Could someone please help me find this thread?

[GoodNews!]

Ages ago, I read a thread where a scientist (or a poster publishing information for a non-affiliated scientist) used a complex and seemingly expensive way of measuring the particles in our vapor.

Not particles on a dish. Not particles on wire or silica or in juice. In the vapor itself.

The pictures showed clearly silica particles in free-hand vapor, suspended in air.

(If I interpretated the findings right).

This was proved, by many member's input, and even by the OP's input, to be safe, because the particles at hand were too big in diameter, and not the right chemical make-up, to stick in our lungs and cause health effects. (It has never been my intention to contradict that, concerning health as opposed to flavor/throat feel.)

Can anyone please track this thread down for me? I can't find it! Moderators, anyone!?

It's just that a huge silica war is starting on this forum again, and I want to stick to the old-school guns of the theories and facts that were proven on this forum years ago. No one's arguing about health. I'm just, in my own theories, speculating the famous "bad taste" I usually get.

This thread would make a huge difference in my life again, either I'll find that I interpretated the information wrong all along, or it'll give me substantial proof against people who are calling me names!

 

[olderthandirt]

I had the most eloquent response ever for another thread but it was closed before I could actually post it. Teach me to compose a wall of text.

Good Luck to Good News in finding the thread he seeks, may it serve him well (-;

 

[FearTX]

I searched for it but could only find a thread by a vet from Israel stating he examined the vapor under micrscope and found no silica particles.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/new-members-forum/372128-silica-wick.html

 

[Chiku]

Ages ago, I read a thread where a scientist (or a poster publishing information for a non-affiliated scientist) used a complex and seemingly expensive way of measuring the particles in our vapor.

Not particles on a dish. Not particles on wire or silica or in juice. In the vapor itself.

The pictures showed clearly silica particles in free-hand vapor, suspended in air.

(If I interpretated the findings right).

This was proved, by many member's input, and even by the OP's input, to be safe, because the particles at hand were too big in diameter, and not the right chemical make-up, to stick in our lungs and cause health effects. (It has never been my intention to contradict that, concerning health as opposed to flavor/throat feel.)

Can anyone please track this thread down for me? I can't find it! Moderators, anyone!?

It's just that a huge silica war is starting on this forum again, and I want to stick to the old-school guns of the theories and facts that were proven on this forum years ago. No one's arguing about health. I'm just, in my own theories, speculating the famous "bad taste" I usually get.

This thread would make a huge difference in my life again, either I'll find that I interpretated the information wrong all along, or it'll give me substantial proof against people who are calling me names!

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/modding-forum/284030-wick-materials-safe-vs-dangerous.html

Is this it?

 

[Robino1]

My apologies to Sonic. It will not happen again.

 

[j3illy]

I'm not sure if it was the same thread, but I saw something like this when reading/searching on possible health risks of vaping. There was a comparison of smoke vs. vapor, and it talked about the size difference of the particles. In smoke they're in the 1 micron range, and can travel into the tiniest passages in the lungs. But when vaping, the particles are substantially bigger in the 10 micron range. They can't travel nearly as deep into the lungs which is where they'd be harmful. It was also talking about possibly absorbing silica from the wicks, but apparently that's not a risk either cuz of the large particle size, not to mention it's impossible ti vaporize the silica itself at our vaping temps.

 

[FearTX]

The thread that Chiku links has an alarming slide in the first post that shows vapor condensate with some fiber or silica in it. I would have to question the method there. You could easily get dust or some other contaminate on the slide while you were blowing vapor on it. Not to say it is not what the original poser said it was. Just that there may be more there than what was deposited by the vapor.

 

[Thrasher]

just so its clear that slide is from a previous post to that one and the photos were challenged at every turn.

it is hard to take any of this research seriously when people just post some pictures, i would expect a link to some proper testing and analysis to back up how they came to these test results.

to date none of this information is or has been published for proper scientific peer review and if it was we would hear all about it from the anti vaping crowd.

 

[Underwhelmed]

Ages ago, I read a thread where a scientist (or a poster publishing information for a non-affiliated scientist) used a complex and seemingly expensive way of measuring the particles in our vapor.

Not particles on a dish. Not particles on wire or silica or in juice. In the vapor itself.

The pictures showed clearly silica particles in free-hand vapor, suspended in air.

(If I interpretated the findings right).

This was proved, by many member's input, and even by the OP's input, to be safe, because the particles at hand were too big in diameter, and not the right chemical make-up, to stick in our lungs and cause health effects. (It has never been my intention to contradict that, concerning health as opposed to flavor/throat feel.)

Can anyone please track this thread down for me? I can't find it! Moderators, anyone!?

It's just that a huge silica war is starting on this forum again, and I want to stick to the old-school guns of the theories and facts that were proven on this forum years ago. No one's arguing about health. I'm just, in my own theories, speculating the famous "bad taste" I usually get.

This thread would make a huge difference in my life again, either I'll find that I interpretated the information wrong all along, or it'll give me substantial proof against people who are calling me names!

Is it this thread?
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/modding-forum/284030-wick-materials-safe-vs-dangerous.html

 

[Asbestos4004]

I was unaware of any war. Seems to my, by the thousands of posts I read on here, that most people are fine with silica, those who aren't go with cotton or hemp or eco wool or stainless steel.....whatever works for them. The trick is to find what works for you and go with it. War? I musta missed it.

 

[PLANofMAN]

Is it this thread?
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/modding-forum/284030-wick-materials-safe-vs-dangerous.html

I hope not. That thread was started way back when people were afraid they would get silicosis from vaping. I'm grateful to it for pushing the movement towards cotton and ekowool wicks, but the original premises in that thread have long since been debunked.

 

[GoodNews!]

Just to clarify, what is the difference between vapor condensate and actual vapor?

I'm not saying the findings on that thread lead to health issues, I'm just saying that isn't it a possibility that those original pictures are at least factual, with no health risks?

 

[Asbestos4004]

I work in the Asbestos industry...lots of classes, certifications, renewals........Silica is brought up a good bit in my line of work. We use air pumps to run air quality tests on our demolition jobs that involve asbestos. The air is drawn into a little cassette that has a micron filter inside. That cassette is then broken open, the filter is removed and read under a microscope. PCM testing looks for fibers in general. Any fibers...dust, dander, clothing fiber.....anything in the air. Separate testing using different cassettes are used to identify certain types of fiber...like asbestos or silica dust....etc...
Just out of curiosity, I blew about 5 big hits from a dripper using a silica wick through one of the PCM cassettes and sent it to the lab with some other samples collected from a job. That one came back negative for any contaminants. Not a scientific test, by any means but good enough for me.

 

[FearTX]

just so its clear that slide is from a previous post to that one and the photos were challenged at every turn.

it is hard to take any of this research seriously when people just post some pictures, i would expect a link to some proper testing and analysis to back up how they came to these test results.

to date none of this information is or has been published for proper scientific peer review and if it was we would hear all about it from the anti vaping crowd.

That was my point in questioning the picture. I have access to a microscope, I can go blow vapor on it and look. I still would not trust what I see. I do not have access to a clean room to perform the testing in. I am also not a scientist, I would not know the difference from a silica shard at that magnification and lint.

 

[Underwhelmed]

I hope not. That thread was started way back when people were afraid they would get silicosis from vaping. I'm grateful to it for pushing the movement towards cotton and ekowool wicks, but the original premises in that thread have long since been debunked.

I'm with you on that PLANofMAN, but I'm pretty sure that was the post in question.

I use cotton yarn in my kayfun clones, not because silica scares me, but I prefer the taste and the fact that I can get it locally.

I always had a heck of a time wrapping a silica coil, so much so that I sold a new Penelope that I could never get set up right.

 

[PLANofMAN]

I'm with you on that PLANofMAN, but I'm pretty sure that was the post in question.

I use cotton yarn in my kayfun clones, not because silica scares me, but I prefer the taste and the fact that I can get it locally.

I always had a heck of a time wrapping a silica coil, so much so that I sold a new Penelope that I could never get set up right.

Yep. The first time I setup a cotton wick, I about gagged. All I could taste was wet t-shirt. After about a half hour of vaping through it, the taste went away, and I've never tasted it since in the dozens of wicks made since then. It tastes just as good, if not better than silica, and it can't be beat for convenience.

 

[FearTX]

Just to clarify, what is the difference between vapor condensate and actual vapor?

I'm not saying the findings on that thread lead to health issues, I'm just saying that isn't it a possibility that those original pictures are at least factual, with no health risks?

Vapor condensate is basically juice. Just like steam condensate is water. The findings on that thread are moot factually and scientifically because they cannot "prove" the work. You can make all the conjecture you want, perform observations etc. To be considered scientific then you must follow a strict set of protocols dependent on your methods.

You can blow vapor on a slide till you get condensate and look at it. Unless you yourself were prepped, before you entered a functioning clean room, there is no way to know what else would be on the slide.

I am not defending silica, I have used it, I own some, it is a pain in the rear compared to working with cotton. Cotton is free for me.

 

[classwife]

FYI :

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/ecf-forum-rules/51178-forum-rules.html

7. Courtesy
a. Members must be polite at all times. When addressing another Forum user, you will be polite.

8. Personal attacks
You can disagree with the subject matter of a post, but never personally attack the poster - “Attack the post, not the poster”. Treat people as you would like to be treated yourself: with courtesy.

9. Flaming, trolling, other misconduct
Posting something deliberately inflammatory - either to start a "flame war" or simply to cause difficulties for the Moderators.
Posting snide comments about another member.
Engaging in behaviour which is disruptive to the general operation of the Forum.

11. Message conventions
Posts made by members must accord with certain conventions.
a. Off-topic digression: Stick to the topic. Do not deviate from the subject discussed in a thread as this is called off-topic (OT) posting.

13. Freedom of speech
Your contribution to this forum is not a right but a privilege. As this is a private website there is no public right to freedom of speech. The rules we have in place are to protect the site, and to provide a convivial environment for our Members. In short: we decide what is permissible or not permissible.



Thank you kindly - Have a great weekend

 

[Asbestos4004]

9. Flaming, trolling, other misconduct
Posting something deliberately inflammatory - either to start a "flame war" or simply to cause difficulties for the Moderators.

I promise, I'm not trying to be smart alleck. sp? But I'm curious if this rule applies to the op as well. Based on the number of deleted comments from highly respected members of this forum, most of which go out of their way to help new members, I'm wondering if there could possibly be a common denominator.

Also, should the intentional spreading of false information and fantasy based scare theories be included in this rule? Seems some of the "facts"given could cause difficulties or possibly even injury to new vapors who don't know any better.

 

[PLANofMAN]

9. Flaming, trolling, other misconduct
Posting something deliberately inflammatory - either to start a "flame war" or simply to cause difficulties for the Moderators.

I promise, I'm not trying to be smart aleck. But I'm curious if this rule applies to the op as well. Based on the number of deleted comments from highly respected members of this forum, most of which go out of their way to help new members, I'm wondering if there could possibly be a common denominator.

Also, should the intentional spreading of false information and fantasy based scare theories be included in this rule? Seems some of the "facts"given could cause difficulties or possibly even injury to new vapors who don't know any better.

Unfortunately, ignorance (willful or otherwise) is not a bannable offense. I think the OP should do more research before posting his theories. For future reference, Good News, post links to facts or claims that back up your theories.

Good News, your assertions are fine (if often wrong), but you'd better have the facts and links to those facts available to back them up; otherwise you can look forward to having your posts picked apart by people who spend more time reading and less time typing.