Alcohol in E-health e-cigarettes. Get a DUI?

[Strigoi]

Breathalyzers can be off by quite a bit. When I was arrested for DUI that was the reason why my lawyer won my DMV case for me (is separate from the criminal case in CA). The DA never filed charges on me, but the DMV could have still pulled my license for 3 months if I lost the case with them. If I remember correctly, breathalyzers can be off as much as 0.2x and have to be calibrated quite often. My lawyer had an ex-LAPD officer (over 20yrs with them) on the phone during this that specialized in this kind of stuff as a "witness" (for lack of a better word). The arresting officer also didn't fully watch me during the 15 minutes before giving me the "official" breathalyzer test (he was doing paperwork). It would have been my word vs. his on that though. The camera was only on me during that time.

Don't drink and drive. It cost me $5,000 to keep my license for 3 months. I did get one of the best lawyers in this area which I'm sure helped with the DA deciding not to file charges against me. They would have had a hard time with my case due to the circumstances (it would have gone to trial as well). I'm glad they didn't file charges because it would have gone from costing me $5,000 to $15,000+ depending on how much court time there was.

 

[Papa Lazarou]

Five beers (even over 5 hours) will put anyone way over the limit (especially in Canada where the limit is pretty much zero).

The beer accounts for the reading. But nevertheless, it might well be that breathalizers can detect VG and PG as alcohols (as though it was ethanol). I mention this as a general issue and not with regard to this particular case where it is irrelevant.

The limit for blood alcohol in Ontario seems the same as it is for the UK (80mg per 100ml blood, and it's the same in the US). And I'd have to agree, there is no way I would drink 5-6 beers if there was any chance of me needing to drive that night. If it was stronger beer, even the following morning might be risky. A "rule of thumb" I've seen is that the body metabolises around 1 'unit' (10ml) of alcohol per hour. A pint of 5% beer has around 28ml pure alcohol, so if that rule of thumb was accurate, it will take nearly 3 hours to metabolise just one pint of strong beer.

It does seem a bit dubious to convict just on the basis of a breath test though, as in the UK at least they are not considered reliable enough to gain a conviction (which is why if you fail a breath test they will arrest you and make you take a blood test). If you refuse the blood test you will be convicted anyway, for failing to provide a sample, but I''ve heard of lots of cases of positive breathalyser results becoming under the limit blood tests (and hence no charges).

 

[emus]

Since DUI is a felony and can gravely impact ones world, I would think the police would follow up all breathalyzer fails w/ a blood test.

 

[kinabaloo]

Er, what's a 'felony', for non-US folk ?

 

[Strigoi]

A DUI is not a felony in the US. A felony is a crime that has a minimum of 1 year of jail/prison time. A DUI can become a felony depending on the circumstances though.

Your run of the mill, I drank too much and got pulled over DUI will not be a felony.

 

[kinabaloo]

A DUI is not a felony in the US. A felony is a crime that has a minimum of 1 year of jail/prison time. A DUI can become a felony depending on the circumstances though.

Your run of the mill, I drank too much and got pulled over DUI will not be a felony.

So it just means 'serious' ?

Don't worry, it's all explained here : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felony

 

[emus]

My bad, DUI is not a felony.
Guess crime is not my strong point.

 

[madjack]

My bad, DUI is not a felony.
Guess crime is not my strong point.

...one usually isn't, multiples probably are...if depends on your state laws........................

 

[Fathomrock]

I sure hope not! Lol I've had a DUI and in california if you blow any amount thats DUI #2

 

[MustangSallie]

Wow, looks like my first post in this thread was way off base. This is an interesting topic, I'd love to see concrete evidence that using an e-cig would set off a breathalyzer.

 

[Spazmelda]

Glycols are alcohols. The modern detectors use IR to detect O-H bonds. I gave links already.

Yes, you did. Sorry, I missed it. I thought it was likely that the O-H bonds would set it off (perhaps more so, as the PG has two -OH's rather than the one that ethanol has), but I didn't have time to read about the method, so I didn't want to post speculation.

 

[Dark Jester]

Hi everyone: wow what a great community of people!

I will add a bit more to the story as this has me somewhat curious. My bud's 175, 6'1'. No he had not eaten at all almost all day. We had gone on a road trip and had maybe eaten at 4. and we were stopped at 2. We had just regular Canadian beer (the brand Canadian) started drinking around 6pm-12am, but we stopped drinking at 12 and we drove to get pizza at 2:30. We stopped and waited. He was smoking the e-cigs all night.

HERES THE QUESTION: Everyone keeps talkign about how an electric cigarette does not get you drunk. I 100% understand that. That is not the issue. The issue is he was not arrested for being drunk (it's when you are physically or you seem impared, i.e. slur of speech, incoherent etc) it was for being above the limit of .08 - i.e. the cops even said he did not seem drunk.

SO THE QUESTION IS: To what degree it a breathalyzer reads any type of alcohol - assuming again he had smoked two full (20 cartridges) that day which he did, to what degree would/could that affect it? Where's a chemist when you need one?

So i just followed this link: Blood Alcohol Calculator Check Yourself Before You Wreck Yourself which someone gave regarding calculating alcohol: i even went higher and put 6 just in case I counted wrong. We were drinking from 7-12 - but i put 4 hours instead of 5 hours just to see. if i am right and i am 99% sure we had literally 5 beers for 5 hours - he'd have an alohol level of 0.05ish if i up to 6 beers in 4 hours he'd still only be at 0.071 which is far far far below being over 1.00 level.

Enter it yourself: 6 beers, 175lbs, male, 5 hours.

Guys something seems wrong here. I'm worried now that people may be overlooking the idea of breathalyzers with e-cigs. time to do research...i'll post what i find.

How big were the 5 beers? 12 ounce cans, 16-24 ounce mugs? Alcohol content of the beer?

5 cans of Budweiser over 4 or 5 hours might not put him over the limit, but he could still easily blow a .05 and probably shouldn't be driving. 5 20-ounce mugs could easily go over the limit. And if it was stronger beer than budweiser (very possible), even 5 cans could go over the limit.

Not saying the vape didn't contribute to the reading cause nobody seems to know that, but he would have definitely blown an alcohol content whether he was vaping or not. And since everyone's body is different, it is conceivable that he was over the limit just on the beer alone.

Most people hovering around 1.0 BAC don't show a lot of signs of being drunk. A lot probably wouldn't even feel a buzz. They intentionally put the limit under the 'drunk' mark though so they don't have people skating the line.

Short of finding a cop willing to do the Vape/Breathalyzer test (And willing to testify to the results in court), I think your buddy is out of luck on this one.

 

[Baldr]

Most people hovering around 1.0 BAC don't show a lot of signs of being drunk. A lot probably wouldn't even feel a buzz. They intentionally put the limit under the 'drunk' mark though so they don't have people skating the line.

Nobody alive has ever blown a 1.0.

There are several reasons the limit is so low. It's good profit for the government, for one. And the "MADD" folks would much prefer prohibition. Since they can't get it, they pretend that drinking one beer and driving home makes you no different than a serial killer.

 

[Uncle Willie]

a beer an hour is a guideline .. every metabolism is different ..

 

[Dark Jester]

Nobody alive has ever blown a 1.0.

There are several reasons the limit is so low. It's good profit for the government, for one. And the "MADD" folks would much prefer prohibition. Since they can't get it, they pretend that drinking one beer and driving home makes you no different than a serial killer.

I meant .10 And having 1 beer with dinner out at a restaurant is not going to put you over the limit. It's the guys who try to squeeze in a 6-pack with dinner and a couple shots afterwords, think they're ok, and end up killing someone that MADD doesn't like.

Seriously these days, if you've been drinking, don't f'kin drive. How hard is that to comprehend, yet new DUI arrests are made all over the country on a daily basis. Apparently this incredibly simple concept escapes those people.

I (and probably most other people) don't have any problem with someone getting completely plowed however often they want to. Take a dang cab and don't get behind the wheel. Very simple. Would anyone here be ok with their doctor having 5 'beers' in the 4 hours leading up to your major surgery? Maybe squeeze in a couple shots of tequila too? I doubt it.

 

[Nunnster]

I would suggest someone get Amazon.com: Mini Key Chain Personal Breathalyzer: Home & Garden or similar and test the theory out. I used to have a cheaper one on my keys that I would get smashed and blow into to see how high I could get it before I passed out. (I DO NOT recommend that, but I was a party animal and as I have said before, I have made bad choices in life) It would be interesting if you could prove them inaccurate with ecigs. Your friend could take it to court and win. "beyond a reasonable doubt" You show that it is possible that eicgs can make you blow positive then that is a doubt.

 

[4am]

It doesn't seem right to me, but everyone's body metabolizes alcohol differently. The alcohol content of the beer comes into play. However, a blood test should have been requested, as often breathalyzers are not maintained as they should be. However, I would not recommend driving under ANY amount of alcohol. If I've had even one, I won't drive. After a few DUI's, I learned that it is just not a good idea to drive until I've had a full night's rest and at least 6-8 hours since my last drink (depending on how much I drank). Living in Colorado where there is zero tolerance, it's been beaten into me.

Good luck to your buddy.

 

[sweetmeat]

I would suggest someone get Amazon.com: Mini Key Chain Personal Breathalyzer: Home & Garden or similar and test the theory out. I used to have a cheaper one on my keys that I would get smashed and blow into to see how high I could get it before I passed out. (I DO NOT recommend that, but I was a party animal and as I have said before, I have made bad choices in life) It would be interesting if you could prove them inaccurate with ecigs. Your friend could take it to court and win. "beyond a reasonable doubt" You show that it is possible that eicgs can make you blow positive then that is a doubt.

I second this, also they sell disposable one use breathalyzer tests here in pharmacies.
Even better though take a cab!!!!! I have a childhood friend who was riding her bike and was hit by a drunk driver. I don't think he was very drunk, but still impaired. Sadly she suffered some brain damage and will never be the same. Why take the chance?

 

[bassthumper]

Point is, don't drink and drive. PERIOD.
Also, HOW can it even POSSIBLY pick up the PG or VG, PGA, etc to even REGISTER the darn thing? Everyone's talking as if he took a HUGE RIP OFF HIS PV AND BLEW IT INTO THE BREATHALYZER...

I don't see it happening and it looks like your buddy is just looking for a way to beat the case. Truth is, drinking and then driving is STUPID and it has KILLED SEVERAL ppl I know. Maybe he'll learn something from this....

but to blame ecigs for this could potentially be a very bad thing for all of us...

 

[CallTheMouse]

Very interesting topic. Seeing this is my first post I thought it might fit here. First off I don't drink. Second, I am a former fire chief of 21 yrs and worked closely with our local police department. I started using e-Cigs about 2 weeks ago and have mixed some of my own e-juice adding about 10%, 100 proof vodka to the mix to increase the throat hit. I think I will have to see if one of our police officers would be willing to do a breathalyzer test on me to see if it registers an unusual level of alcohol. It would not be scientific but would be interesting what shows up. I do know our police department has to calibrate the equipment daily for purposes of court issues. If I can have it done I will follow up. I just hope it doesn't register high or I will be asking for a ride home from the police department.