I can still order any thing I need. The only ban in my state is going to the sales to minors. And I agree on that one.
Flavors that may contain Diacetyl, are there really this many?
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Amen to that. Between the closer FDA scrutiny to increasing concerns over the saftey of ingredients, I'm glad I don't run a business based on selling liquid. That being said, if I did, I'd damn sure do everything I could to promote that there's no diacetyl in the liquid we sell, similar to what Rocket Fuel are doing...
Um, we don't even have a call to action over that. Where did you here this proposed ban? Since provari and mt baker vapor are here, I don't think drug paraphernalia is on the agenda list (they are out of session aren't they?)
If you watch the video on the hearing you would know how we got it stopped just by the skin of our teeth.
Read their proposal. It's written so poorly that they were asked if we would still be able to buy eggplant and tomato's
They did admit the law would not apply to the patches, gums, etc because they were a pharmaceutical product.
They were then asked .. if that's the case, why don't they require a prescription?
In other words, don't step on BP.
The state is losing too much TAX money due to the reduced sale of cigarettes, and everyone, who can, is running to Idaho, and Oregon to buy them.
They are used to just passing anything they want without it even being noticed.
They were blown away at the brick wall they ran into. The meeting was crammed with shop owners, and vapers.
It was obvious they didn't even know or understand what vaping or e-cigs were, and they were left with their mouths open, and caught way off guard.
Don't worry .. they will be back !, but in the mean time a huge coalition has, and is being formed to meet them head-on.
Mt Baker and Provape were both there.
Mt Baker told them they were getting ready to open a place in Lynden, and that is was now on hold due to these proposed law.
They also informed them of how much they had grown, how many they were employing and hiring,
and that if this law passed they would LEAVE THE STATE.
There was a lot of testimony from vapers of how it had saved their life, how they had their doctors approval and encouragement.
They were left kind of dumb struck, due to the obvious fact that they were passing laws without doing ANY research.
If your not already a member, join CASAA, and sign up to be notified of any proposed action occurring in our state.
They will definitely let you know.
In the meantime, look up HG2795 and SB6595.
They may be dead now, but you can be sure they are working on a new one, and one much better written.
They are trying to pass every kind of law they can .. to keep you smoking.
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Nope. They never give up. Chances are they will break it down and then slip it into something unrelated that "must pass" at the last minute. Life will never be the same.
Check into Vaping Malitia. They are doing an online auction the 17th for CASAA. I think the general consenses is they are going to court because nothing will survive these regulations. Not even a drip tip. https://medium.com/vaping-stories/515e85677eca
Get this; Nicorette Mist has about 7 additional ingredients (including muriac acid) + flavors. The FDA changed labeling for all NRT's approving them for long term and dual use. Doesn't that say it all.
Public health is the last thing on their minds.
Check into Vaping Malitia. They are doing an online auction the 17th for CASAA. I think the general consenses is they are going to court because nothing will survive these regulations. Not even a drip tip. https://medium.com/vaping-stories/515e85677eca
Get this; Nicorette Mist has about 7 additional ingredients (including muriac acid) + flavors. The FDA changed labeling for all NRT's approving them for long term and dual use. Doesn't that say it all.
Public health is the last thing on their minds.
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'Hope nobody minds us sayin'-askin' - but can we keep this (very important) thread "on topic", please. It's not like there aren't plenty of other threads for discussing all the legal stuff. TIA
I contacted my buddies at MFS and they have no restrictions to any states as of 5/9/2014. If what you are saying is fact I would put in the biggest order of 100mg nic you can afford and worry about the PG, VG and flavoring next payday. If anything would become an issue getting your hands on it will be the nic. The other three or two items if you prefer 100% PG or VG are the less expensive and should be available at any time and very easy to get as needed.
Yes and sorry about that I do hate when I'm trying to research something very important to me and I end up reading a bunch of gibberish like this post. We do need to get back on topic.
Wow, that is scarey! But look what kind of toxic chemicals I have inhaled In cigarettes for over 30 years! My poor lungs! I just don't know what I think about this just yet.. it is definitely scarey, that's for sure.....
This is the list of flavors I had from TFA that I'm goin to stop using for vapping I would like to know if anyone knows of safe alternatives to any of them especially the cream flavors they are my newest and I was really i enjoy them. Thanks for any help.
Bavarian cream
Caramel Candy
Caramel Expresso
Coconut Extra
Dragons Blood (creamy dragon strawberry mix)
Kona
Marshmallow
Mocha
Nectarine
Sweet cream
And any ideas what to use them for besides e cig flavors by individual flavor... I'm not that creative if I'm not mixing flavors to vape.
Bavarian cream
Caramel Candy
Caramel Expresso
Coconut Extra
Dragons Blood (creamy dragon strawberry mix)
Kona
Marshmallow
Mocha
Nectarine
Sweet cream
And any ideas what to use them for besides e cig flavors by individual flavor... I'm not that creative if I'm not mixing flavors to vape.
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They are wonderful flavors just not sure what to use them on. Don't want them to go to waste and I would like to use them. Just what would you want to add nectorine flavoring to. Maybe iced tea? Maybe some of the cream and coffee flavors to home made ice cream?
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- find Candyquik in the baking aisle. It comes in chocolate and vanilla. Get one of each. Melt the vanilla one and add coconut flavoring, maybe 1/4 teaspoon to start with per candy-bar serving size. Either use candy molds or dip something in that. Banana slices, almonds, pretzels, plain cookies, whatever. Melt the chocolate candyquik and add Kona and Caramel Candy. Again, either molds or dipping.
- add any flavor other than the cream flavors to heavy cream, whip it, and use it on fresh fruit
- stir into plain yogurt
- add any you want to your coffee, tea, tonic water (nectarine or strawberry would be good there) or club soda. I wonder if cream flavoring would turn club soda into cream soda...I dunno.
All those flavors are fine for eating/drinking, so have at it. Lots that I haven't liked vaping are fine this way.
My offer is because I plan on vaping them. I might put some coconut flavoring in my fake almost ice cream, but primarily I'll vape them.
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Forgive me if this has already been discussed, but I didn't see it if so..
Has anyone seen this article discussing that diacetyl was already present in cigarettes and nobody has ever developed popcorn lung, so the fact it is present in eliquid may be irrelevant?
Diacetyl and 2,3-pentanedione exposures - PubMed Mobile
Has anyone seen this article discussing that diacetyl was already present in cigarettes and nobody has ever developed popcorn lung, so the fact it is present in eliquid may be irrelevant?
Diacetyl and 2,3-pentanedione exposures - PubMed Mobile
This doesn't make it irrelevant. We don't know the long-term effects of exposure via vapor/vaping directly to the lungs. Many people who start vaping have established health concerns from smoking and they need to eliminate as many possible toxins as they can. For the majority it may be irrelevant, but not to everyone.
From the above link:
Yes, we have seen it, but it hasn't been discussed adequately. Wethinks there's really no way to (accurately) compare the 'diacetyl' that is present in "smoke" with what is in "vapor". That smokers don't regularly develop obstructive airway diseases (like popcorn lung/bronchiolitis obliterans is very relevant (in our opinion) and should definitely raise questions!
There are dozens/hundreds of reports/posts all over ECF of people experiencing varying levels of airway irritation & inflammation from vaping liquids containing diacetyl, acetyl propionyl and/or acetoin. My throat/lungs feel like they've been on a rotisserie grill after vaping diacetyl/diketone-laced juices (Capella's Vanilla Custard and FW Butterscoth), yet I never experienced that level of irritation & inflammation from smoking (up to two packs per day). And of course, there are dozens of studies with lab animals that prove the vapor from these fluids cause irritation, inflammation, cell death and obstructive lung disease. So why not with cigarettes?
In the factories (and the one identified case from eating popcorn) - the exposure was from the diacetyl/diketones mixed with other liquids, and then heated - which transformed them to vapor. There has to be something different in the diacetyl/smoke and the diacetyl/liquid/vapor, wethinks.
Could it be as simple as it's not fluid turning to a vapor (?), but rather the chemical that has dried and then been burned? Perhaps the combustion and/or the tar (or bazillions of other variables) somehow affects it? ???
Or...
Perhaps diacetyl is a naturally occuring chemical in tobacco (or one that created from burning) VS the synthetic chemical that is in the butter/creamy flavors? And the naturally occuring chemical is less harmful? Afterall, there is naturally occuring diacetyl in butter, but we've never seen reports of bronchiolitis obliterans from people who spent their lives working in dairies or bakeries.
We're not chemists, but we've been doing as much research as we have time to do, and we're finding there seems to be a lot of different chemicals that fall under the name "diacetyl". We found these in just a few minutes (all "diacetyl", but apparently all chemically different):
2,3-diacetyl-5-methyl-
2,3-diacetyl-1-(1-methylethyl)-
2,3-diacetyl-4-(1-methylethyl)-
2,3-Butanadione
All we know for sure is that the "diacetyl/diketones" in the artificial/synthetic food flavors are the same as the ones in the popcorn flavoring (and the ones used for testing all the animals)....and that we think manufacturer's have an obligation to every vaper to adequately test & reveal what is in the flavors they sell - so that every vaper has a right to make whatever 'informed choice' they choose to make.
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You are perfect example of someone who is truly in touch with their body, what it is doing, how stuff feels.
Most people do not adhere to a truly "clean" diet/lifestyle so they are not as aware of what each chemical (and all foodstuffs are chemical in that our bodies deal with them on that level) does to us and how each makes us feel.
Having gone thru the agony (but very illuminating process)(of a true "elimination diet" for food sensitivities, and eating 100% organically, I can tell you that I know w/in 20 minutes now if something is going to slow my energy, alter my emotions, or make some part of my body feel bad. In order to do that, you have to do the elimination quite scientifically and sytematically.
So yeah, I get what you are saying about certain eliquids, and I could actually go into detail about what each flavoring, pg/vg ratio, etc. does to "me" but that is personal and also strictly valid for my metabolism only.....so I won't.
I use vaping as a harm reduction protocol only and for me it's not about the nicotine so much as the hand to mouth thing, which I'm not quite sure yet how to "solve".
BTW, how do you feel about "minty" flavorings? I can vape unflavored with just a tiny drop of peppermint or something, seems to work and not be on the above lists?
I don't do diacetyls/acetoins however I am of the belief that not putting anything extra into my lungs is the best path forward, and most of the time I do not inhale now either, so that is how I reduce my harm for now.
Thanks for discussing that, we2. Nothing conclusive there, but darn interesting points to consider.
Please understand that many people are not drinking tap water for instance. Many people in my community have distillers that distill the water. We have a local farm that raises clean meat (grass fed, no chemicals, etc.) as well as numerous folks who grow organic vegetables.
In this day and age it's really *not* that difficult to avoid a lot of the "crap" you speak about.
You are right that there are many risks in life. However, it is fully possible to minimize them as much as humanly possible, i.e., what is within your control.
I read this topic from that standpoint....people who are interested in minimizing their vaping risks substantially and materially as much as possible.
Some people say it's absurd given that we were once smokers and doing all this damage. I feel the opposite. It is precisely BECAUSE we smoked and did damage that we are now left with lungs that are not at all 100% healthy, as an ex smoker I know my lungs have been abused. So, to that end, I am going to be as kind to them as possible.
I was handling some 100 mg nicotine, and even though there was plenty of ventilation, I got a buzz out of the fumes. Of course I immediately stopped, but I must confess I enjoyed the buzz - so much that for a full thirty minutes afterwards, I felt no need to vape, which for me is somewhat unusual. It made me think, if someone invented a safe way to "sniff" the fumes, I would be the first customer in line. No more wrapping coils and filling tanks, no more "steam" into my lungs, and no more chemicals to inhale - except for nicotine of course.... For now, I am enjoying my unflavored nicotine.... And I am vaping less because of it. For me, half the chase was in pursuit of flavors I love. But I figure if I like the taste of chocolate, I can always eat some, not vape some.
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