high curve and overwhelming

[trutest]

I can see why e-cigs maybe aren't catching on like one might think.......talk about a high learning curve. I don't mean using (pretty straightforward there), but brands, juice, and so forth.

And first let me preface by saying I've spent HOURS reading in here. It's getting to be overwhelming on amount of stuff and time investment. I really don't want to spend another 6 hours reading reviews, bad vendor warnings, or the HUGE list of vendors to checkout.

So, I've spent several hundred on a couple brands to try. (lol, and trying to keep track of what charger with which unit,,,,,getting confusing). One works pretty good but it is either not enough (like hot air) or harder pull and it makes me cough and taste like crap. Tastes like I am sucking on a disco smoke machine. Other ones (510 and 901) really don't give off much (yes batteries are charged, juice is in there, and they are brand new).

None of the 4 I got have very good charging systems. WTF is with all the USB chargers, lol. Made for people that live in front of their computer or something? bleh. A few others seem cheap, no good connection, etc. I'd prefer to buy quality and not worry about price. Never found anything that rates them with the top ones or something (except huge posts going on and on abuot this one or that one). Spending 3 hours reading reviews isn't helpful.

Would be nice to be easier to find a ranking or rating system on both the units themselves and also juice. I can already see a HUGE upper & lower range of quality in these things as well as the juice quality. Who makes the really good stuff? Top quality units? I CAN see there are quite a few sellers out there that are real crap. I'd rather pay more for a really well made system.

Or, are there really just 2-3 mfg and the rest are just reselling the same thing?

I don't want to invest another 16 hours on computer or $700 (or whatever) in e-cigs to find good quality. That and so many places are OUT of everything.

 

[JerriB]

As far as juice I'd say Dawn from ecigsmokestore.com is the best. Shes in las vegas, and makes her own, from scratch, very good, damn good prices, only 2 fallbacks, paypal droppped her so shes gotta find another way and her time to make your oreder can take anywhere from 24 hors to a week, depends on how many orders shes got. And if she dont have it, tell her what you want, she will do her best to make it. Far as PV's Ive only had a 901, and just last week got a janty stick. It kicks the 901's ....

 

[Jim Davis]

trutest;
Sadly enough, there is a learning curve with any of the models. Each person is different. You can go with suggestions and opinions, but in the end, you have to decide what's best for you.

A ranking or rating system is again only opinions, and some folks are not objective, which is a shame.

If I told you my preferences, others may disagree. Then your research falls apart. All I can suggest is to read, research, and read between the lines.

An e-cig is an electronic gadget that needs care, and maintenance. Anyone that firmly insists on one specific type is not interested in your best interest.

I suggest;
1.) Read the Technical Issues Forum.
2.) Read the Model Specific Forums.
3.) Read the Modders Forums.
4.) Check the Reviews.
5.) Take all comments with a grain of salt.
6.) Narrow your choices down, and compare.

This is my personal opinion.
jd

 

[dragonpuff]

I can see why e-cigs maybe aren't catching on like one might think.......talk about a high learning curve. I don't mean using (pretty straightforward there), but brands, juice, and so forth.

And first let me preface by saying I've spent HOURS reading in here. It's getting to be overwhelming on amount of stuff and time investment. I really don't want to spend another 6 hours reading reviews, bad vendor warnings, or the HUGE list of vendors to checkout.

So, I've spent several hundred on a couple brands to try. (lol, and trying to keep track of what charger with which unit,,,,,getting confusing). One works pretty good but it is either not enough (like hot air) or harder pull and it makes me cough and taste like crap. Tastes like I am sucking on a disco smoke machine. Other ones (510 and 901) really don't give off much (yes batteries are charged, juice is in there, and they are brand new).

None of the 4 I got have very good charging systems. WTF is with all the USB chargers, lol. Made for people that live in front of their computer or something? bleh. A few others seem cheap, no good connection, etc. I'd prefer to buy quality and not worry about price. Never found anything that rates them with the top ones or something (except huge posts going on and on abuot this one or that one). Spending 3 hours reading reviews isn't helpful.

Would be nice to be easier to find a ranking or rating system on both the units themselves and also juice. I can already see a HUGE upper & lower range of quality in these things as well as the juice quality. Who makes the really good stuff? Top quality units? I CAN see there are quite a few sellers out there that are real crap. I'd rather pay more for a really well made system.

Or, are there really just 2-3 mfg and the rest are just reselling the same thing?

I don't want to invest another 16 hours on computer or $700 (or whatever) in e-cigs to find good quality. That and so many places are OUT of everything.

If you've already got a few different models, then you shouldn't have to invest any more money in getting at least one of them to work for you (except for, perhaps, the right liquid).

It would be easier for us to help you if we knew what you have and what exactly you are looking for.

What models do you have? I see that you have the 901 and the 510, but you said you have 4 models so what else? What flavor/strength liquid do you have and where did you buy it from?

What are you looking for? More vapor, strong throat hit, longer battery life? What else?

The reason these "rating systems" you suggest don't exist is because everyone is looking for something different, and every model offers something different. Its like clothing; a particular t-shirt might be popular, well-made, etc, but if t-shirts aren't your cup of tea then perhaps you should go with button-down. See what i mean?

Please, help us help you

 

[trutest]

Nothing personal but....see that's the thing - in here everyone will post up and promote themselves (either directly or indirectly), or, they haven't tried but 2-3 suppliers or e-gi units. So you get threads going on and on and on about this one, that one, another one. Pretty soon it's just a 15 page thread and nothing really helps except maybe the one thread about who NOT to go with (which is useful too).

But many people, myself included, get a bit burned out with huge threads to try and weed through. And to go through the "vendor" section here would take hours upon hours. Who has that kind of time! (maybe that's why they all come with usb chargers,,,,,lol, you are stuck at the computer for days on end....). j/k.

I don't mind spending on some trials and errors but with such a huge forum surely there would (could) be some sort of larger scale consensus on quality and top products.

I'm sure many new users would feel the same way. Which one? From who? Why? A thread with just a ton of people posting up and promoting without showing basis seems iffy.

I'd rather pay 150 over 40 dollars for a quality product. I also think that'd make or break someone continuing to use it (or not). Right now I don't like them. They don't come close to having a real cigarette. I'm not trying to be negative and really want to give e-cig a shot as well as promote to others if I like it. But.......the excitement is wearing off and being burnt out with so much variety in products, etc.

Same with juice. I'd rather know there was some real production (commerically) rather than someone mixing up stuff in their spare bedroom or whatever. Know what I mean? Inhaling into my lungs something without any assurance of ingredients or quality control makes me nervous. I'd think many would feel the same way. How the heck would you know the mixing quality or environment being done. For all I know the mixing room has rats full of hanta virus (okay, an extreme but trying to make a point).

So, I guess what I am looking for is who. Who sells the very top quality units and good, pure, quality stuff. Price doesn't matter since buying crap stuff ends up just wasting money on junk. I'd rather have a $150 unit instead of 5 $40 ones if they are crappy (random prices, just for making my point).

So, does a person really have to ready 350 reviews and vendor websites to settle on a good unit or not getting lesser stuff? If so, I can see a lot of people trying briefly and then returning to real cigarretes. The crappy ones will kill the marketing for everyone else (i.e. - it's in the top vendor/mfg's interest to promote why theirs is best, with true and proven info if this is expected to grow in use at the best rate)

 

[Moonflame]

For juice I've also had good results both in flavor and in time for shipping and good service from Good Prophets and MyFreedomSmokes.

As for quality units, if you're willing to spend the money a battery mod is a great investment. I have the Adaptever and love it. Very sturdy, choice between 3.7v and 6v if you use the extension sleeve. Consistent vapor and it uses real batteries with more reliable chargers. The batteries for mods also last a lot longer. As far as I know they are currently in stock. I've also ordered the VP2 (but there is a wait for it) and from reviews it seems to be a good unit.

As far as vapor production, most attys have a break in period of a day to a few days before they are up to their full potential. Even as heavy as I vape it takes at least a day or 2 before I am happy with a new atty.

It is a lot to absorb and a lot to learn, but it is so worth it. And we are all here for moral support or to answer questions.

 

[trutest]

Yes Jim, understood. It's just EXTREMELY time consuming reading all of this. I understand learning curve and have invested many hours in reading here. However I still can't onjectively say that I see where the best ones are.

I guess I'd like to stick with larger commerical mfg's and want to steer away from backyard "get on the bandwagon for a few bucks from home" suppliers/mfg's. I think quality control and so forth is best served that way.

As for juice, so far seems either nothing much there or a coughing fit. And so far all juice tested falls into that categories. They either taste like crap or there's no throat hit at all.

Yes, understand the shirt analogy but we're talking about cigarettes. Something I never consider to require investment of 40 hours research or trial-error use of 20 bottles of liquid on e-cigs.

I was excited about e-cigs until I came in here and realized just how many types, brands, vendors, opinions, etc. there was. I guess it was just overwhelming. I hadn't planned on it taking this amount of my time to get 'into' them.

 

[Jim Davis]

It's like I said. Everyone is different.
You state that money is no object. In this case, most will tell you to go with the heavy duty mods.
Prodigy
SD
GG
Zi Moshi
Personally, I'm not into the mods, so there are more that I'm not thinking of. Check them out. I'm thinking, with your preferences, you'll be satisfied with one of them.

Good luck;
jd

 

[JerseyGirl]

The problem is, there really is no general consensus on which model/brand/supplier is the best.

You've asked your questions, and now you're going to get lots of people coming on here, giving their opinions on the answers. Everyone's opinion will differ, because: 1) People's needs and tastes are different, and 2) As you mentioned, most people haven't tried the whole range of models, so they can't give you a truly objective opinion that encompasses the entire range of options.

Most of the folks on here have no special interest in promoting a particular model or supplier, it's just what they've personally tried and had success with. Most of these opinions are going to be in good faith. But if you're expecting them all to concur, you're going to be disappointed. You may narrow it down to a few choices by asking other people, but at a certain point, some research on your part is going to be inevitable.

 

[trutest]

For juice I've also had good results both in flavor and in time for shipping and good service from Good Prophets and MyFreedomSmokes.

As for quality units, if you're willing to spend the money a battery mod is a great investment. I have the Adaptever and love it. Very sturdy, choice between 3.7v and 6v if you use the extension sleeve. Consistent vapor and it uses real batteries with more reliable chargers. The batteries for mods also last a lot longer. As far as I know they are currently in stock. I've also ordered the VP2 (but there is a wait for it) and from reviews it seems to be a good unit.

As far as vapor production, most attys have a break in period of a day to a few days before they are up to their full potential. Even as heavy as I vape it takes at least a day or 2 before I am happy with a new atty.

It is a lot to absorb and a lot to learn, but it is so worth it. And we are all here for moral support or to answer questions.

Thanks moonflame.

ex: see already I look at the clock and I've spent the last 2 hours on this entire e-cig thing. LOL, I didn't expect to have to learn so much for something as simple as an e-cig.

Yes, I did buy a couple hundred $ @ goodprophets and Rob is very helpful. But he's just a reseller and doesn't address which units to go with. I do have to call him though because one of the PCC I have charged up okay but won't do anything when a battery is put in it. The directions didn't even address putting the battery in and it won't work.

Breakin time? That's news and good to know. Would be nice if some of these things had decent instructions and info like that with them.

No idea what battery mod or adaptever is.

Seems to be an entire subculture for these things, lol.

 

[trutest]

It's like I said. Everyone is different.
You state that money is no object. In this case, most will tell you to go with the heavy duty mods.
Prodigy
SD
GG
Zi Moshi
Personally, I'm not into the mods, so there are more that I'm not thinking of. Check them out. I'm thinking, with your preferences, you'll be satisfied with one of them.

Good luck;
jd

So...mod = they have taken a major mfg's product and made it to their own specs? Or do they produce (mfg) their own. I'll check those out time permitting. Already blown my entire morning in here, lol.

One thing I noticed is the vendor section. I wondered: if a vendor gets a lot of negative or bad reviews are they still represented here? I mean, does this forum have standards they must meet to remain or get listed? It looked like not. This is worse that breakfast cereal choices. lol.

Thanks to all posters on replies. Nice to get answers and help. I'll invest some more time and see. I'm hoping not to go through hundreds of more dollars though. I already have some stuff that will likely end up in a box unused or thrown in garbage.

 

[Applejackson]

You have to figure out which suits yoi best (and that means watching/reading reviews). Paying more does NOT insure quality in this industry. You might as well ask what's definitively the best beer?

 

[Jim Davis]

If you have a complaint about a vendor, we suggest you contact the vendor first. If you don't get satisfaction, you're free to discuss it in the general forum, as long as the discussion remains civil, and constructive.

The Mods, are modifications to the standard e-cigs with heavy duty batteries, machined cases, and modified components. Some give massive hits, and vapor.

Sort of like rebuilding the family car for the race track.

jd

 

[trutest]

The problem is, there really is no general consensus on which model/brand/supplier is the best.

You've asked your questions, and now you're going to get lots of people coming on here, giving their opinions on the answers. Everyone's opinion will differ, because: 1) People's needs and tastes are different, and 2) As you mentioned, most people haven't tried the whole range of models, so they can't give you a truly objective opinion that encompasses the entire range of options.

Most of the folks on here have no special interest in promoting a particular model or supplier, it's just what they've personally tried and had success with. Most of these opinions are going to be in good faith. But if you're expecting them all to concur, you're going to be disappointed. You may narrow it down to a few choices by asking other people, but at a certain point, some research on your part is going to be inevitable.

Trying to do my research yes. Was just a lot more than prepared to going into it. Tried one from a friend, thought, hey cool will try, then came in here and got blown away but the entire following and hundreds of choices and decisions.

I look at the poster's post count and rank when considering their opinion. Too bad there wasn't a section that had parameters run by the site (unbiased) to list the top ones. I can't imagine all those on that huge vendor list are all in the same range of quality, service, stock.

Was hoping to (as a minimum) to narrow down the choices to top end ones and more commercial quality. Nothing worse than starting out and trying this with defective or poorly made stuff IMO.

ModernVapor is one I've tried too. Seems nice, well made, convenient pcc, etc, charger works well so far, good amount vapor. Tastes like crap though. Tried some other juice. Can't tell much difference at all.

Thanks!

 

[dragonpuff]

Many would say that the best quality units would be the larger mods, like the screwdriver, prodigy, etc. However, if you're looking for something that resembles a cigarette, that may not be the best way to go.

In my opinion (and i'd be hard-pressed to find people disagreeing with me here), the 901 and 510 ARE high-quality units, and like i said before, you can make them work for you.

As Jim said above, you have to learn how to use an e-cig, they just don't work like analog cigarettes and it takes some practice. You have to draw on it longer, all the parts are reuseable and you have to maintain them, etc. Seeing as how you already own 4 units, i really don't believe a 5th one is the answer for you; you may continue to have the same problems. You have to learn how to use the ones you have.

If it is not satisfying, that's often because of the liquid rather than the model. I don't know what mg of nicotine you're using, but try going one step up (like from 18mg to 24mg) and see if that works. Also, the flavor has a direct impact on throat hit-- stronger flavor, stronger hit. As much as i like sweet stuff, i prefer tobacco and coffee flavors for their throat hit.

Nhaler.com liquid is very popular around here, you might wanna give them a try. Also, Johnson's Creek has been working on quality control testing for their liquids. Give these guys a shot and see if it helps.

 

[trutest]

You have to figure out which suits yoi best (and that means watching/reading reviews). Paying more does NOT insure quality in this industry. You might as well ask what's definitively the best beer?

Yes, I realize that. However I wasn't prepared for 12 hours of research on something as basic as this. I had no idea there was 1,083,493 choices and 60 vendor/mfg's. Just overwhelmed with info.......it's not easy to come in new and expect to read 50 threads 27 pages long, so to speak.

Jim - I have no complaints at all no. I just didn't know if there were some standards that listed vendors were expected to meet.

 

[sherid]

Nothing personal but....see that's the thing - in here everyone will post up and promote themselves (either directly or indirectly), or, they haven't tried but 2-3 suppliers or e-gi units. So you get threads going on and on and on about this one, that one, another one. Pretty soon it's just a 15 page thread and nothing really helps except maybe the one thread about who NOT to go with (which is useful too).

But many people, myself included, get a bit burned out with huge threads to try and weed through. And to go through the "vendor" section here would take hours upon hours. Who has that kind of time! (maybe that's why they all come with usb chargers,,,,,lol, you are stuck at the computer for days on end....). j/k.

I don't mind spending on some trials and errors but with such a huge forum surely there would (could) be some sort of larger scale consensus on quality and top products.

I'm sure many new users would feel the same way. Which one? From who? Why? A thread with just a ton of people posting up and promoting without showing basis seems iffy.

I'd rather pay 150 over 40 dollars for a quality product. I also think that'd make or break someone continuing to use it (or not). Right now I don't like them. They don't come close to having a real cigarette. I'm not trying to be negative and really want to give e-cig a shot as well as promote to others if I like it. But.......the excitement is wearing off and being burnt out with so much variety in products, etc.

Same with juice. I'd rather know there was some real production (commerically) rather than someone mixing up stuff in their spare bedroom or whatever. Know what I mean? Inhaling into my lungs something without any assurance of ingredients or quality control makes me nervous. I'd think many would feel the same way. How the heck would you know the mixing quality or environment being done. For all I know the mixing room has rats full of hanta virus (okay, an extreme but trying to make a point).

So, I guess what I am looking for is who. Who sells the very top quality units and good, pure, quality stuff. Price doesn't matter since buying crap stuff ends up just wasting money on junk. I'd rather have a $150 unit instead of 5 $40 ones if they are crappy (random prices, just for making my point).

So, does a person really have to ready 350 reviews and vendor websites to settle on a good unit or not getting lesser stuff? If so, I can see a lot of people trying briefly and then returning to real cigarretes. The crappy ones will kill the marketing for everyone else (i.e. - it's in the top vendor/mfg's interest to promote why theirs is best, with true and proven info if this is expected to grow in use at the best rate)

I've bought just about everything out there and am still trying more. My Dura is my favorite at the moment. I have a VP1 on order now, VAPRLIFE, VP1, VP2, E CIGARETTE, E-CIG, VAPOR, BATTERY and I have high hopes for that one. I also have a Stick, but I am not exactly a huge fan. If money were not a concern, I would probably order a GreenCig G-300 With Charging Case(Shorter Batteries) - NHaler As for juices, I would say that Drew at Nhaler probably gets the most rave reviews. I love Janty USA - HOME liquid, but they are pricey. If you do order from them, try the rum and capuccino....excellent. You are right though. It is hard to sort through the mess and bias to get to the nitty gritty. I don't like that either. If you want honest talk, here it is.

 

[trutest]

Thanks dragonpuff.

Yeah, I didn't really want to carry around a big smoking machine or anything

I'll go back sometime today and try each again and diff liquids. So far the diff liquids I tried don't seem to have any change much, same with mg content.

With a little more time and effort I'm sure I'll have a better handle on it. I've just already spent several entiure mornings and stay up late trying to research. More time consuming that expected for something I thought would be pretty simple. 2-3 hours won't seem to do it. Neither the 6-8 I've already spent on here reading.

 

[JerseyGirl]

Was hoping to (as a minimum) to narrow down the choices to top end ones and more commercial quality. Nothing worse than starting out and trying this with defective or poorly made stuff IMO.

One of the problems is that, as you suspected, many of these are manufactured by the same company and then just resold. So a 510 from one vendor will be identical to a 510 from another vendor (with some exceptions). So when people recommend one supplier over another, it often comes down to factors like price, shipping, warranty, and customer service.

The bigger differences are between ecig models, not vendors. So I would suggest that you read the model reviews and settle on which one is right for you, THEN look into which suppliers carry it and offer the best deals and service.

Same thing with juice - up to 90% of the liquid sold by suppliers comes from the same manufacturer, DeKang, so if you like the standard DK juice, you're all set. If not, you have some more searching to do, but there are plenty of other options out there. It all comes down to your personal preferences, and no one here is a better judge of that than you...

 

[trutest]

Sherid, thanks. Will check them out. You rank and post count makes your recommendations of value.