The myth of second hand vape

[p.opus]

I keep hearing about the perceived hazards of "second hand vape". Not only from newcomers, but from experienced vapers who should know better

So let's see if we can debunk this once and for all.

POINT ONE:
The ingredients of typical ejuice are as follows:
1. USP grade Propylene Glygol,
2. USP grade Vegetable Glycerin
3. USP grade Flavorinigs
4. Water,
5. Nicotine

Of these 5 ingredients, 3 of them have already been evaluated by the FDA as GRAS, or Generally Recognized As Safe. and one of them, H20, should go without saying. This means for the majority of people, they are safe. Don't bring allergies into the equation because it is a red herring. People are allergic to peanuts but last time I checked there are no restrictions on me on eating peanuts in public. Also for those of you who still won't let the allergy analogy die, you can read point two below. Anyway the point being unless there is some magical transformation that takes place, you can't mix ingredients that are GRAS and get a poison cocktail. It doesn't happen.

POINT TWO: The only "non-safe" ingredient, is Nicotine. So let's take a look at this danger from a practical standpoint.
Let's assume a person vapes 1ml of juice in an hour. This is high, but it makes the math easier. Let's also assume that it is 12mg/ml. which is a common "middle of the road" concentration.

If this person were to NOT absorb any of the inhaled e-juice, then the total amount of nicotine released as vapor would be 12mg.

A standard 10ftx10ftx10ft room (not large by any means) is 1000 cubic feet this is roughly 28317 liters.

So let's look before we tackle the Nicotine argument, lets tackle the "PG/VG" issue. Assume 1ml of 100% PG solution were released into the room as pure vapor. The room would contain 1ml/28317 liters, or 1ml in 28,317,000 ml This is a concentration of PG of .035 ppm. So we can put that one to bed.

12mg/28317 cubic liters equates to .4 micrograms of nicotine per liter.

According to the New England Journal of Medicine on the Nicotine Content of Vegetables, A person exposed to 1 microgram/liter of second hand smoke, would need to be exposed to that environment for 3 hours to absorb 1 microgram of nicotine.

Thus a non vaper would need to be exposed to .4 micrograms of nicotine per liter for 3 hours to absorb .4 micrograms of nicotine.

How much is .4 micrograms of nicotine? Well to put it into perspective, 59.3 grams of Potato contain .4 micrograms of nicotine.

2 oz of potato folks.

Remember folks. Were talking about 1ml of 12mg/ml e-juice, in a small 10x10x10 room with no ventilation and the assumption that none of this is absorbed by the Vaper himself.

BOTTOM LINE: A person in such a room would be exposed to .035 ppm PG vapor and would need to sit in the room for 3 hours to be exposed to the same amount of nicotine as naturally contained in 2 oz of potatoes.

And you wonder why most of us think it is an absurdity to see second hand vape as a public hazard in anyway, even in a tightly confined space?

The Nicotine Content of Vegetables - New England Journal of Medicine

QED

 

[skoony]

ditto

regards
mike

 

[SissySpike]

Im not going to look all of that up but it sounds good;-)

 

[DC2]

I've seen the math done many times, and it always comes out the same.

Second-hand vapor will not impart enough nicotine to a bystander to be any cause for concern.
I think that is scientifically well established by those that understand science.

In my personal opinion, it is to the detriment of those bystanders, as they could probably use a little nicotine.
Too bad they're really not getting enough to help them.

 

[Orb Skewer]

If your state still allows it, I'd say thats Margeuritas all round.

 

[Diogenes]

This is great for the short-term, but what about long-term exposure for both first- and second-hand vapor?

 

[Orb Skewer]

This is great for the short-term, but what about long-term exposure for both first- and second-hand vapor?

A product that has been around for 7 years is still an embryonic product in the grand scheme of things, if in doubt go back to cigarettes, the long term effects are better known.

 

[Diogenes]

A product that has been around for 7 years is still an embryonic product in the grand scheme of things, if in doubt go back to cigarettes, the long term effects are better known.

I just ask because I see the majority of people touting that vaping is safer. I agree, it is safer than smoking, a lot less chemicals in it than in regular cigarette smoke. But, there have been few short-term studies done, and nothing long-term. How can we, as vapers, say with 100% certainty that vaping is safe?

 

[DC2]

This is great for the short-term, but what about long-term exposure for both first- and second-hand vapor?

Harm from long-term exposure to second-hand vapor?
I have to say with all due respect that the idea is scientifically absurd given what we know.

First-hand vapor?

Maybe I could find a reason to concern myself with flavorings.
But then, that is my choice to make.

 

[YKruss]

This is great for the short-term, but what about long-term exposure for both first- and second-hand vapor?

Like non-smoker with a vaporer using 1 ml of 12 mg per hour in a 10X10 room without ventilation?

Really? Are you serious?

 

[Vaslovik]

This is great for the short-term, but what about long-term exposure for both first- and second-hand vapor?

Do you vape, or are you just here to post things like that?

 

[Diogenes]

Like non-smoker with a vaporer using 1 ml of 12 mg per hour in a 10X10 room without ventilation?

Really? Are you serious?

Really, I am serious. You have a bar that allows vaping. Every night, vapers are there, doing their thing, while the bartender and waitress, who don't vape, are there as well. What effect does it have on them, night after night? The fact is, we don't know.

 

[Diogenes]

Do you vape, or are you just here to post things like that?

Yes, I do.

 

[mare ze dotes]

delete self. I missed something?

 

[DC2]

Really, I am serious. You have a bar that allows vaping. Every night, vapers are there, doing their thing, while the bartender and waitress, who don't vape, are there as well. What effect does it have on them, night after night? The fact is, we don't know.

You don't know but I do. The answer is none.

 

[Orb Skewer]

I just ask because I see the majority of people touting that vaping is safer. I agree, it is safer than smoking, a lot less chemicals in it than in regular cigarette smoke. But, there have been few short-term studies done, and nothing long-term. How can we, as vapers, say with 100% certainty that vaping is safe?

It's been safer than crossing the street for 7 years, long term? well maybe hover cars will be the saviour of pedestrians-and maybe the short term studies re vaping, nicotine, PG, VG, GRAS products will be 'outed as BS', that could take 150 years, who knows, saving lives, maybe many lives is a kind of 'here and now' issue for me, I wont be here in 150 years, selfish ? I'll be damned then won't I.

 

[Diogenes]

You don't know but I do. The answer is none.

Really? I'd just love to see your proof.

 

[Palantir1120]

I just ask because I see the majority of people touting that vaping is safer. I agree, it is safer than smoking, a lot less chemicals in it than in regular cigarette smoke. But, there have been few short-term studies done, and nothing long-term. How can we, as vapers, say with 100% certainty that vaping is safe?

Well let me throw my 2¢ in on that. The U.S. Has had a nuclear program since the 1930's. Plenty of studies have been conducted in regards to radiation effect on the human body (thus the REM, which is the unit of measure of radiation on human body, was derived). Anyway on point, the effect of tiny amounts of radiation (i.e. 500 mrem per year) is no more dangerous than that of normal hazards of life.

Sent from my SPH-D710VMUB using Tapatalk

 

[Palantir1120]

In other words nothing is 100% safe.

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[p.opus]

Really, I am serious. You have a bar that allows vaping. Every night, vapers are there, doing their thing, while the bartender and waitress, who don't vape, are there as well. What effect does it have on them, night after night? The fact is, we don't know.

Long term exposure to what?

Ingredients already studied and recognized by the FDA as being safe? or Ingredients that are in such low concentrations that the exposure to second hand vape pales in comparison to exposure to the same material in nature?