wire gauge is lower, the coil pitch must be smaller (you need to fit more wire in), so the coils will be closer together.

That must increase efficiency, and create more even heating. I'm sure that's something they went into in that thread (I can't remember, it's a blooming long time since I read it and I don't have the stomach to attempt it again right now).

Stosh is right in that any model we make of these things is going to contain huge oversimplifications. But we can make some broad generalisations, and one seems to be that lower ohms (up to a point and all other things being equal) makes smoother, richer vapour, while killing your battery more.

(That said, I know there are well informed people out there that disagree...)

 

[Anjaffm]

@Ocelot:

Even though a 2.2Ω atty at 4.5v and a 1.5Ω atty at 3.7v are producing the same amount of watts (+/- 9), when vaping low-res the amps increase, which draws more from the battery.

Are you saying that a lower ohm head (e.g. 1.8) needs more battery power (= drains the battery faster) than a higher ohm head (e.g. 2.5)?

If yes, that is contrary to everything I have heard / read and experienced myself, as to how long the battery will last on one charge.
If not, well, you lost me completely.

Uhm.. you lost me completely anyway And I am very happy that I do not have to have a degree in physics in order to vape

/edit:
Oh, and I purchased the 1.5 ohm heads for the T3 (like an Evod).
They do sell those with no special warning. At least for the T3.
I do prefer the 1.8 ohm heads though, I am used to those and do not have to go down to 3.2 volts to vape with them.

 

[generic mutant]

Anja;

Try plugging some numbers into an ohms law calculator. I found it helped me get my head around it to see the numbers changing.

Ohm's Law Calculator

To get 10 watts,

At 1 ohm you need 3.16 amps.
At 3 ohms you need 1.83 amps.

So for equivalent energy transfer, the low resistance atomiser will be drawing more power. Of course this says nothing about how that energy turns into heated vapour.

The physics part of it confuses the heck out of me too, you aren't alone

 

[Stosh]

Your ego has a 1,300 mAh battery, which is as much mAh as I will usually use in one day, and should be big enough that the ohms / resistance of your coil should have little impact on battery life. It may make a difference of 15-30 minutes over the course of a day's vaping.

The bigger difference in the resistane is how fast it may heat up the topper, and the flavor you get off your topper. Comes down to personal preference, if it tastes good to you -- vape it!! ...

 

[Silent Scream]

Thanks a lot for the replies everyone. I'm happy to say I almost understood some of the replies

I have since decided to go with the Stosh Theory Of Relativity 'If it tastes good to you - vape it'

 

[TheJakeBailey]

Yes it's new, it hasn't been out very long. I believe it's similar to the V2 except this one has VW as well as VV.

eGo-V V3 Passthrough 1300mAh Battery - Black/Stainless - eGo Batteries - E-Cig Starter Kits

Ahhh I was thinking the innokin vv/vw2. My bad