Vaperev on Nitecore i4 with Sony VTC4

[ScottChensoda]

Taken from The Battery University.

Battery professionals agree that charging lithium-ion batteries is simpler and more straightforward than nickel-based systems. Besides meeting the voltage tolerances, the charge circuits are relatively simple. Limiting voltage and observing low current in triggering “ready” is easier than analyzing complex signatures that may change with age. Charge currents with Li-ion are less critical and can vary widely. Any charge will do, including energy from a renewable resource such as a solar panel or wind turbine. Charge absorption is very high and with a low and intermittent charge, charging simply takes a little longer without negatively affecting the battery.

Perhaps the vendor has struck a large supply deal with xtar?

 

[Big Hit]

Interesting info. I'd not read info like this before.

The recommendation by Vaporev brings up the following questions: Is the recommendation only for the Sony VTC4, all Sony batteries, or all high drain batteries regardless of brand?

I have both the Nitecore Intellicharger i2 and i4 chargers version 2 (yellow label). I don't use Sony batteries, but I do use AW IMR high-drain batteries in all of my mods.

From what I understood with the Nitecore i4, each of the four battery slots monitors and charges independently, but intermittantly splits the charging between bay1/bay3 and bay2/bay4 simultaneously if multiple bays are used at once.


" The Intellicharger i4 is a universal, automatic smart-charger compatible with almost all types of rechargeable batteries thus eliminating the need to own several chargers. The i4 is able to automatically identify Li-ion, Ni-MH and Ni-Cd rechargeable batteries and apply an appropriate charging mode (Constant Charge Current (CC), Constant Charge Voltage (CV) and Trickle Charge). Each of the i4’s four microcomputer-controlled charging slots is capable of monitoring and charging batteries independently. "
- http://www.nitecore.com/productDetail.aspx?id=18

I agree with Baditude .
If they didn't charge independently then one battery of the two batteries could have a higher ending voltage.

Try charging two batteries each with a different precharge voltages and you will notice that the post-charged batteries will have the same voltage.

 

[beckdg]

I agree with Baditude .
If they didn't charge independently then one battery of the two batteries could have a higher ending voltage.

Try charging two batteries each with a different precharge voltages and you will notice that the post-charged batteries will have the same voltage.

more reliable evidence in my experience is that i can put lithium manganese cells in any bay and nickel metal hydride cells in any bay and they both come out accurately charged according to their chemistry. this couldn't happen if the bays weren't independently controlled.

 

[Tbev]

I was on Vaperev tonight and saw this posted on their product page for the Sony VTC4:

"Note: For safety reasons, we recommend customers do not charge this battery in Nitecore Intellichargers. We highly suggest users only use Xtar brand chargers that are compatible for this type of battery as Xtar's can handle the charging load. Please reference your chargers manual to ensure compatibility."

I contacted them about this and they went on to say:

[snip of unrelated discussion]

"... We do not recommend using the i4 charger to charge the Sony batteries because the charger only has one "chip" for all bays. Since the Sony battery is for high-drain devices, it will require more power to charge it. If multiple batteries are being charged at the same time, this will overload the circuitry of the charger and cause the charger to stop working. The XTAR VP1 chargers have one chip per bay and will be able to handle the amount of charge the Sony batteries require. Should you have any further questions, please let us know so we may better assist you. We hope you have a wonderful evening."

I asked if I could quote them on this and they said "You can quote us on this." If anyone wants to further expound on this, I would appreciate it. And for those that love the Nitecore, I don't mean to call your device into question, quite the contrary -- I would like you to chime in as well if you feel this needs your input as I feel safe in assuming that some of you are using this charger with these batteries. Also, if you are a Nitecore user, could you also state whether you have a V1 (white label) or V2 (yellow label).

I just received 4 vtc5's last night and charged them all from factory, in my i4 charger, nothing was out of the ordinary.

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[GoodahSP]

I charge Sony vtc4s on an i4charger. They don't overcharge past 4.2v even when I forgot to remove them maybe 30 to 45 mins after the 3 lights were on. Multimeter usually reads the batteries at 4.17V or 4.18V at full charge. I did notice that when I charge more than 2 batteries on it it takes a little over an hour longer than normal to fully charge them.

 

[Tbev]

Ya I took life 5 hours to get 4 new tvc5's from 3.55ish I think to 4.2 but it always gets mine to 4.2v afc I leave them on overnight, for days no problems.

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[GoodahSP]

It is something to look into for 1) The I4 V2s are inexpensive right now + they are well trusted/recommended, and 2) Sony VTCs are all the rage. I have to believe that people are using the two in tandem. Granted I don't think they are saying this could be catastrophic, but still they felt strongly enough to add a disclaimer.

On one hand I am thrilled that a vendor would actually take a stance (too many vendors remain mute, or just say "recommended for advanced users"), but I also wish they gave a further breakdown as it does seem to conflict with what is stated elsewhere.

Vaperev Shop - Sony 30A 18650 Battery - Batteries

Funny thing is they charge $4 to $5 more for the same batteries than a lot of vendors. They charge more for vtc4s than what others are selling vtc5s for.

 

[Joka]

I only use vtc4 batteries and I use this charger, never had a problem really. Once it seemed like it took forever but it was a new battery, first charge. So it didn't really think much of it. I have the yellow label.

*tH@--j0]{A*

 

[beckdg]

I did notice that when I charge more than 2 batteries on it it takes a little over an hour longer than normal to fully charge them.

expected results. if you charge more than 2 batteries (or 2 in the right configuration) on the i4, you halve the charge current going to each battery in paired bays.

 

[GoodahSP]

expected results. if you charge more than 2 batteries (or 2 in the right configuration) on the i4, you halve the charge current going to each battery in paired bays.

Right. It was explained in the earlier posts too by Baditude. I tend to ramble sometimes. I'm not very good to sticking to one liners. He...heh.

 

[trichome]

Just to chime in here. Just got 4 VTC5's and went to charge two of them last nite in my i2 intellicharger, about 2-3hrs in the charger got very hot as did the batteries and I pulled them from it. Never before did this charger heat up like it did last nite. left the two VTC5's to cool down and then checked their voltage sitting at 3.9v. Not going to put the VTC5's in that charger again. It charged my VTC4's no problem same with EFest 35A and all my AW 18650's with no issues.

 

[Baditude]

Just to chime in here. Just got 4 VTC5's and went to charge two of them last nite in my i2 intellicharger, about 2-3hrs in the charger got very hot as did the batteries and I pulled them from it. Never before did this charger heat up like it did last nite. left the two VTC5's to cool down and then checked their voltage sitting at 3.9v. Not going to put the VTC5's in that charger again. It charged my VTC4's no problem same with EFest 35A and all my AW 18650's with no issues.

Interesting results. I wonder what it is about the Sony VTC5 that is different from other batteries, and cause possible heating issues with the Nitecore chargers?

The purple Efest 35amp is a re-branded LG-HE2 20amp battery (Efest overstating specifications again). The AW is either a 10 amp (2000mah) or 24 amp (1600mah) battery depending upon which model it is.

 

[trichome]

Interesting results. I wonder what it is about the Sony VTC5 that is different from other batteries, and cause possible heating issues with the Nitecore chargers?

The purple Efest 35amp is a re-branded LG-HE2 20amp battery (Efest overstating specifications again). The AW is either a 10 amp (2000mah) or 24 amp (1600mah) battery depending upon which model it is.

AW is 10amp 2000mah I'm currently charging one atm and it's fine. Not hot at all, but I won't be putting any VTC5's in to it again. Not taking the risk as they got a lot hotter than I'm happy with and the charger was nearly too hot to touch on the bottom.

I'm no expert on ohms law or batteries but I'd hazard a guess and say the charger was having to pull more power than it could handle to charge the batteries.

 

[NicksCloud]

Ok.. after spending time with a yellow nitecore i4..it doesn't efficiently trickle charge batteries. If they sit on there for about a hour, there is noticeable depletion of capacity..anyone else get this? I'll get exact measurements and edit with those.. I might retract my bs statement earlier. *

Sad to say that I'd prefer to have my old trustfire back I gave to a friend..."it says fire..but it says fire...yadda, yadda.."

37, ph0n3 h0m3.

I am going to start monitoring the capacity of my batteries with my nitecore i4 as well.

I do want to point out that the merchant does not post any references to support the claim as to why you should not use nitecore chargers. I have been using mine for 2 years without any issues but I also have not been monitoring battery capacity. Time to bust out my trusty multimeter!

 

[Tbev]

I have been and all is good

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[Hermit]

AW is 10amp 2000mah I'm currently charging one atm and it's fine. Not hot at all, but I won't be putting any VTC5's in to it again. Not taking the risk as they got a lot hotter than I'm happy with and the charger was nearly too hot to touch on the bottom.

I'm no expert on ohms law or batteries but I'd hazard a guess and say the charger was having to pull more power than it could handle to charge the batteries.

Well it takes power to make heat - you don't need to be an expert to know that!

So have you still got two you didn't charge at all yet? What's the voltage on them?

 

[trichome]

Well it takes power to make heat - you don't need to be an expert to know that!

So have you still got two you didn't charge at all yet? What's the voltage on them?

Yeah still have two not charged there sitting at 3.5v

 

[Hermit]

Hmm, not particularly low then. I'm just wondering if it's something about the specific batteries you've got, as opposed to VTC5s in general, since others are reporting the i2 + VTC5 combination working OK. It will be interesting to hear whether they charge fine on another charger

 

[trichome]

Hmm, not particularly low then. I'm just wondering if it's something about the specific batteries you've got, as opposed to VTC5s in general, since others are reporting the i2 + VTC5 combination working OK. It will be interesting to hear whether they charge fine on another charger

I don't know tbh, I was able to charge an AW 18650 2000mah yesterday with no issues and no heating up of either the charger or battery. Anyway I've a new charger ordered and will report back once I get it.

 

[Tbev]

My dad's been charging his panasonic ncr18650b av vtc3or4's on the freebie Chinese charger from a starter kit with no problems , and they measure out fine...

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