Dr. says e-cigs are a scam; AMA votes to have them regulated

[MlrGrl]

Doctors challenge e-cigarettes | Superior Telegram | Superior, Wisconsin

"......... He says the battery powered nicotine delivery system is used by some consumers who think it can help them cut back on smoking--even though there are no studies showing that......"

DUDE!! WTF!!! (can I say WTF here? 'cause seriously, if any statement deserves a WTF, it's that one!)

I want to find out where this guy "practices", 'cause I've never seen an actual study that says he can actually be a doctor.

I'm thinking that this is something from "The Onion", but it doens't appear to be.....

 

[Vicks Vap-oh-Yeah]

So he says they 'don't work' because there are no studies, but wants them regulated as a drug-delivery device. Hmmmm...... someone needs to make up their mind.

Wish there was someplace to leave a comment.

 

[boxhead]

I think the make up their mind is done.... Confuse and scare the shepeople...herd them to where mind makers make the most profit.

 

[Redd]

Did some agency need to conduct a study to prove that scissors cut paper?

They just worked.

Did it take a study to know that fire burns things?

It just does.

I've heard of some real quacks in my day...

I bet this duffus also would swear that women don't get cluster headaches.

 

[jj2]

More Miller Med Society Mumbo Jumbo
YouTube - More Miller Med Society Mumbo Jumbo

Doctor Miller is the director of Behavioral Services and medical director of Adult
Addiction Services at Meriter Hospital in Madison. An assistant clinical professor at the University of Wisconsin Medical School, Dr. Miller is also an AMA Alternate Delega

Corresponding Author: Please address correspondence to the Wisconsin Medical Society at 608.442.3800


The only other contact info I came up with is at the bottom of the page: Follow link.
http://www.asam.org/

 

[MlrGrl]

I actually did find a link to leave a comment, but that's not what it said; it was something written I think in green, just to the right of the article's bottom? (that sounded funny..)

I clicked on it and it took me to the one comment that had been made at that point. I was going to leave a comment, but, it was late and luckily the Capt. pointed out maybe my comments were more vinegar than honey...

Can anyone still read the story without registering on the site to get it?

 

[IFiddle]

Aaaaah, this sheds a lot of light for me. As a student of UW-Madison, I've been wondering why the med school didn't comment on e-cigs. Makes sense that if one of the higher-ups in the bureaucracy doesn't like them then the whole damn school doesn't like them.

I'm a 3rd year physical therapy student, and the only one in the program who vapes (and none of us smoke). It's been interesting trying to break even future medical health professionals (not to mention our professors. . . ) out of the "FDA is right" mindset. There really is a lot of brainwashing.

The good news is that there are a lot of free thinkers in all of the occupations in the field. Discussions with my MD colleagues have shown me that the AMA is thought of in the newest generation as on its way out in the realm of complete representation of the occupation. I've heard 30% as a generally good summary of those who actually join it. Hopefully Dr. Miller realizes one day that he and those he represents are fossils.

 

[harmony gardens]

Aaaaah, this sheds a lot of light for me. As a student of UW-Madison, I've been wondering why the med school didn't comment on e-cigs. Makes sense that if one of the higher-ups in the bureaucracy doesn't like them then the whole damn school doesn't like them.

I'm a 3rd year physical therapy student, and the only one in the program who vapes (and none of us smoke). It's been interesting trying to break even future medical health professionals (not to mention our professors. . . ) out of the "FDA is right" mindset. There really is a lot of brainwashing.

The good news is that there are a lot of free thinkers in all of the occupations in the field. Discussions with my MD colleagues have shown me that the AMA is thought of in the newest generation as on its way out in the realm of complete representation of the occupation. I've heard 30% as a generally good summary of those who actually join it. Hopefully Dr. Miller realizes one day that he and those he represents are fossils.

I feel for you. I know how hard it can be to have a thinking mind and running into a group think. In my day, I was a business major and had to sit there listening to professors who were justifying Vietnam and training us to be professional union busters, and how to make your company look good, even if it's not. I had talked to a lot of vets who came back totally messed up from the expirience, and my father was in the Operating Engineers Union, and I saw what the Union did for my family. I couldn't see the sense of eliminating Unions, and keeping people dieing in a war for a country who's only real resource was rice. They would discredit psychology, sociology, political science,,, et al, but one professor said, here's one discovery of psychology we can use,,, it's called Pavlov's dog. I would get into arguements with my professors every day,,, lol.

Keep your mind, though, and keep trying to open thier eyes. I can't say that sticking to your principles will help put food on your table, but doing what your heart says will help you sleep at night.

 

[IFiddle]

Double Post :X

 

[IFiddle]

Aye, it's very disheartening to me going into the health care system to see things the way they are. I've been trained as a scientist since my undergrad days, and we have a huge emphasis on "Evidence-Based Practice" in our training as PTs. It's maddening to take all that to heart and then get out into the real world where it's obvious money is king. You'd think helping people would be easy to do. Reduced harm just makes so much sense! Alas, that isn't the case most of the time. But I suppose I'm preaching to the choir.

 

[harmony gardens]

Aye, it's very disheartening to me going into the health care system to see things the way they are. I've been trained as a scientist since my undergrad days, and we have a huge emphasis on "Evidence-Based Practice" in our training as PTs. It's maddening to take all that to heart and then get out into the real world where it's obvious money is king. You'd think helping people would be easy to do. Reduced harm just makes so much sense! Alas, that isn't the case most of the time. But I suppose I'm preaching to the choir.

yes, you are, but if you want to work on your chops here, go for it!! It might also help you to know you speak for us, as you hit your head against their wall.

 

[Vicks Vap-oh-Yeah]

Reduced harm does make a lot of sense, but that's the problem with it. Now, I don't claim to have a degree in the school of people's heads on paper, but I've learned alot from just living life, and observing how others live theirs.

Harm reduction is an infant, revolutionary way of thinking about addiction, abuse of chemical compounds, and how society as a whole reacts to them. It's not just about tobacco and nicotine, but ALL substances that cause addiction to the human being: crack, MJ, speed, etc. ad-nauseum.

It posits that addiciton is acceptable. That, given the right maintenance, a person addicted to a chemical substance can life a long, productive, and healthy life WHILE MAINTAINING THEIR ADDICTION. It's a direct challenge to the abstinence-only mindset.

IF harm reduction goes mainstream, it's going to change the entire way we think about and handle illegal drugs and addictive substances....all of 'em. It's going to tear down a LOT of barriers, and it's going to challenge several very long-established modus' of thinking. It's an uphill battle of a global scale, tantamount, I think, to moving the moon out of its orbit.

You think the anti-smoking nazi's are bad? Try the anti-DRUG nazi's....up to and including LEO's, our entire legal system, and the DEA....


I think, eventually, we'll get there, and erase the abstainance-only mindset that is a pattern of thought established by the Puritans centuries ago. Boiled down to specifics, this is what we're fighting - the holier than thou, how dare you enjoy yourself, and if it gives you pleasure, it must be a sin mentality handed down to us through the work of this very oppressive religious beginning.

Will Harm Reduction go mainstream in my lifetime? I doubt it...but I'm committed to laying the groundwork, simply because it feels like the right thing to do.

 

[harmony gardens]

Reduced harm does make a lot of sense, but that's the problem with it. Now, I don't claim to have a degree in the school of people's heads on paper, but I've learned alot from just living life, and observing how others live theirs.

Harm reduction is an infant, revolutionary way of thinking about addiction, abuse of chemical compounds, and how society as a whole reacts to them. It's not just about tobacco and nicotine, but ALL substances that cause addiction to the human being: crack, MJ, speed, etc. ad-nauseum.

It posits that addiciton is acceptable. That, given the right maintenance, a person addicted to a chemical substance can life a long, productive, and healthy life WHILE MAINTAINING THEIR ADDICTION. It's a direct challenge to the abstinence-only mindset.

IF harm reduction goes mainstream, it's going to change the entire way we think about and handle illegal drugs and addictive substances....all of 'em. It's going to tear down a LOT of barriers, and it's going to challenge several very long-established modus' of thinking. It's an uphill battle of a global scale, tantamount, I think, to moving the moon out of its orbit.

You think the anti-smoking nazi's are bad? Try the anti-DRUG nazi's....up to and including LEO's, our entire legal system, and the DEA....


I think, eventually, we'll get there, and erase the abstainance-only mindset that is a pattern of thought established by the Puritans centuries ago. Boiled down to specifics, this is what we're fighting - the holier than thou, how dare you enjoy yourself, and if it gives you pleasure, it must be a sin mentality handed down to us through the work of this very oppressive religious beginning.

Will Harm Reduction go mainstream in my lifetime? I doubt it...but I'm committed to laying the groundwork, simply because it feels like the right thing to do.

you hit it on the head, vicks