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I have an idea for a mini pump driven mod... these pumps look awesome, except they are showing 200+ ml per minute.... for mine I would need somewhere between 1-5ml per minute..
Can you find me something that small with a slower pump output?
These are perfect except they are too high power
Edit, I found one that might be a little better suited, dont know about smaller, but it has less output (I'll draw a diagram of my idea when I get home...)
http://www.chinamicropump.com/cmp17l.html
Can you find me something that small with a slower pump output?
These are perfect except they are too high power
Edit, I found one that might be a little better suited, dont know about smaller, but it has less output (I'll draw a diagram of my idea when I get home...)
http://www.chinamicropump.com/cmp17l.html
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I'm guessing you either restrict the flow by having a very small outlet (teeny hose) on the atomizer side, or thru decreased voltage, or a combination of both.
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I think you'll need much less than that in throughput. Restricting the pump may just burn it out. And hysteresis will be a big problem. Consider a stepping motor or ultrasonic transducer instead.
Well, you could also use a micro vacuum pump, switchable somehow, connected to the mouthpiece...I think I saw a few of those somewhere.
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Check this out!!!!
Piezo Electric Diaphragm Micro Pump Manufacturer exporting direct from Taiwan
Microjet Products
PS15I
Dimension, LxW (mm)
17.1x17.1
Thickness, T (mm)
11.6
Water Flow rate (ml/min)
0.5-10
Pumping pressure (kPa)
<35
Suction pressure (kPa)
5
Repeat accuracy
5%
Power consumption (W)
0.01-0.2
Based on that information, it looks like it could easily be added to a "juicebox" type mod.
Piezo Electric Diaphragm Micro Pump Manufacturer exporting direct from Taiwan
Microjet Products
PS15I
Dimension, LxW (mm)
17.1x17.1
Thickness, T (mm)
11.6
Water Flow rate (ml/min)
0.5-10
Pumping pressure (kPa)
<35
Suction pressure (kPa)
5
Repeat accuracy
5%
Power consumption (W)
0.01-0.2
Based on that information, it looks like it could easily be added to a "juicebox" type mod.
http://www.microbase.com.tw/product_4.php
Micro Piezoelectric Pumps-MBP1303BD Manufacturer exporting direct from Taiwan
That one is 13x13x6mm It doesnt say how much liquid it provides, but all I am looking at doing is keeping the filler in the cartrige full, so it doesnt have to pump much...
Micro Piezoelectric Pumps-MBP1303BD Manufacturer exporting direct from Taiwan
That one is 13x13x6mm
It doesnt say how much liquid it provides, but all I am looking at doing is keeping the filler in the cartrige full, so it doesnt have to pump much...
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Micro Piezoelectric Pumps-MBP1303BD Manufacturer exporting direct from Taiwan
That one is 13x13x6mm
Dosing function (programmable)....... sweeeet
Think inkjet printer.
Think sending jet straight to coil from a sealed but refillable juice container.
Think sending jet straight to coil from a sealed but refillable juice container.
Cool find - I knew the technology existed but never found one that small. I think the goal should be to deliver a drop/mist to the steel wick on an as-needed basis via a switch and eliminate the need for the inner cart and filler altogether.
p.s. I slapped together an incredibly crude extended cart mod this morning just to test the concept. The mickey mouse T-shaped thing actually worked lol. I'm too embarassed to post it.
A piezo mist generator would be even smaller than the pump. Nice unit though that I can think of various uses for.
first2di3 - are you planning something portable and as part of an e-cig, or just for home use? I wonder how much they cost.
first2di3 - are you planning something portable and as part of an e-cig, or just for home use? I wonder how much they cost.
if you want a vacuum, how about a carburettor? Get the airflow right with something like a micro RC diaphragm carb, and it ought to atomize fluid simply by sucking on the outlet - technically you could dispense with the battery entirely, and make it a purely mechanical device powered by user suction (like a turbocharger.)
It's just a thought anyway. As an indication of how small a carb can be, here's a 1 gram one in operation (it's the small aluminium stud at the top left of the engine - looks way small enough to fit in a cig
): YouTube - COX .049 SURE START RC CONVERSIONWhat I have in my head is basically, the pump keeps the filler full, but once the liquid reaches a certain point, it drains back down the reservoir..
Although, now that Im reading about the misting idea, it might be better if instead of it filling a cart, or even needing to drain, have the pump spray a fine mist AS you puff, but have the spray nozzle be metal so you can get it down very close to the atomizer so you arent inhaling the fine mist before it atomizes...
if you want a vacuum, how about a carburettor? Get the airflow right with something like a micro RC diaphragm carb, and it ought to atomize fluid simply by sucking on the outlet - technically you could dispense with the battery entirely, and make it a purely mechanical device powered by user suction (like a turbocharger.)
It's just a thought anyway. As an indication of how small a carb can be, here's a 1 gram one in operation (it's the small aluminium stud at the top left of the engine - looks way small enough to fit in a cig
Please enlighten me...
How exactly would mixing the liquid with air like in a carburetor cause it to atomize?
Not putting down your suggestion, I just want to know how exactly we could get our nicquid to vaporize without heat...
I know thats how it works in Nebulizers at a hospital...........
Well, atomizing is just making a mist in air - it doesn't necessarily have to be done by heat - the original Ruyan devices are ultrasonic after all (though that still relies on a battery.)
Admittedly the user response to the ultrasonic devices is a bit mixed - some people say the mist is too cold, and doesn't have quite the right mouth feel to mimic smoke - but they're still selling them, so they can't be a total turnoff.
I haven't tried an ultrasonic vape yet (I think the Vegas cigar is one, isn't it?) so I have no idea how they compare, but some kind of carburettor could mimic at least that delivery. They do a very good job of atomizing fuel in air, and there's a great deal of data on designing them for fluids of different viscosities. And (unless they're supercharged,) they all run on suction alone, and can cope with widely variable pressure from the engine (or lungs in this case
)You could hook up a 30ml bottle of juice on the fuel line, and never have to worry about refilling a cart or recharging a battery again
I've never worked on a carb smaller than a moped's, but the principle seems sound. And that one on the video's definitely cig width or narrower (excluding the 'whammy bar' throttle, which would probably be superfluous.)
Well if I can get my hands on a micro pump (most that you can actually easily buy seem to be around 30ml/min where as I need like 1 or less) I was going to put it in a juicy box with one lithium 3.6 AA and run from the 10ml or so container directly to the wire bridge, I was going to put a small hole in the side of an 801 atomizer and have some heat resistant plastic or metal to go inside and rest on/barely above the bridge. This way gravity cannot affect it (other than starving the pump). I would have 2 momentary switches, one as default power (to vape) and another that will control the pump that is inline with the default power to stop any accidental activation, this way a person could run it like 2-5 secs every 15 puffs or so. Wouldnt even need any weird circuity if you got a pump with a low flow rate and took the battery out to recharge.
I subscribe to the K.I.S.S method
Keep It Simple Stupid
No offense to the fellowship of the holy order of ECF
With todays technology (sans the flying cars) there must be a simpler way than pulling out uranium fuel rods and then yanking a pull start just to enjoy a hit of nicotine in the fashion a smoker is accustomed... (evil grin..)
But from what i have observed from the basic atomizer design, it uses a simple wicking or capillarity system to pull liquid through a heating element and when mixed with forced air, causes vapor.... much like an oil lantern
is there a way to contain a larger vial of liquid that can wick into the atomizer without the fear of spillage when inverted or bumped around? I would think it might look something akin to an airbrush pen but smaller.... any thought?
Keep It Simple Stupid
No offense to the fellowship of the holy order of ECF
With todays technology (sans the flying cars) there must be a simpler way than pulling out uranium fuel rods and then yanking a pull start just to enjoy a hit of nicotine in the fashion a smoker is accustomed... (evil grin..)
But from what i have observed from the basic atomizer design, it uses a simple wicking or capillarity system to pull liquid through a heating element and when mixed with forced air, causes vapor.... much like an oil lantern
is there a way to contain a larger vial of liquid that can wick into the atomizer without the fear of spillage when inverted or bumped around? I would think it might look something akin to an airbrush pen but smaller.... any thought?
Well, atomizing is just making a mist in air - it doesn't necessarily have to be done by heat - the original Ruyan devices are ultrasonic after all (though that still relies on a battery.)
Admittedly the user response to the ultrasonic devices is a bit mixed - some people say the mist is too cold, and doesn't have quite the right mouth feel to mimic smoke - but they're still selling them, so they can't be a total turnoff.
I haven't tried an ultrasonic vape yet (I think the Vegas cigar is one, isn't it?) so I have no idea how they compare, but some kind of carburettor could mimic at least that delivery. They do a very good job of atomizing fuel in air, and there's a great deal of data on designing them for fluids of different viscosities. And (unless they're supercharged,) they all run on suction alone, and can cope with widely variable pressure from the engine (or lungs in this case
You could hook up a 30ml bottle of juice on the fuel line, and never have to worry about refilling a cart or recharging a battery again
I've never worked on a carb smaller than a moped's, but the principle seems sound. And that one on the video's definitely cig width or narrower (excluding the 'whammy bar' throttle, which would probably be superfluous.)
If what Im thinking of would work, what about recreating a heat free atomizer by adding a superfine mister to the end of the pump, have it pointing down into the bottom of a funnel so that excess drops back down into the reservoir, but the mist is what we inhale...
I know it sounds like it would be easier to just use a piezo atomizer, and it might, but I would also like to add a heating coil (read, warming coil, not like the atomizer coil) so that the mist comes out warm like we like.
*ponders*
here you go: HNP MZR Micro-Annular Gear Pumps, Low Pressure, High Pressure, Modular Series, Hermetic Inert Series
"Flow rates from 0.0015 to 1152 ml/min" should fit the bill (don't know how much they cost though - "price on request", and they don't look cheap!)
This one looks quite promising (for specs and form factor): http://www.michael-smith-engineers.co.uk/pdfs/mzr/product_info_mzr-2942.pdf
You could do, with the benefit that the battery is running a cooler heating coil, but the downside is that it's also got to run a pump or a piezo unit as well (I don't know what the current drain on those units is like, so whether the tradeoff is a net gain or a net loss? No idea.)
But it does make the system more complex (twice as many things to go wrong, and like Brian says - KISS is not a bad approach generally
)How about adding a heating coil to a perfume atomizer with a superfine misting nozzle (if a fine enough one could be found?) The manual squirt means the battery would only have to run the warming coil - even if it was flat, you could still get a cold hit?
But can you get sufficiently fine misting nozzles I wonder? A coarse droplet aerosol probably wouldn't be very pleasant, even warmed
hmmmm...
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