Colorado Senate Bill 14-018 to ban the sale, transfer or offer to sell nicotine products, including empty e-cigs, without seeing ID

[Jolly Roger]

I don't see a huge problem with this one. I would rather have the public opinion on the fact that it's hard/not possible for those without IDs to purchase tobacco/vapes, so that doesn't really bother me. As long as there aren't significant hardships for online sales, I'd vote for this bill.

 

[rothenbj]

I don't see a huge problem with this one. I would rather have the public opinion on the fact that it's hard/not possible for those without IDs to purchase tobacco/vapes, so that doesn't really bother me. As long as there aren't significant hardships for online sales, I'd vote for this bill.

How are you planning on showing you ID on the internet, Skype or some other method?

 

[MD_Boater]

Gee, thanks, Jolly... How about we flip that, and say that they only need to pass a law when there are no other alternatives. The last 5 times I went to a vape store, it looked like someone had just let a kindergarten class out. Seriously, I have never seen a minor in a Vape store unless their parents were with them. This law is NOT necessary. Its just regulators exercising their power. Pure and simple.

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[Sady]

This is so stupid - I am in CO - we already verify that we are over 21 when making on line purchases- one more govt over reach - you bet your bippy they are going to hear from me. The other thing here is passing your id info all over is opening the door wider for identity theft
In Co we do not all live in metro Denver - let Denver have their pot shops and let the rest of us vape and leave us alone. We need to take a hard stand on this - nothing is being marketed to kids that I have seen. Discipline the kids not punish the adults -

 

[Sady]

Think about this - if you order from fasttech you would send a copy of your ID to china - - -- identity theft for sure - caused by your govt - once again

 

[rothenbj]

Gee, thanks, Jolly... How about we flip that, and say that they only need to pass a law when there are no other alternatives. The last 5 times I went to a Vape store, it looked like someone had just let a kindergarten class out. Seriously, I have never seen a minor in a Vape store unless their parents were with them. This law is NOT necessary. Its just regulators exercising their power. Pure and simple.

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An interesting OT point. ECF's Rules of posting state "no discussion of illegal drugs". Since your post includes a drug that is illegal in most states, but not yours, is it legal for you to "say the forbidden word", but I cannot? Somehow George Carlin comes to mind at this moment or the expression, "that's like the pot calling the kettle black". This is the thought processes I get sitting here waiting for the sun to rise with sub zero temps and over a foot of snow awaiting me in my 100+ yard driveway.

 

[MD_Boater]

Me thinks you quoted the wrong post..

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[rothenbj]

Me thinks you're right. You know the one I meant. It was early and I was cold.

 

[Bkag]

Okay, so a little bit of an update. I'm not exactly the most versed person in law but after some more research and discussion I am thoroughly confused.

The current law, as it stands, due to the bill which Bill brought up is found here. Now, the new bill would amend that law from stating "cigarettes or tobacco products" to "nicotine products" (the words in caps in the new Senate Bill are the changes).

So overall, I'm still trying to figure out what exactly the goal of this new bill is and how/when "(II) Any electronic device that can be use to deliver nicotine to the person inhaling from the device, including but not limited to an electronic cigarette, cigar, cigarillo, or pipe." became a tobacco product/nicotine product

 

[Sady]

So I read this bill and am contacting our Senators and Reps - seems I did not have it right in my last post - this thing will harm our Vendors and there are some very good ones in the state- they seem to be the most affected by this - as it appears to be mostly affecting point of sale. If the thing separated mail order sales with a statement of age verification which we already have from store front ID required sales it would be one thing but appears it does not. Quite a short sighted bill I would say. We all need to get behind these vendors to defeat this bill - - and keep our vendors in business

 

[Bill Godshall]

Please remember that its a lot easier to kill legislation that to get bills enacted.

Vapers and vendors should just point out that CO already banned e-cig sales to minors in 2011, and that there's no evidence any online vendors have violated that law.

 

[snork]

In my draft I'm grappling with something.
Basically the bill is substituting the word "nicotine" for "tobacco".
Is it worth pointing out that there is no scientific proof, or anecdotal evidence, or common sense that would allow for those terms to be used interchangeably?

 

[Bill Godshall]

The Colorado Senate Health Cmte amended and approved SB 16
Original text of SB 16 is at
http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/cl...48A9A22387257C300006AE57?open&file=018_01.pdf

The amendment to SB 16 made by the Colorado Senate Health Cmte are at
http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/cl...48A9A22387257C300006AE57?open&file=018_01.pdf

It would be helpful if someone compares the original bill with the Senate Cmte approved amendments to SB 16 to see if it still impacts Internet sales.

Unless the purpose of this bill is to ban the sale of other new tobacco derived products (e.g. dissolvables, skin cream, tobacco water) to CO minors, I still don't understand the purpose of this bill (since CO already banned the sale of e-cigs to minors as per below).


The text of the 2011 CO law banning e-cig sales to minors is at
http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/cli...e=1016_enr.pdf

The legislative history for the 2011 bill banning e-cig sales to minors is at
http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/cli...e=1016_ren.pdf

 

[Placebo Effect]

I plugged the text of the two bills into this helpful tool and it appears no changes were made.

 

[Roger_Lafayette]

Something else appears to be going on in CO - HB14-1263:

http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/cl...3B5E3C08F8987257C630000974F/$FILE/1263_01.pdf

Note that the age is 21, and the term "tobacco products" is used throughout the legislation (w/o def'n). However I suspect that CO has already defined PVs as "tobacco products."

CBS Denver
2014/02/05/age-to-buy-cigarettes-could-soon-change-in-colorado/
suggests that Rep. Beth McCann is the sponsor, and she also appears as the sponsor of HB14-1263 - doesn't make sense to me that there would be two separate age-raising bills sponsored by the same legislator which address vaping and tobacco products.

Compare the language to SB14-018: http://www.leg.state.co.us/clics/cl...48A9A22387257C300006AE57?open&file=018_01.pdf ... looks pretty similar as far as the portion that would apparently ban online sales.

I think we are very likely talking about more than CO merely re-affirming the 18 y.o. age limit for vaping.

 

[Roger_Lafayette]

RE: SB14-081 Committee votes to ban new nicotine products for minors

Does this mean that it's ready for the house floor? I'm also unclear about what's going on here as far as why it's even needed to ban minor access, plus what impact (if any) it might have on online sales to adults.

 

[KODIAK (TM)]

RE: SB14-081 Committee votes to ban new nicotine products for minors

"A large number of teens who used e-cigarettes went on to become not just regular tobacco smokers but heavy smokers who were less likely to quit," said Dr. Wolk.

That is part of the motivation behind the new bill.

There's that "Large number" stat again. Next, throw in a few references about the kiddies and always make it sound really bad by using "Heavy smokers". (Who all somehow managed to convey to Wolk's that they were now hooked for life).

 

[Bill Godshall]

CO House/Senate approve bill (S 18) to extend tobacco and e-cig sales ban to minors to “nicotine products”, sent to governor
http://www.leg.state.co.us/Clics/CL...8A9A22387257C300006AE57?Open&file=018_ren.pdf

I post number 53 above, I mistakenly referred to SB 18 as SB 16.

Colorado already banned e-cig sales to minors, but this new law extends the ban to other new nicotine products (that aren't approved as drugs by FDA).