how come people don't refer to heat/watt/power in reviews and comments?

[jp6608]

If I speak in gibberish nonsense and mis use terms and whatnot, then you've guess right.. i'm a noob. So, please don't beat me up too much in here.

I've read a lot of posts and watched a lot of reviews regarding cartomisers, atomizers, voltage, resistance, battery size, but one thing I don't come across often is wattage (aka power aka heat).

It seems to me that the watts is the most important thing when you considering mods, cartos or atomizers and voltage rating and everything else, yet I hardly see it mentioned. Before I got my first kit, I started looking up reviews on youtube. I kept coming across these numbers like "3.7" or "5.0" or "6.0" volts and assumed that those numbers equaled heat. yeah.. i know.. /facepalm.

Using your favorite carto, atomizer, battery mod, etc all boils down to how hot the coils get when you press the magic button and how many times you can press that button right?

I wonder if it would be easier on noobies like myself if people state the temp/wattage/power when they vape their favorite juices.

For example..
"When I vape Kick Bass Vapor's warm sugar cookie juice, I like to set my vv box mod to 3.7 volts using my 2.6 fluxomizer which gives me about 5.2 watts/power/heat."

Or better yet, when people do juice reviews.. maybe state the watts/power... and maybe do a range and how it effects the juice from their point of view.

For example..
When I vape Kick Bass Vapor's warm sugar cookie juice, I didn't taste the flavor until I get about 3.2 watts on the heating coils. The flavor really kicks in when you bring up the watts to about 5.0. In my opinion, the sweet spot for this juice is around 4.5 to 6.5 watts. The flavor seems to get a burnt taste when I tried it over 9 watts. So for those of you running on a 3.7 mod, you may want to consider using cartos at blah blah resistance to get the best flavor/vapor out of this juice. (yes, i'm totally making up numbers here..)

Anyways, just random thoughts that I decided to share to complete strangers on the internet at 5:30am on a sleepless night

 

[Killjoy1]

Well, your average vaper doesn't think in terms of watts. Determining wattage level just involves too much math, anyway

Right now, there's only one device on the market that displays wattage: the Darwin. It's an awesome mod, but is the only one where the user thinks in terms of watts instead of voltage or ohms. most people are perfectly happy to play around with voltage or ohms to get their preferred vape, which is the way it's been done from the start, and there's nothing wrong with this. The end result is the same either way (I can get an equally satisfying vape on my Provari without ever thinking about watts)

 

[Stownz]

Because watts is still only part of the equation. Case in point is the performance of an atty running 10 watts: 10 watts on a 1.5 ohm coil does not perform the same as 10 watts on a 3.0 ohm coil or remotely close to 10 watts on a dual coil atty.

Things that effect performance of an atty and coil:
1) Surface area of coil - wire gauge and # of wraps
2)type of wire - Kanthal, Nichrome, cheap china alloy
3)airflow across the coil - bottom, side
4)Juice mix you are using on every combination

The whole situation becomes really clear once you start building you own attys. You can write everything down that lead to a great vape, just like DIY mixing. Its an entire package deal, not just the amount of power running through. There is a recipe, and Fantastic One, that will rock your world. These huge amounts of combinations are not solved by telling someone: "I like 2.5 ohm Joye 510s at 8 watts". That is no more helpful then someone saying the same thing using volts instead of watts, or telling me they like BWB juice. I personaly like 1.5 ohm Dual Coil cartos running at 20 watts--- see? subjective.

Only thing watts really helps is showing the limitations of current mods out there, and I prefer Amps as the reference to limits not even watts. Provari and Darwin can't push 3 amps, Darwin can't go over 12.5 watts, Buzz Pro can't even push 6 volts (LOL), ect.. ect.. Knowing the limits of a device will help make informed buying decisions, but doesn't really help finding a great vape.

Recipe for Great Vape: DIY Mixing + VV mod with LARGE range of voltage adjustment and high Amp protection + DIY Rebuildable Attys. All of this combined will allow you to blueprint one increadible vape that you and only you will love.

In the end its not about math, its about what you love to vape and how you like to vape it.

 

[AlmightyGod]

Damn Stownz...that's one of the most objective & informative posts I've read about the great wattage vs voltage debate. Thank you for taking the time to type it all out. It almost deserves a "sticky" of it's own!

Well done man!

 

[jp6608]

I have to agree with AlmightyGod.

Thank you Stownz!

 

[tj99959]

I agree Stownz, yet also disagree at the same times.
I'm sure you would agree that the 20watts that you like would just melt the solder out of almost any commercial atomizer.
Most people will find their own sweet spot somewhere between 8 and 10watts, and I find knowing the wattage that I like gives me a good starting point when trying new stuff.
For those that say figuring out the wattage is to difficult, I guess they haven't found this.
Ohm's Law Calculator
This calculator also tell me how hard I am asking the battery to work (Amps)

I think the simplest guide that most newbies can understand, and use as a starting point to tailoring their equipment to fit their personal taste is:
1.5ohm @ 3.7v = 9watts
2.7ohm @ 5v = 9watts
4ohm @ 6v = 9watts

What I have found from personal experience is that after adjusting my stuff to my personal taste, and then crunching the numbers, it never fails to be running at 8 +/- 0.3 watts. Doesn't matter if I start out with a specific voltage from the power supply, or a specific Resistance from the atty/carto, when I get it to the flavor that I like the power range ends up being the same.

And no, I don't own a Darwin

 

[WomanOfHeart]

In the end its not about math, its about what you love to vape and how you like to vape it.

THIS ^^^^

That's the truth of it all, right there. If it tastes good and your vape is satisfying, then VAPE YOUR HEAD OFF! It doesn't matter if it's a ProVari or a 510 Mini.

 

[fantasyhus]

the average vaper dont want to know about watts etc

 

[emus]

I get a kick out of PV reviews; unless PV has a serious design flaw it will produce same vapor, flavor and TH as any other PV at same load voltage.
PV is basically a switched batt holder that powers atty/carto.
Hopefully enough current to power your fav LR carto.
I wish reviews would discuss PV max reliable current; the important bit.

 

[Stownz]

I agree Stownz, yet also disagree at the same times.
I'm sure you would agree that the 20watts that you like would just melt the solder out of almost any commercial atomizer.
Most people will find their own sweet spot somewhere between 8 and 10watts, and I find knowing the wattage that I like gives me a good starting point when trying new stuff.
For those that say figuring out the wattage is to difficult, I guess they haven't found this.
Ohm's Law Calculator
This calculator also tell me how hard I am asking the battery to work (Amps)

I think the simplest guide that most newbies can understand, and use as a starting point to tailoring their equipment to fit their personal taste is:
1.5ohm @ 3.7v = 9watts
2.7ohm @ 5v = 9watts
4ohm @ 6v = 9watts

What I have found from personal experience is that after adjusting my stuff to my personal taste, and then crunching the numbers, it never fails to be running at 8 +/- 0.3 watts. Doesn't matter if I start out with a specific voltage from the power supply, or a specific Resistance from the atty/carto, when I get it to the flavor that I like the power range ends up being the same.

And no, I don't own a Darwin

The dual and triple coils require a tad bit more math. Take a 1.5 ohm Dual Coil for instance. It is two 3.0 ohm coils wired together, even though the ohm load is technically 1.5, it acts like a 3.0 ohm. The 20 watts is split between two coils, so each one is run at 10. They don't melt anything, they don't even burn the polyfill, but they vape increadible. It started with dual coil cartos, now we have dual coil attys, there are even triple coil cartos out there. The rebuildable attys like the Ato-mizer and Bulli and Scuba all have room to wire in 2 coils. The surface area is increased 2x, and people can actually run less voltage but still produce the amount of vapor that makes them happy.

As great is the dual coils are, a large majority of the mods being produced won't run them to their maximum potential. They are un-impressive at low voltage, increadible when you crank them up: If you mod will do it. We all are guilty (those with VV) of cranking up our mods to get more and more vapor/flavor/th out of them. Guilty as well of burning up attys and cartos in pursuit of that. Solution to this problem was the multi-coil products.

 

[DonDaBoomVape]

I've played a lot with an online calculator similar to yours, Stownz. You are absolutely correct. As American Express used to say: "Don't leave home [i.e., try to calculate watts and amps] without it!" In the process, it has been brought home to me that the kindest-to-the-atty way to get moderate-to-high watts is with an HV atty/carto on an HV (or higher setting VV) mod. It has to do with the highlighted difference between these two formulas:

Amps = Volts / Ohms

Watts = Volts X Volts / Ohms​

So lowering resistance to get a more powerful vape has a greater negative impact on amps current than does increasing voltage.

All that having been said, for cost reasons, I decrease the resistance to get my kicks.

The dual and triple coils require a tad bit more math. Take a 1.5 ohm Dual Coil for instance. It is two 3.0 ohm coils wired together, even though the ohm load is technically 1.5, it acts like a 3.0 ohm. The 20 watts is split between two coils, so each one is run at 10. They don't melt anything, they don't even burn the polyfill, but they vape increadible. It started with dual coil cartos, now we have dual coil attys, there are even triple coil cartos out there. The rebuildable attys like the Ato-mizer and Bulli and Scuba all have room to wire in 2 coils. The surface area is increased 2x, and people can actually run less voltage but still produce the amount of vapor that makes them happy.

As great is the dual coils are, a large majority of the mods being produced won't run them to their maximum potential. They are un-impressive at low voltage, increadible when you crank them up: If you mod will do it. We all are guilty (those with VV) of cranking up our mods to get more and more vapor/flavor/th out of them. Guilty as well of burning up attys and cartos in pursuit of that. Solution to this problem was the multi-coil products.

That observation certainly is consistent with my experience. And, since I won't be able to afford a Buzz Pro (or the like) anytime soon*, LR single coils (e.g., Smok Tech 1.7, LR 801, or Elite 808) are for me.

* I'm blowing my semi-annual vaping budget on attending the upcoming VaperCon. [NOTE: Unlike recent "VapeFests," there is no charge at the door for the event, just those pesky airplane tickets, hotel bill, and restaurant charges ... not to mention bar bill, Halloween party costume, and whatever lower-cost items the sponsoring vendors seduce me into buying).]​

 

[emus]

All that having been said, for cost reasons, I decrease the resistance to get my kicks.
[/INDENT]

Curious if you've tried CE2?
I just use 4-5 watts w/ CE2.
More than 5w and easy to burn liquid.

 

[tj99959]

Curious if you've tried CE2?
I just use 4-5 watts w/ CE2.
More than 5w and easy to burn liquid.

But I hate CE2's-3's

 

[DonDaBoomVape]

But I hate CE2's-3's

You and me both, kid! Pain in the toochis to fill.

Pop off the top of a normal cartomizer (and later replace it with a drip tip), fill with carto cap method and/or by dripping 20+ drops (depending on capacity) onto the filler, and then top off via the drip tip: KISS.

 

[madjack]

But I hate CE2's-3's

...AMEN...way too fiddly for me..................

 

[MickeyRat]

Stowns is right but, knowing the watts has it's uses. At home I use a buzz with 2.5 ohm 901. I put a madvapes DOD on top of it so I don't have to bother aiming when I drip. I found where I liked it at around 4.5V but, that setup is too cumber some for out and about. I also have a couple 3.7 ohm bottom feeders and I'd rather use those when I'm out. So, go to the ohm's law calculator. At home I'm at 8.1 watts. So, for the same watts at 3.7V, I need 1.69 ohms. 1.8 is probably close enough. I picked up some IKV 1.8 ohm 901s. Not the same but, not all that far off for the convenience.

 

[wizard10000]

Because watts is still only part of the equation...

I agree Stownz, yet also disagree at the same times.
I'm sure you would agree that the 20watts that you like would just melt the solder out of almost any commercial atomizer.
Most people will find their own sweet spot somewhere between 8 and 10watts, and I find knowing the wattage that I like gives me a good starting point when trying new stuff.

I agree with both of you

the average vaper dont want to know about watts etc

Actually some of us do, because it provides a benchmark we can use to compare hardware. Stownz' comment about hardware variables is indeed true, but if I know how much power I need to make *me* happy then as tj said I've got a reference point.

Right now I'm using a KGO battery (3.8v under load) with a 1.4 ohm dual coil carto. I know that this setup draws a bit more than 10 watts because W=V²/R. I also know how 10 watts through a dual coil carto *should* work and I can get the same effect as a 5v mod with a 2.5 ohm carto - actually a tiny bit more effect.

Now we've established I like about ten watts. That means if I bought or built a 5v mod I probably wouldn't like an atomizer with a resistance higher than 2.5 ohms, but that if I wanted to increase performance over what I have now I'd either have to lower resistance on the 5v mod or keep the 2.5 ohm atty and increase voltage.

Again, this is a gross oversimplification - but it does help me know what to expect when considering hardware purchases.

 

[Richie G]

Actually some of us do, because it provides a benchmark we can use to compare hardware. Stownz' comment about hardware variables is indeed true, but if I know how much power I need to make *me* happy then as tj said I've got a reference point.

Exactly, right... it is a benchmark of sorts that is useful for comparison. Is it (watts) truly accurate? Well, not really. We associate different wattage of set ups to one another and decide what we like and stick to that. But, what we REALLY should be talking about is heat/temperature of the vapor. After all, there are different ways to get to X number of watts depending on voltage applied AND the resistance of the atty/carto, right?

Using heat as a standard won't happen though. It is akin to the consumer getting used to using watts as the benchmark in purchasing a light bulb from Home Depot. We know how bright a 60W bulb is as compared to a 100W bulb. Does wattage tell us how much actual light comes off that lamp/bulb? Not at all... that would be a measurement in lumens or more accurately in candela. No one needs to re-learn how to buy a light bulb. LOL So, we will continue to use wattage in reference to our vaping likes and dislikes because no one wants to make this any more confusing than it already can be. =)

 

[emus]

But I hate CE2's-3's

Interesting.
CE2 and I are the bestest of friends

 

[MTV]

very good post guys!