AW protected IC vs AW non protected IMR

[Maka]

So using a Mech mod, I see the reviewers using the 'red' AW non protected IMR batteries without using a kick or a 2cent fuse.
When I bought my Mech Mod I also bought AW Protected IC battieries as I thought these were the best to use in a Mech Mod.

So now I am confused why reviewers always use the 'red' AW non potected IMR batteries.
Is there a difference in performance over the AW IMR and AW IC ones?
Are these ok to use without a kick or fuse?
Are these ones better?
How dangerous is it to use these ones over the AW Protected IC ones?

 

[Racehorse]

So using a Mech Mod, I see the reviewers using the 'red' AW non protected IMR batteries without using a kick or a 2cent fuse.
When I bought my Mech Mod I also bought AW Protected IC battieries as I thought these were the best to use in a Mech Mod.

Without knowing what mod you are using, and requirements the mod and delivery device you are using are placing on the battery, that is an impossible question to answer.

ALWAYS go with the battery recommended by the manufacturer or vendor of your mod.

A provape-1 for instance, would use protecteds. A provari uses IMR because it's VV and places high demand for short bursts on your batts, etc. It all depends on the situation, you see? And how the mod was built to behave, how it was designed to handle shorts and problems, etc.

 

[Maka]

Without knowing what mod you are using, and requirements the mod and delivery device you are using are placing on the battery, that is an impossible question to answer.

ALWAYS go with the battery recommended by the manufacturer or vendor of your mod.

A provape-1 for instance, would use protecteds. A provari uses IMR because it's VV and places high demand for short bursts on your batts, etc. It all depends on the situation, you see? And how the mod was built to behave, how it was designed to handle shorts and problems, etc.

Sigelei Telescope Model 19
Sigelei Telescope Model 20

 

[Maka]

I think I found my answer:

Use only protected batteries or better yet, use safe chemistry batteries
In our market today, there are many kinds of batteries that can be used in a mechanical mod.

Two most popular battery types used in mods are ICR (LiCo02) and IMR(LiMn) / IMR hybrids. Both of these are lithium-ion (Li-ion) batteries.

In terms of use, technically, any of these can be used on any device that requires a 3.7volt power source, including your mechanical mods. But not all are suitable.

In terms of safety the difference between the two (ICR and IMR) is the chemical composition in these batteries. ICR can catch fire at a faster rate than IMRs because they are simply more combustible. ICR are also generally known to stress more easily than IMR.

There are two types of ICR batteries, protected and unprotected. Never use unprotected ICR in any mechanical mod as it does not have any safety mechanism in them.

Protected ICR batteries have a basic layer of protection that prevents your batteries from shorts and over discharge problems. Protected ICR with a C rating of 2 amps or more can be used in mechanical mods.

IMRs however, has a more stabler chemistry, and won't likely to catch fire or explode as easily as an ICR can. They do not require protection, and often sold without it. These are also suitable for mechanical mods.

You may ask, what is better an IMR battery or an protected ICR battery?

The general consensus in the vaping community is that when in doubt, IMR is better for mechanical mods. The reasoning is, although IMR has no protection circuit, by nature of their chemical composition, they are safer than ICR with a protection circuit. Protected ICR batteries have a history of their protection system failing, specially with the cheaper ones. In fact, we have read more incidents of cheaper protected ICR batteries venting flames than IMRs.

An analogy to this is that a protected ICR is like a gun with the safety switch turned on, and an IMR is a gun someone filled with rubber bullets. Both guns can hurt but one is more hazardous.

Mechanical Mod Proper Usage Guide

 

[Fury83]

Short answer, IMR's for mechs. Get good imr's and a good charger. Use a vapesafe if it fits and makes you feel better but unless you are using rba's there is really not a need.

Also, don't crank your carto/atty down super tight, you can crush the insulator in the atty...easiest way to a short.

 

[zoiDman]

...

So now I am confused why reviewers always use the 'red' AW non potected IMR batteries.
Is there a difference in performance over the AW IMR and AW IC ones?
Are these ok to use without a kick or fuse?
Are these ones better?
How dangerous is it to use these ones over the AW Protected IC ones?

A lot of this Depends on How Many Amps you are going to ask the Battery to Provide.

What would be a Typical Voltage you set your Device to? Or that it Outputs. And what would be a Typical Ohm of the Atty/Clearo/Tank that you screw onto the Device?

 

[SDave1969]

I found that protected batteries fit in my Anodized Bolt, but in nothing else I have. I use IMR in everything except the bolt, although I don't use it much since I have too many mods...

 

[QuikWgn]

IMR is 'safe chemistry'. It will not flame/vent if it hapens to short out. Protected Li-Ion's have a small failsafe/protection piece between the negative battery connection and what you actually see on the bottom of the battery that is supposed to fail if they are shorted to prevent venting. The problem is this piece can be damaged if you overtighten the mod and start to see the negative connecting start to dish inward. This can damage the failsafe and circumvent the protection features. The 'failsafe' piece also tends to make the battery a smidge longer than the non-protected versions and make them not fit some mods with tight tolerances. This was especially common when the GGTB's were really popular. Generally people like the red AW IMR's because AW has VERY GOOD quality control compared to some cheaper brands and they also have a higher amp discharge limit as they were originally meant for high-lumen compact flashlights that pull a lot of amps.

This explains it well...

http://www.lygte-info.dk/info/battery protection UK.html

 

[Baditude]

Ever since I had a "protected" Trustfire vent and melt in a mechanical from a hard-short, I've used only AW IMR in both my regulated and unregulated mods. I would not use any battery that has the word "fire" in it, and I would strongly suggest using IMR batteries only. IMR safe chemistry batteries are just a bettery and safer battery all around. I wouldn't be swayed by the higher mAh ratings of the protected class, it's not worth your safety in the long run.

 

[PinoyBoy]

Was your mech mod still usable after the melt down? I've had a few batteries leak whitish crusty substance on some of my flashlights. I threw the bats away of course, but the light was somewhat different from then on.

 

[Racehorse]

Maka,
There is no "safe" battery, ultimate safety lies with the user, and understanding battery safety, etc.

Oldie but goodie from Rolygate and others, I have this saved in my subscriptions. Hope this helps you.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/battery-issues/254690-protected-batteries-vs-imr-safety.html

In VV mods, with cirucuitry, the protection circuitry in the mod itself makes using IMRs better, since IMRs are able to deliver the higher amps that VV demands.

In straight mechanical mod, if the spring fails to collapse, etc. keep in mind that the IMR battery is going to just "keep going". (I use mechanical REOs, and the spring does indeed collapse, thus breaking the circuit to the battery, so I use IMRs in there, with no worries).

HOwever, IMRs do not have any cells in them that are going to shut down. This is why some mechanical mod makers tell you to use Protected batts, because the circuitry in the battery itself shuts down (healthy battery that is), since in a mechanical mod there is no cirucuitry in the mod itself to "control" these things. Read #30 here: (of course, even this relies on your battery being a healthy protected, one in which the protection cells actually work. )


http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/battery-issues/254690-protected-batteries-vs-imr-safety.html

If you want the best of all worlds, buy
top notch batteries
top notch charger
multimeter and USE IT before firing any delivery device on your mod
safety fuse to add another layer of protection to your mod and battery
understanding the mod that you bought, how it works

 

[QuikWgn]

^QFT A lot of people balk at buying a $50 charger like the PILA (which I own). My philosophy is why charge a $15 battery for a $200 mod on a $7 chinese charger made by a 12 year old for $.30 an hour.

 

[Flyer]

^QFT A lot of people balk at buying a $50 charger like the PILA (which I own). My philosophy is why charge a $15 battery for a $200 mod on a $7 chinese charger made by a 12 year old for $.30 an hour.

I'm sorry, but that makes no sense whatsoever. No one in China is working for #.30 per hour in a a technical capacity. Chinese manufacturers may indeed seek the lowest costs but their technology is no where near what you suggest.

 

[Baditude]

I'm sorry, but that makes no sense whatsoever. No one in China is working for #.30 per hour in a technical capacity. Chinese manufacturers may indeed seek the lowest costs but their technology is no where near what you suggest.

What you state is your own opinion. What I think the poster was getting at was not so much the "techology", but "quality control" and "quality of parts" of China manufacturing as a whole.

I have chatted in person for literally hours with one of the most successful and very first online e-cig vendors in the business. One reason that quality control in China is so poor is because every year after the Chinese New Year, the majority of employees (farm workers) fail to return to work and a brand new group has to be trained to do their jobs. Quality and production suffer from this, depending upon what percent of workers do return. A couple of manufacturers have more success in retaining their previous employees, and their products' quality and production does not seem to suffer as a result from this.

I recently purchased an Xtar MP2 battery charger whose lights looked weird when attempting to charge a battery. Long story short, whoever constructed this charger reversed the polarity wiring -- if I put the battery in "backwards" the lights worked as they were supposed to and the charger would charge the battery. It probably would have been safe to use knowing this information, but I pay good money for stuff to work correctly out of the box. I sent it back to the vendor in exchange for a properly working unit. I thought about the above story about new factory workers after the Chinese New Year and figured this charger was made by one of the new workers. Regardless, this charger obviously did not get checked by the manufacturer's quality control people or someone wasn't doing their job.
___

Apparently the above vendor that has shared his thoughts with me is not alone in his feelings about Chinese quality control. The manufacturers of the Provari decided to make it here in the US after being disappointed in the quality control of Chinese manufacturers:

"ProVape designs and manufactures right here in the USA. Why did you decide to manufacture here instead of China where most eCig products are made?

There are two reasons. The first was that we wanted to make sure we had full control over the quality and production of the device. Chinese manufacturers are known for inconsistent quality. They often cut corners to save costs and send the customer defective goods. The second reason was that we were tired of seeing manufacturing jobs sent overseas. We were in a position to do something about it, so we did. Lead by example. So, by producing everything here in the USA not only are we supporting US companies and American workers but we are also able to closely monitor production. This allows us to maintain a standard of building the best products available." - The ProVape Team Interview | Spinfuel Magazine

____

And by the way, I also own the Italian-made Pila charger. Undoubtedly, it has been one of the best chargers around for years based on reviews, bench tests, and owner recommendations. Mine has been worth every penny I spent on mine a year ago. It is hands down my favorite charger over my Xtar and Nitecore models.

 

[QuikWgn]

I'm sorry, but that makes no sense whatsoever. No one in China is working for #.30 per hour in a a technical capacity. Chinese manufacturers may indeed seek the lowest costs but their technology is no where near what you suggest.

I have torn apart dozens of Trustfire and other common chargers and seen soldering and boards that a chimpanzee could have done better. The PILA'S are quality units and you can search the candle power and other hardcore flashlight forums and find hundreds if not more positive reviews of the unit and I can't ever recall seeing any one have a negative opinion or unit that was DOA etc.

 

[hcmh]

The red AW IMR batteries seem to hold a charge better for me. I also notice my IMR batteries charge to 4.2v while the black AW protected ones have a max charge of 4.16v