Genisis, Voltage Regulation & VV

[9ball_AJ]

I have been vaping with Genesis style atties exclusively for a while now, and I have come to the conclusion that voltage regulation is no longer a feature that is important to me. Because of the flexibility of being able to build a wick and coil system that will perform how I want it to, Variable Voltage follows suit in this realization. When I was using carto tanks, my thoughts on this were much different. A 2 ohm carto on an unregulated 18350 battery would only last me 2 hours max before it didn't perform up to par. An 18500 was better, but voltage drop would still be to great too quick for me to be satisfied for very long. Regulated voltage became to be a requirement for me.

This is not the case with a Genesis. I setup my coil so it is just a hair too hot/harsh when the battery is fully charged (about 1.5ish ohms), and within 10 minutes or so the vape is awesome! An 18350 will last me 4-6 hours, and I get 6-8 or more easily with the 18500. Carrying extra batteries around is not of any issue to me, and I usually have 5 18350's, 3 18500's, and 6 10440's in my backpack or vehicle including the batteries in my PV's at any given time. By the time I notice the vape quality has diminished to the point to where I think it is time to change batteries out, my setup is still giving me a good amount of vapor and I could probably go another hour before being totally dissatisfied.

Variable Voltage and/or Voltage Regulation are still desirable features, but the overall size of my device has become more important. I have 2 Provari Mini's, and they sit at home. I have a P+18500, it sits at home. Both of these are fabulous PV's and perform very well, both give me regulated voltage and/or variable voltage through the use of a kick in the P+, but both are too large for me to carry around all day. I have been using a P+18350/Short DID, or more recently a Wizard's Apprentice 18500/Short DID anytime I am away from home. I still use a Little Sister Varicool Mod with a Mini DID for a stealth/backup setup. It performs really well, and is small enough to throw in my pocket, and the VV feature is sure nice to have.

I work 60+ hours a week, plus go to school, and I am at the pool hall 2-3 nights a week, so I don't spend a lot of time at home. When I am at home, I love the vape that I get from a Provari/ZAP, and the size doesn't bother me. But when I am away from home, I find it cumbersome to carry such a large setup around. The fact that the ZAP isn't pocketable for several reasons doesn't help either, and that contributes to my decision to leave it at home.

What is it about the Genesis setup that makes it perform so much better on a large range of loaded voltage?

 

[j4mmin42]

Part of the answer to your question has to do with the increase in wicking that you can achieve when your genny is set up correctly. Another piece of the puzzle is the fact that an SS/coil setup is very inert by nature, so if and when it overheats, it can be much more forgiving than other atty designs. What you would probably notice the most with a genny is that if you were to wrap a 2.1-2.5 or higher ohm coil and run the voltage below something like 3.5, there's always a very sharp decrease in vapor/TH. That's probably their biggest downfall: most Genesis systems I've come across seem to do better when they're fired a bit warmer than standard atomizers. Anyway, glad to hear you're having success!

 

[paulishuku]

I get what you're saying but the thing about a good vv device is that is can deliver the desired voltage until the battery dies. So on a mechanical mod the battery starts at 4.2 the hits around 3.1 volts before it dies. On a provari the device stays exactly what you set it at until the battery dies and gives you the exact same hit every time

 

[JPoodles]

Variable Voltage and/or Voltage Regulation are still desirable features, but the overall size of my device has become more important. I have 2 Provari Mini's, and they sit at home. I have a P+18500, it sits at home. Both of these are fabulous PV's and perform very well, both give me regulated voltage and/or variable voltage through the use of a kick in the P+, but both are too large for me to carry around all day. I have been using a P+18350/Short DID, or more recently a Wizard's Apprentice 18500/Short DID anytime I am away from home. I still use a Little Sister Varicool Mod with a Mini DID for a stealth/backup setup. It performs really well, and is small enough to throw in my pocket, and the VV feature is sure nice to have.

What is it about the Genesis setup that makes it perform so much better on a large range of loaded voltage?

IMO vv is about finding that "sweet" spot. Not all coils are going to be the same ohm although you can get them close. AND after a bit of use the resistance of your coil will change in a geni because of buildup. Its insigificant to some or maybe most. It's just a personal thing. Now that variable wattage is gaining it may become less desireable but for now I personally prefer vv.

...If you want to part with one of your minis or the P+ because you don't utilize it...I'm shopping

p.s. How's the vape scene in Seattle? Just curious...I used to live there but started vaping after my move.

 

[9ball_AJ]

Part of the answer to your question has to do with the increase in wicking that you can achieve when your genny is set up correctly. Another piece of the puzzle is the fact that an SS/coil setup is very inert by nature, so if and when it overheats, it can be much more forgiving than other atty designs. What you would probably notice the most with a genny is that if you were to wrap a 2.1-2.5 or higher ohm coil and run the voltage below something like 3.5, there's always a very sharp decrease in vapor/TH. That's probably their biggest downfall: most Genesis systems I've come across seem to do better when they're fired a bit warmer than standard atomizers. Anyway, glad to hear you're having success!

I have come to the same conclusions, which is why I believe super low resistance coils work for many people without burning the juice. I have found my sweet spot at aroun 1.4-1.5 Ohm. I played around with high resistance coils on the Provari with the hopes of increasing the total surface area of the coil, but ended up back to low resistance as it just performed better at the same wattage.

I get what you're saying but the thing about a good vv device is that is can deliver the desired voltage until the battery dies. So on a mechanical mod the battery starts at 4.2 the hits around 3.1 volts before it dies. On a provari the device stays exactly what you set it at until the battery dies and gives you the exact same hit every time

That is exactly what I mean when I refer to voltage regulation. I guess my point is that a steady voltage is no longer as important to me as it was with cartos. The difference in the quality of vape is much less between the two extremes of the battery charge level. IOW I am just as happy at 3.6V as 4.1V with a genny. (I consider 3.4V to be a dead battery...)

IMO vv is about finding that "sweet" spot. Not all coils are going to be the same ohm although you can get them close. AND after a bit of use the resistance of your coil will change in a geni because of buildup. Its insigificant to some or maybe most. It's just a personal thing. Now that variable wattage is gaining it may become less desireable but for now I personally prefer vv.

...If you want to part with one of your minis or the P+ because you don't utilize it...I'm shopping

p.s. How's the vape scene in Seattle? Just curious...I used to live there but started vaping after my move.

I agree about the sweet spot, but I just can't tell that much difference between 12 watts versus 9 watts. SOME juices taste much different in this range, but most that I have vaped in a genny don't. It is sure nice to have VV or VW, but I prefer a small PV with as much battery life as I can muster, and there just aren't any options in a PV the size of the P+18350. The WA 18500 is a tad smaller and can accommodate an 18350 with a kick, but I only get 3 hours tops battery life, and I would much rather just run an 18500.

With a carto tank, the large size of the Provari was tolerable, as it far outperformed a mech. 3.7V mod, but with a Genny, that is just not the case...for me anyway.

Not looking to offload any gear just yet, buy maybe soon...

As far as Seattle goes, I don't run into too many other vapers, but I am a pretty busy guy. There is a large group in the Tacoma area, and The Vaporium is a pretty sweet B&M. There is actually a vape meet tonight in Tacoma I will be attending. Should be 100-150 people there. Most of the other vapers I know of in Western Washington are scattered all over, and I only know they exist because of ECF. Snohomish County really needs a vaping shop, and I would love to open one. Maybe after I finish school, who knows...

 

[JPoodles]

Snohomish County really needs a vaping shop, and I would love to open one. Maybe after I finish school, who knows...

I would love to help with a project like that...I'm missing Seattle daily. I would have thought there was one already and was going to look one up when I visit in December. Maybe I'll just shop around for locations instead Hope you had fun at the meet and KIT if for nothing other than to unload some gear....

to get back to the thread at hand...the variable ability is really only necessary to have when the drop is noticeable enough to affect your enjoyment. It sounds like you have a handle on it. I personally noticed a huge drop in performance with fixed pv's from start of batt to finish. That's why I went with vv. Well that and I liked switching the amounts of coil loops til I found what works for me. Now that I've found my optimal setup, vv just gives me peace of mind that my volts aren't dropping. I really only bump it up when my coil gets bogged down with gunk.

 

[st0nedpenguin]

The unregulated voltage drop was too much for me, swapping an 18650 out once it hits 3.8v was just absurd.