Documentation Needed 2 Buy Batteries

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Fidola13

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I was Battery window shopping this afternoon and ended up at batterybro.com which I think are on the reputable battery vendors list or was at some point.

There was a minimum quantity of 5 and no price until you’ve signed in as a business entity.

Scrolling down the page I came upon this. And it is as included on every battery I checked out.

This could be one way to screw vapers. I’ve been worrying about being able to access batteries for a long time.
91BE7166-6E56-4AD6-829E-4A3C51AD5F24.png
 

zoiDman

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This could be one way to screw vapers. I’ve been worrying about being able to access batteries for a long time.
91be7166-6e56-4ad6-829e-4a3c51ad5f24-png.808791

This is LG doing the a Liability CYA.

With the Amount of Lawyers in the USA, and the Amounts a Plaintiff wants when He/She puts a Bare Cell in their Pocket and the Battery Shorts to their Keys, I'm not sure I blame them.
 

sonicbomb

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Vapers assume that the batteries we use are designed for that use. No.
They are intended to be used in battery packs with regulation circuitry, we appropriated them and the manufacturers want nothing to do with us. Sony distanced itself legally from the practice a number of years ago. Its legal ....-covering prompted in no small part by all the bad press surrounding e-cigs.

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Baditude

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These 18650 batteries were exclusively designed for the auto and power tool industry. They were designed to be used only in battery packs. These battery packs have their own custom-designed battery management system (BMS) that ensures configurable, consistent protection at desired current, voltage, and temperature settings to ensure long battery life and to ensure their safe use.

The were not designed to be used alone as a single or dual cell battery device without BMS, which is how they are used in the vaping industry.

images
battery packs with BMS

2015042519460251.jpg

 

CasketWeaver

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These 18650 batteries were exclusively designed for the auto and power tool industry. They were designed to be used only in battery packs. These battery packs have their own custom-designed battery management system (BMS) that ensures configurable, consistent protection at desired current, voltage, and temperature settings to ensure long battery life and to ensure their safe use.

The were not designed to be used alone as a single or dual cell battery device without BMS, which is how they are used in the vaping industry.

images
battery packs with BMS

2015042519460251.jpg



Imagine me building a battery pack, wiring it with a BMS, and installing it into a PV. Then they'd ban building of battery packs, just because the amount of power it would have.

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Eskie

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Once you load the loose batteries into a mod it is (well should if properly designed) in a BMS. There's nothing fancy expected. Over and under voltage protection. Amp cutoff based on the battery ratings you're using for your battery configuration. Balanced discharging and really the only iffy balanced charging. Any decent regulated mod already has that built in, so this is sort of a non-issue for most people. Mechs obviously not included. Or poorly designed regulated boards. But as consumers we should have the right to expect the mod manufacturers to do their job properly.
 

CasketWeaver

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Once you load the loose batteries into a mod it is (well should if properly designed) in a BMS. There's nothing fancy expected. Over and under voltage protection. Amp cutoff based on the battery ratings you're using for your battery configuration. Balanced discharging and really the only iffy balanced charging. Any decent regulated mod already has that built in, so this is sort of a non-issue for most people. Mechs obviously not included. Or poorly designed regulated boards. But as consumers we should have the right to expect the mod manufacturers to do their job properly.
Exactly the vast majority of it is just bad publicity surrounding the e-cigarette.

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Baditude

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IMHO, it's not necessarily the regulated mod users that the battery manufacturers are worried about. It's the mech users who use metal tube mods with inadequate ventilation that catch the media headlines after they blow up and attracts liability lawyers seeking damage lawsuits. My guess is a vast majority of the lawsuits filed against battery manufacturers/suppliers fall into this category.
 

Eskie

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IMHO, it's not necessarily the regulated mod users that the battery manufacturers are worried about. It's the mech users who use metal tube mods with inadequate ventilation that catch the media headlines after they blow up and attracts liability lawyers seeking damage lawsuits. My guess is a vast majority of the lawsuits filed against battery manufacturers/suppliers fall into this category.

True. But that segment of the vape market is much smaller than the regulated side of things. It's also one reason I don't believe mechs will ever survive any sort of approval process should that process ever finally begin.
 
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CasketWeaver

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IMHO, it's not necessarily the regulated mod users that the battery manufacturers are worried about. It's the mech users who use metal tube mods with inadequate ventilation that catch the media headlines after they blow up and attracts liability lawyers seeking damage lawsuits. My guess is a vast majority of the lawsuits filed against battery manufacturers/suppliers fall into this category.
Well just as I've said too many other people about certain things poor choices equal poor results.

As soon as we start taken extreme stances against an inanimate object for the poor decisions of the few people that are there, we end up drawing unwanted attention to ourselves. We can't just go and blame a mechanical mod for the poor decisions of a person. People spend all this money on top quality mechanical mods but they use a cheap atomizer to use on it. and maybe they don't take their atomizer part to ensure that there's no metal shavings or anything else on it and then as soon as I put it on there mechanical mod and they go to push the fire button a hard short. Watch Jaihaze video of the Athena squonk mod, and you'll see what I'm talking about. he made me take my Athena RDA apart to make sure that there were no machine shavings or anything else like that on there

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stols001

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IMRbatteries my go to vendor for a long time has been including this warning with every battery purchase for at least a year. It's CYA and pretty standard.

They also send wraps and battery cases. They know who their market is for loose batteries, they just don't want to be involved in a lawsuit.

I don't blame them.

Anna
 

CasketWeaver

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IMRbatteries my go to vendor for a long time has been including this warning with every battery purchase for at least a year. It's CYA and pretty standard.

They also send wraps and battery cases. They know who their market is for loose batteries, they just don't want to be involved in a lawsuit.

I don't blame them.

Anna

I don't blame anyone either. It's just disappointing that it's come to this is all.
 
I don't blame anyone either. It's just disappointing that it's come to this is all.


It hasn't come to all this. It's been there all along, ever since people started trying to sue manufacturers for their own misuse of the products. Read the warnings and disclaimers that come with a ladder sometime.

I stand firmly behind holding manufacturers responsible for poorly made or badly thought out products which cause injury and/or loss, but when someone sues because the extension ladder they set up on frozen cow manure slipped when the manure thawed out (true story) they get little sympathy from me.

The warnings/disclaimers save us from the cost added to a product from frivolous lawsuits.
 

CasketWeaver

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It hasn't come to all this. It's been there all along, ever since people started trying to sue manufacturers for their own misuse of the products. Read the warnings and disclaimers that come with a ladder sometime.

I stand firmly behind holding manufacturers responsible for poorly made or badly thought out products which cause injury and/or loss, but when someone sues because the extension ladder they set up on frozen cow manure slipped when the manure thawed out (true story) they get little sympathy from me.

The warnings/disclaimers save us from the cost added to a product from frivolous lawsuits.
Yes. Because people pay no mind to the amount of information and warnings that are out there. A handful of people ruin it for the entire group. So all the batteries that I usually deem safe, like my LG's, this will make it even more difficult for me to get good quality batteries that I know haven't been rewrapped, have bad specifications written on them, etc.

forces people to buy batteries that they're not sure about. And that can be dangerous in and of itself. Because of course stores that sell batteries aren't going to give accurate information either. How many times has somebody tried to sell me a basen battery? Because of the overrated specifications on it? Plenty.

I've made comments many many times in the past, and I say the same thing every time. Bad choices are just that, choices. if a person is too careless or too lazy to take into consideration the limitations of their battery or they just want to throw their batteries inside of their pocket with loose keys, change, and all of that, then why should the battery manufacturers be responsible for the careless behavior? Because when the battery manufacturers are being held accountable for somebody else's reckless behavior, eventually it forces people's hand to either give up electronic cigarettes or forces their hand to go and buy batteries from an untrusted source. And the big cause of that is because now the battery manufacturers want to CMA. If I need to clarify what CMA stands for, then there's a problem. and that can come with countless things they can stop selling loose batteries to distributors, they can limit which distributors get those batteries, or they can stop making those specific batteries all together.

So at the end of the day, yes, it's a shame that it's come to that. it's going to be more and more difficult to purchase batteries his time goes on. People are not going to know what they're getting, and that can have dangerous consequences. So in the midst of trying to mitigate risk we're actually causing more risk.

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I was Battery window shopping this afternoon and ended up at batterybro.com which I think are on the reputable battery vendors list or was at some point.

There was a minimum quantity of 5 and no price until you’ve signed in as a business entity.

Scrolling down the page I came upon this. And it is as included on every battery I checked out.

This could be one way to screw vapers. I’ve been worrying about being able to access batteries for a long time.
View attachment 808791

Sony has those warnings as well. We ARE using all our 18650's against explicit directive from the manufacturers.

Why?

1) the manufacturers don't want to be sued for deaths or injuries from mechanical or regulated mod use.

2) We don't care because the battery chemistry is the best available for our uses.
 
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