APV Researching

[Blood_of_Adonis]

Hi all!

I'm about to (hopefully) get my first Genesis. My next move, I think, is going to be getting new battery hardware.

I'm not exactly sure what I want, though, so I thought I would ask those with experience for some guidance.

A little background. I started off with blu and 510s, graduated to an ego and now I kick around with an E-Power 14650. I'm looking to go mechanical (at least, towards), possibly with VV. I've heard and read that Lavatubes are decent, and now that more people are rebranding them the price is starting to come down (price is somewhat of a consideration- i mean, I'd like something sooner than later, but I can save up, too).

Is there something I can get that uses the same 14650s I have now? How good is it? (1/10- 10 being legends like the Katana or Zenesis)

Another consideration is I don't want to carry a friggin' Mag-Lite around. Something that can go in my pocket while I'm active would be nice, and from the looks, the Lavatube (std) might be bigger than I'm looking for. Mini might work, though.

Welp- guide me, I am your vessel.

 

[Blood_of_Adonis]

I guess what I'm asking for most is people's experiences with Items compared to "lower end" units like my e-power, or egos, and other mods and APVs if you have that ability.

Thanks!

 

[wseternmd]

I am no expert by any means, but I can tell you that currently my fav set up is my 1000 mah ego twist. I have had zero problems with it the battery time is good enough for me about 11 hours give or take. I also like my joyetech e power 18650. But for VV the twist is it for me. By the way I rarely go over 4.2 or 4.3 so it works great for me. I also use a mom and pop vapor shop mini sub tank with a boge 2.0 cardo. Hope it helps

Josh

 

[Blood_of_Adonis]

I would prefer to stay away from proprietary batteries. Having a unit that I can take the battery out of is pretty important to me, as it saves more in the long run. I wouldn't imagine going over 4.8v myself, and would probably hover around 4.2, but my thoughts are that it would be good having VV for two main reasons:

1) I get random stuff sometimes. Frequently I don't know what resistance value it's going to have until I hook it up to my meter. I once came into a pack of HV attys, for example. Totally free, but completely useless to me. OR sometimes I want to hedge back a little when I'm using a 1.7carto.

2) With a genesis atty, (at least initially) the coils aren't going to be perfect, so minor adjustments would be in order. Then, when I get good at that, playing with different resistance wire and voltage could be fun.

Maybe I should be asking in the modders forum instead...just thinking out loud

 

[MickeyRat]

Well you can have all mechanical or you can have VV but, you can't really have both. For all mechanical, the two I'd look at are the legacy and the silver bullet. I prefer the legacy myself. Both of those can take an extension so you can add a kick with an 18650 and that's what I'd do.

 

[Blood_of_Adonis]

Thanks Mickey!

Do you have a recommendation for VV?

 

[Eddie.Willers]

Did you look at the Lavatube Mini - smaller size, if you want to avoid that, "Why are you sucking your Maglight?" look.

 

[MickeyRat]

Thanks Mickey!

Do you have a recommendation for VV?

I have to explain how I think of VV before I answer. For me, VV is like salting your food. You do it to make it taste better. You don't analyze or measure. You do it to taste. You can get VVs that have fancy meters and menus like the Provari or the Vmax or even the Lavatube. However, I don't see why I'd ever use them. A simple knob that I can find with my eyes closed is all I want. So, I prefer the Buzz Pro.

If there was a good stainless steel VV mod that just had a knob, I'd be all over it but, I don't know of one.

If you can stand a plastic box, you might want to look at the SmokTek Varicool. You can't beat the function for the price.

 

[Blood_of_Adonis]

Thanks again, Mickey!

I also don't need a "fancy" readout. I understand some readouts (Provari, I think, and Darwin) tell you volts, ohms, watts and something else or something. I don't need all that. But I would like to know without whipping out my voltmeter what I'm vaping at. I don't mind plastic either, on principal, but I do have reservations about smoktek. I had some difficulties with Rob when I got my e-power kit and the switch was bum. It ended up resolving itself, but it was a major headache. Though, if I were to go there for a VV, I might consider the Ovale V8.

Also, I know it's a tad ridiculous- but I still like the lights. If my LED lights but the atty doesn't fire, I know roughly where the problem is. If the LED doesn't light, same.


TO ALL:
Let's go more towards the mechanical side. I know some Mods have a capacity for stacking two smaller batteries to up the voltage. These are fixed voltage, to my understanding, so you could have, say, a 18650 at '3.7', or two 18350s at '5' or '6' (sometimes with extender). My question is which of these mods, in your opinion, works best, and why?

If i were to get a fully mechanical mod that I could stack in, would I need 3v batteries to get 6v? or is there a way I can get about 5v from that? I know there are a lot of "5v" mods out there, but if I go in the direction of mechanical first, I would like to go full on mechanical, so electronic step-downs aren't applicable here (i think).

Thanks again, everyone!

 

[MickeyRat]

One last word on meters. Then on to mechanicals. I don't care what the numbers are most of the time. Taste is all I care about. However, I do want to know if I'm going higher or lower than normal. That's why I specifically said a knob. You can tell by the position when things are off. Otherwise an up/down button would do it. I do occasionally take a meter to it when I'm using a new device just out of curiosity or when things seem off but, that's the only time. For me, a full time meter would just be in the way.

As for mechanicals, anything mechanical that can take an 18650 can take two CR132As for 7.2V. There are also LiFePo CR123A 3V batteries. So, with those you can go 6V. There is an 18650 NiMH 4.8V battery that should work. Make sure you get the right charger for what you use.

All of the above will work in a Legacy or a Silver Bullet. will work with most if not all of the above. A lot of people say the switch won't take it but, I've used a Bolt with some of the above combinations. So, that would be a low cost option.

 

[proggieus]

I don't care for the Silver Bullet, and it is not an all mechanical mod, it has wires and solder joints which can fail. Mine did.

If you want all mechanical look at either the super t manufacturing Precis or Siam Cube either can be used with a Kick for VV with a 18500 battery. I have the précis and i love it. I have a Mini cube on its way. The précis is a little more $ but has a lifetime warranty.

 

[Blood_of_Adonis]

Proggieus-
How do you mean kick? From my understanding, the maximum output of a single liion 18500 (or any liion cell) would be 4.2v. Do you mean stacking two of them with an extender tube? Cause I think that would be rather long...

 

[Blood_of_Adonis]

As for mechanicals, anything mechanical that can take an 18650 can take two CR132As for 7.2V. There are also LiFePo CR123A 3V batteries. So, with those you can go 6V. There is an 18650 NiMH 4.8V battery that should work. Make sure you get the right charger for what you use.

the NiHM 4.8- that should work on basically anything without an IC that will accept it's dimensions, right? If so, that might be a simple cheap solution for me on the mechanical side. I have a switch for my e-power 14650 that I sawed open when it died and replaced the IC/switch with a 2amp tactile, so aside from the positive wire and the ground leg, it's "mechanical". I think I saw a NiMH 14650 for a Mako somewhere...

Maybe I could figure a way to make my jimmied switch fully mechanical, too.

Back to VV for a sec, do you have any experience with the Ovale V8 I mentioned from the smoktek site? they don't have any reviews on it there.

 

[MickeyRat]

Proggieus-
How do you mean kick? From my understanding, the maximum output of a single liion 18500 (or any liion cell) would be 4.2v. Do you mean stacking two of them with an extender tube? Cause I think that would be rather long...

A kick is a device that fits in the battery compartment on the positive end of the battery. It converts the device to a variable wattage device. Some devices like the Legacy, Silver Bullet, Siam Cube, and Bolt can extend to take a kick with an 18650. However, you can use it in any device that will take an 18650 by using an 18490 or 18500 battery along with it.

Since you don't know what a kick is, you probably don't know what variable wattage is. Watts are the energy used by the device. The Bolt will detect the resistance of what you put on the device and adjust the voltage to keep the watts constant. In theory that means you get the same experience no matter what you put on it. It can boost the voltage beyond what the battery provides.

My own experience says that it works great to adjust to the changes in an atomizer as it wears. So, once you get it adjusted, it works great as long as you don't change to a different type of atty. However, if you go from say a 2.5 ohm 901 to a 1.7 ohm 306, you'll probably find you need some adjustment and it's not that easy to adjust. It also goes through batteries pretty quickly.

I need to warn you about that tactile switch. It's only a matter of time till it fails. Most tactile switches are rated at 500 milliamps. That's not enough for this application. If you're really good at soldering, there are small mosfets that you can put in along with it that would address this but, don't ask me to recommend one.

I've never used an Ovale V8 but, I think it's fine as long as you understand it's limitations. I believe it's limited to 2.5A. That means with a 1.5 ohm DC carto you won't be able to go over 3.75V. If you stay between 2 and 3 ohms, you might be happy with it. I doubt it'll hold up as well as some. One thing to warn you about because I've seen a few posts like this. If you try to turn the voltage up beyond what it can handle on amps a Buzz Pro or a Provari, will shut down. On a Lavatube or a Twist, it'll keep working and provide what it can. It just won't be the voltage you set. So, those devices can fool you into believing you're vaping a 1.5 ohm DC at 4.5V when you really aren't. I don't know for sure what the Ovale will do but, I'll bet it'll do what the Lavatube and Twist do.

 

[alexvander123]

Ive had my legacy since thursday and I absolutly love it. got it kicked and its nice not having to worry about what Ohm atty i throw in it. just juice up and go. I also use the 18490s without the extender tube to keep the size down.

 

[Blood_of_Adonis]

That tactile switch was just because it was what i had on hand, but it's actually rated for 1.5A. the only down side it it sticks out like a sore thumb, and soldering the seam back together on the assembly makes it look...well, ugly.

Variable wattage sounds like it might be an option. I'll have to look into that more. (Oh, I see... hadn't read this yet: http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/e-cigarette-apv-reviews/284473-kick-evolv.html) I've seen the term "kick" thrown around for a while now, and thought it was just "kick" in the sense of adding the the running time, not the power. Interesting.

I think the Ovale V8 goes up to "4.8v". At 3.7v-4v, I don't really like lower than 1.7 ohms anyway, so that might be a good cheap option to see if I really need/want VV. It's only about $10 more than a Twist, and I can use batteries I already have.

Thanks for all the patience and information guys. You rock!

 

[MickeyRat]

That tactile switch was just because it was what i had on hand, but it's actually rated for 1.5A. the only down side it it sticks out like a sore thumb, and soldering the seam back together on the assembly makes it look...well, ugly.

It's still going to be a problem eventually. At 3.7V a 1.7 ohm resistance 2.17A.

 

[iamtumus]

i've been looking at the alloy XL lately...
it's all mechanical with a bottom button, it can use an 18650 for 3.7v or 2 rcr 123a's for 6v...
plus it has a nice matte metallic look to it and it looks sweet

 

[grruss]

To clarify: We all vape with watts. The reason you increase the voltage on a higher resistance atty is to get to the same wattage as a lower resistance atty with lower volts. Watts=volts squared/ohms

8 watts=4 volts*4 volts/2 ohms

8.33 watts=5 volts*5 volts/3 ohms

Sound familiar? Sweet spot for most is somewhere in the 8-10 watt range. So, the reason we all like vv devices is because we want to vary the watts. If you want a variable voltage device, the reason you want it is because you want to vary the watts, whether you realize it or not.

If you want a mechanical switch, I think the Precise+ or the Legacy are about as good as you can do. Precise is pricey because of rhodium contacts. I went with the Legacy.

Now, the Kick. Just do it. I am seriously considering selling my Provari. I thought I had reached vaping Nirvana with it. I had, as long as I didn't change anything. But as long as I wanted to stay around 8-10 watts, I had to punch that little button somewhere between 15-27 times whenever I changed to a different setup. The kick is great because however you setup your pv, you get the same vape. And, the kick gives you regulated voltage over the life of the battery. As the battery dies, voltage declines. Not with the kick. If you have a 2 ohm atty, and set it at eight watts, you get four volts until the battery dies. So not only do you get variable wattage (the only number that really counts) you get power regulation.

So here is my recommendation for you. Get a Legacy and a Kick. The Legacy is available in several sizes, you decide that. The 18650 version accommodates an 18490 and a Kick very nicely. That's what I did. It cost less than my Provari, which is collecting dust right now.

 

[MickeyRat]

So here is my recommendation for you. Get a Legacy and a Kick. The Legacy is available in several sizes, you decide that. The 18650 version accommodates an 18490 and a Kick very nicely. That's what I did. It cost less than my Provari, which is collecting dust right now.

I have two qualifications on this one. The kick is great and if you vape with pretty much the same configuration, it'll keep things nice and consistent. However, I had set up a kick for a 901 but, one day I needed to use it with the 306 I happened to be playing with. Despite what a lot of people say, watts aren't everything. I really wanted turn it down a little. However, it's a bit of a pain to do that with a kick. Was only going to use it for a couple hours and I was going back to the 901. So to avoid the hassle, I kept it flooded. However, if you are going to switch around, the kick might not be for you.

The only other thing I don't care for is it really cuts into the battery life.