Five Pawns now on ECF
- Thread starter Rob Fitz
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Well Rob you addressed two of the naysayers. Thank you for showing us all how five pawns doesn't run and hide. You guys are the best.
Because I think in a New Thread, we could Hopefully put the Bashers and the Fan Boy Defenders behind us.
And Focus on what Many of us here want, and what You have indicated You Want, an Adult Dialog about Testing, Da & AP and Your Company.
And Please don't take this as Being Critical. But letting this Thread go over the Weekend without your Input was perhaps not the Best Idea.
Perhaps a Fresh Start and an Understanding that you will probably Not be Able to Reply on Weekends would be a Good Call.
I think what @Mazinny did in post [HASHTAG]#386[/HASHTAG] helps keep this thread open. It highlights the legitimate inquiries and hopefully helps Rob F. know what reasonable concerns naysayers have.
I think another thread, if not moderated with very strict (and rather special) rules, will possibly end up similar to this one.
I think another thread, if not moderated with very strict (and rather special) rules, will possibly end up similar to this one.
Rob I do have two questions for you. Cloud 9 has stated that they waited for you at VapeJam and you didn't show up. They were at your both there for 30 minutes and decided to leave. Can you please comment on the meeting you were going to have. Second question is when Cloud 9 published publically your test results they also published the PG/VG contain on your juices which showed most of your juices were at least 70% PG. Can you comment on those reports? Thank you.
Sorry I omitted you. BTW did you figure out the golf swing yet?
PLEASE STOP!!! Enough already, you were already appointed captain of the cheerleading squad over the weekend.
I guess you'll have an issue with me too. Personally, I think it took a lot of class to come back after the bloodbath they took over the last few days and promised to be more transparent, publish quarterly test results and to thank everyone, including the naysayers for participating in this thread. A lot of class. But then I guess saying anything complimentary is just not cool, right?
They did their best to run FP off the thread all weekend long. Now all they can do is play marbles.
No issues at all with your reply. Quite frankly, I agree. I'm a relatively new vaper and decided to follow this thread with the desire to learn. I suspect others are doing the same. You see, not all of us are experts and know everything there is to know about the industry. Right? That desire to gain additional education continued to fade until about 45 minutes ago when the folks from 5P became active again. Right? Now, if members would just stop their posturing...
I am not following this thread to read constant, back handed, replies from any member on ECF.
Too funny.
Like the whole, "please don't take this as a criticism, but the way you've handled this thread just sucks. Seriously, no offense meant by that."
Just cracks me up!
Hi Rob. I have asked another Question regarding making the Testing Protocol and Methods your Lab used available to the Public. But I would also like to ask this in the Event that this Thread is Closed Prematurely.
In your Companies Blog, it states...
"In the meantime, it’s important that consumers can enjoy the Five Pawns flavor experience with the highest level of confidence. Five Pawns does not feel there is any concern with diacetyl or AP in our e-liquids at current levels."
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What Criteria is Five Pawns using to asses "Concerns" when it comes to Levels of Diacetyl and AP?
And at what Level, in ppm, would Five Pawns feel there should be Concern for a Vaper who is using 4ml/day?
In your Companies Blog, it states...
"In the meantime, it’s important that consumers can enjoy the Five Pawns flavor experience with the highest level of confidence. Five Pawns does not feel there is any concern with diacetyl or AP in our e-liquids at current levels."
AgeLock
What Criteria is Five Pawns using to asses "Concerns" when it comes to Levels of Diacetyl and AP?
And at what Level, in ppm, would Five Pawns feel there should be Concern for a Vaper who is using 4ml/day?
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Unfortunately, we cant speak to those numbers because they are far higher than any test we've ever conducted regardless of the testing method. What we can tell you is we've spent many months and resources to try and understand the risk profile of DA and AP in a consumer/vaping setting. Toxicologists, Chemists, and Risk Assessment Scientists who we've contracted with and who have conducted studies for years surrounding these compounds have expressed minimal cause for concern in a consumer setting relative to vaping. We've funded research on how these compounds relate to vaping versus industrial exposure settings. We will be releasing some of this research shortly, which will be very interesting to consumers regarding these compounds in vaping. Additionally, we don't feel it is prudent for a manufacturer to set an exposure level. This should be left up to the governing bodies in every country to set those standards. Given the information we have today we completely stand behind the safety of our products and would not have our family members, friends, and consumers using a product that we thought was unsafe.
Prior to those dates we tested multiple methods and our results were inconsistent. For example, some results came back with non-detectable while the same sample tested using a different method showed detectable levels. We needed to better understand these inconsistencies and better educate ourselves before we could educate our consumers as to how this could happen. This is why we spent the past 10 months validating our methodology of testing using GC/FID and as we stated in a previous post we will present that data quarterly.
See answer above...
Five Pawns has no plans at the current time to come out with a max VG line. We are all a flavor company and do not want to sacrifice flavor for greater vapor production. That being said, we are launching a new line of liquids utilizing a PG alternative, which actually produces more vapor than PG and satisfies those who may have a PG sensitivity. These products will be released in the coming months.
We answered this before so I'm just going to cut and paste. See below...
Unfortunately yes, a small number of people received an inaccurate response to questions specifically relating to the presence of 2,3 butanedione (diacetyl) and / or 2,3 pentanedione (acetyl propionyl). After much investigation and having to scan all outgoing email from a customer service computer, we unknowingly found that responses sent prior to testing were being sent out between 5/27/14 and 10/19/15. Other than these small numbers of responses, we are not aware of any additional responses that occurred over the phone or otherwise. We feel terribly that these people were misinformed and have reached out to each and every one of them directly. Five Pawns has never advertised, marketed, or promoted the absence of these compounds in our liquids. We’ve only stated that we’ve never added diacetyl to our liquids. Unfortunately the diacetyl being detected was naturally occurring.
To clarify, we do not add AP in our lab when mixing our liquids. AP was added by our flavor providers and this was not disclosed to us prior to us testing for that specific compound. As you can see from our latest test results on our website we have always evolved our recipes to reduce the amount of this compound without sacrificing the experience people have come to know from Five Pawns. We've done this not because we believe there is any associated risk but because the market has been asking for it. Additionally, we are expanding our current product offering to include our new PG Alternative line, which will be void of any DA or AP to satisfy those consumers who may have a concern with these compounds.
See answer above...
1. We received our first test results on 5/27/14.
4. I cant give you an exact number but we've provided many with an accurate response.
Yes I vape and I am currently on an egoT with a clearomizer. JK...LOL... I typically switch from Castle Long, Grandmaster, and Queenside but currently I am vaping something that will be released soon. Oh soo good...
1. Yes, we have many things in the works.
2. We will definitely continue to offer our most popular flavors for those that desire them.
3. No plans to sell anything larger than 30mls at this time.
Additionally, we are expanding our current product offering to include our new PG Alternative line, which will be void of any DA or AP to satisfy those consumers who may have a concern with these compounds.
This is what I just don't understand and maybe I simply haven't researched enough. I haven't found any evidence PG would ever contain DA or AP, unless it is added. Is there a supplier who is adding DA and AP to PG? How does simply not using PG eliminate DA and AP? Does this mean the flavors with PG will continue to have DA and AP?
This is what I just don't understand and maybe I simply haven't researched enough. I haven't found any evidence PG would ever contain DA or AP, unless it is added. Is there a supplier who is adding DA and AP to PG? How does simply not using PG eliminate DA and AP? Does this mean the flavors with PG will continue to have DA and AP?
Exactly and thanks! I don't have to be a 5P customer to be concerned about the subject being discussed. But I honestly hope they come out with some flavors I might like as I'm very impressed with their open willingness to be crucified and still come back and show grace, humility, honesty, candor and concern for the vaping community as a whole. Yes I am!
Well said RB.
I'm anxious to try their new flavor when it comes out, and anxiously waiting for Black Flag Fallen to come out again. I have a good stock of castle long reserve and gambit in my vape closet.
I had high hopes for Gambit, but as I mentioned before, it's perhaps just too complex for me. Though I may just buy a bottle and give it a whirl in my KFL+ and Plasma Tank. Yes, I just might!
I came to this thread and was following it because i really wanted to hear 5P's side to the many questions and issues that have already been discussed and debated time and time again among forum members in other threads...but clearly this is not a discussion with 5P. If 5P really cared to set the record straight--- straight from the horses mouth, they would be more proactive in doing so and discouraging the self appointed ones from interfering with that process.
We are here to have a discussion with the vendor, not have other members debate whether a members questions are deserving of being asked or answered and telling them how wrong they are for asking questions that they feel are important to them. As a company, 5P should be stepping up and acknowledging that they will be doing the answering to the questions that they requested and invited to be asked of them.
When 5P truly wants to set the record straight from THEIR OWN MOUTHS and have a discussion with their customers where the discussion is not up for debate among members but with 5P, then i might listen again..til then i wash my hands of further wasting my time on this thread and with 5P. Looks like they are too busy to be bothered with their customers anyway...customers who are upset and was at least attempting to get their side of the story...oh well their loss again.
We are here to have a discussion with the vendor, not have other members debate whether a members questions are deserving of being asked or answered and telling them how wrong they are for asking questions that they feel are important to them. As a company, 5P should be stepping up and acknowledging that they will be doing the answering to the questions that they requested and invited to be asked of them.
When 5P truly wants to set the record straight from THEIR OWN MOUTHS and have a discussion with their customers where the discussion is not up for debate among members but with 5P, then i might listen again..til then i wash my hands of further wasting my time on this thread and with 5P. Looks like they are too busy to be bothered with their customers anyway...customers who are upset and was at least attempting to get their side of the story...oh well their loss again.
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