Bought my first clone.... Why do I feel so guilty!?

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So I purchased the Caravela Clone from fastech and I really wasn't expecting too much, but for $21 for 3 tubes, what the hell! I have to say, I have been absolutely blown away by the build quality and performance from this thing! BEST $21 I've ever spent! The only problem is, I feel an inescapable sense of guilt whenever I pick the damn thing up. When they say "Clone" they really aren't kidding! My intention is not to start a, clone debate, but I just have a hard time buying something so dirt cheap with all of the original manufacturers markings all over it. It really is a shame that these things are being sold out in the open, blatantly ripping off the original designer. I can certainly afford an original Caravela, but I can't even get my name on the waiting list, let alone actually get the privilege of using one. I'm wondering if anyone else out there has purchased one of these and what your impressions might be?

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Dac311

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There's a lot of debate of clones are actually just Chinese version made from the spec of the original maker. Some think that the original designers are selling the designs to
Chinese companies and getting money on both ends. Keep the USA made demand high, but get money on the back end of Chinese made. The reason they think this is because of how quickly clones come to market. There was one instance where the clone was on the market before the original, but somehow the clone was a spot on replica. I wouldn't sweat it. If you can't get on the waiting list, then whoever is making obviously isn't hurting.

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TaylorPlayer

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I would say if the copy was as good, don't worry. When I have seen Chinese built Gibson guitar fakes, it does bother me. The build quality is not near as good but for an uneducated buyer, they may end up paying Gibson prices for a Chinese "Fibson" and not even know they bought a VERY inferior product. The fakes are getting much better in terms of how they look. In the past you could spot a fake a mile away, but today they are very close to the original other than in build quality, tone and playability. Gibson is very proactive in trying to shut down the cloners.

I don't know anything about Ecig fakes or clones, but if the manufacturer is on board, I see no problem owning one.
 

Myrany

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I have clones and I have originals of many devices. I tend to use the clone purchase to decide if I want to hunt down an original.

Example: I just received my Kayfun Lite clone from fasttech. I wasn't sure I was going to like this type of Rebuildable tank atty. Now that I have it and used it I am saving vape budget for an original. I did the same with my IGO-Ls.

I look at it as a cheap way to test and see if I really want to drop $100 on an atty or not.
 

Rosco P. Coltrane

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never feel bad...

Consumers are the only party that matters. Their demand will always be met. If they demand a cheaper product that works just as well, someone will find a way to meet that demand and profit doing it.

If a manufacturer comes up with a design that is instantly ripped off they still have the advantage. They have the ability to create when all anyone else can do is copy. If those same manufactures cannot meet demand, or would like unreasonable amounts of money for a product they will not sell as many. We are talking about metal tubes here not spacecraft or even guitars. If Atmomixani wanted to dominate the market they could sell their products for half or less and still make a profit. you know how we know that to be true...cause the cloners can!

if you could by an original Nemi for not much more then the clone would you? Cloning would not happen if the originals were not charging a premium well past the point of value for the money spent. Clones who's build quality was so much lower then the original would not succeed in the market for very long.


ETA

I felt a little ripped of when i paid for a Kayfun only to see a clone who's quality was similar (granted not as good) but similar enough.
 
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Technohydra

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While the costs on the originals is sometimes insane, they have an expense that the cloners don't; R&D. You can use a CMM to take dimensional readings on almost anything and generate a quick CAD file that will allow you to replicate it, basically in a matter of hours (or minutes!). But you have to pay for design work, trial and error, testing, and materials on an original. And all of that money is non-returned investments until you start selling finished final version products. So the manufacturers have to recover that cost via price.

Now, is the price only for profitability, or is there some dig there? Without seeing the books of each company, I can't tell you that. What I can tell you is that an engineering effort, machining trials, usage trials, and final approval processes all cost a good deal of money, whereas having a CAD-savvy machinist take some CMM measurements, specify the threads, spec a parts and materials list, scan images of logos, etc. is relatively cheap, and much cheaper in China than here. Takes about an 8 hour day to finalize the design and make a first prototype on a CNC machining rig. Thousands of dollars in R&D or less than $250 in CAD and CNC. Weeks or months or work, or less than a day (a week at worst) of measuring and tweaking. There is a reason that China could take a $300 device and make it profitably for a $30 return; the burden of the initial investment is null and void to them, they don't have one to worry about.

Now let's put this in perspective; do you ..... about if the Sara Lee box of cake mix you just bought is a clone of the Betty Crocker box right down the shelf? .... no, you just buy what you want, and you don't feel an ounce of guilt while you're making your ... bigger with each bite. Do you feel guilty for learning how to make your favorite food cheaper at home, rather than go to the restaurant you were ordering it from? .... no, you just eat more vindaloo. Would you feel bad about building your own PC, which happens to have almost the exact same specs as one that is on the market? .... no, you just surf ECF while blasting out thunderheads.

Bottom line on clones. You are probably getting a slightly lower quality product, but by and large, that difference is in an aspect that will never matter to you as a user. My Trident clone is a bit more cheaply made than my original, but I use the clone more often, owing to differences in the airhole sizes. That being said, it's the difference between 303 and 304 stainless steel, which makes no difference to me, and not having a perfect finish...I am going to beat my atty up anyways. Now I just don't have to feel bad about ruining a mirror finish that I never had anyways. Remember, this is capitalism, not alchemy. We don't have to abide by the laws of equivalency. If something can be obtained either by giving a lot or a little, I see no reason to give a lot unless I feel like that path will satisfy me more. Human nature my friends, as we are always saying, follow the money.

My only caveat would be to try to not support cloners that copy the logos and try to make the clone look like a genuine article. The purpose of that isn't to make you feel better about having it look exactly like the original; the purpose is to sell them as real. China has a long history of counterfeiting (Calvin Klone, etc.). Look up US currency counterfeiting internationally, China has lead that list for decades. Do no feel guilt. Simply know that counterfeiting should be discouraged, while free enterprise and innovation should be rewarded. BTW, do any of these 'poor souls' that are getting 'ripped off' actually hold a patent on their devices? Cause if not, it's fair game anyways. Legally, not speaking to the morals.
 
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