I Feel Like I Am Jousting At Windmills

[deeanne59]

I have written e-mails to my Congressmen and Senators, President Obama, online news organizations...posted comments on blogs, news articles, etc- and I am getting nowhere!

When I received my first e-cig (my trusty 510), I took it to work, showed it to my boss and explained how it worked and what it was for (my boss OWNS the company), and he told me that whatever helped me...he was all for, and gave me permission to vape in the plant. I have even converted 2 other smokers at work to e-cigs. This past Thursday (FDA Report?)...I get a call at home from the Human Resources Manager at work, "politely" asking me from now on to use my device during breaks and lunch only...AND in the SMOKING AREA only (unless I want to consign myself to my car).

I explained to him about all the time and expense I had gone through to get AWAY from cigarettes and second-hand smoke, but it fell on deaf ears. I don't want to belabor the point, or I will lose my job. I am at the point now where I feel like giving up and going back to analogs! At least THEY seem now to be accepted!

Between all of the expense (I am on a limited budget), and all of the fighting for our vaping rights (it seems the FDA and those in power don't want to listen)...what more can I do? I am being treated more like a leper NOW THAT I HAVE QUIT, even by my "smoking" friends...than I did as a smoker. They are upset at me because I can "do something they aren't allowed to do", and "I guess she doesn't want to be with us smokers now"
Plus, now I feel bad for getting others on these, only to have them placed in the same circumstances.

---END OF RANT----

 

[Michele]

But didn't you have pre-approval from the owner of the company?

 

[Jim Davis]

Nothing much you can do about. The government has been scaring the public for decades. They're good at it. Your tax dollars at work.

 

[mamu]

Hang in there Dee.

This is just scare tactics going on right now. It'll pass.

At least you'll still be around after your smoking friends croak and you can tell them "I told you so".

 

[OutWest]

Depending on how good of terms you are on with the boss, I would consider having a sit down with the boss, armed with http://www.starscientific.com/404/stepanov tsna in.pdf and http://www.starscientific.com/404/stepanov tsna in.pdf (one is in micrograms, the other nanograms)

When you convert to where there in same units it comes out to:
NicoDerm CQ 4mg nicotine patch - has 8 nanograms per patch
Nicorette 4mg nicotine gum - has 2 nanograms per piece of gum
Janty ecig cartridge - has 0.26 - 8.183 nanograms per cartridge, depending on nicotine strength, and I'd say a cartridge is, at minimum, 5 uses.

And I'd inquire as to if he'd make persons using the gum go sit in the smoking area.

 

[Chris From Cali]

It could be that your boss used HR to tell you to drop the cig, because he was to embarrassed to do it himself. Is there anywhere outside without the second hand smoke you can go? I know it sucks, but just like analogs it's going to take time for people to get used to ecig, they don't know what they are and they don't know what's inside. It's going to be your job to help educate them.

Because it replicates smoking so closely the natural reaction is going to be weary

 

[deeanne59]

My boss was the one that told HR to call me! Part of the problem is:

1) My boss is an ex-smoker [strike 1]

2) He decided it wasn't fair to the smokers for me to be able to use my
device indoors (since it "looks" like smoking) and they can't smoke
indoors [strike 2]
3) The plant manager got into a heated arguement with one of the
vaporers on day shift. He told the employee to put the device
away since it "looked" like he was smoking, and the employee refused.
He wound up blowing vapor in the plant managers' face, and almost
got himself fired over it. [strike 3]


How can you educate people and be sensible about vaping to others...when you have "idiots" out there that do more to destroy it than you can to try to save it!!!!

 

[Chris From Cali]

Yea that isn't cool at all, not the right way about going around things for sure.
They're going to give ecigs a bad name.

 

[deeanne59]

Thanks Mamu....I am coming up on 2 months without an analog, and I would HATE to throw it away now! I am trying everything I can now to "buffer" against a possible ban, but I don't have the $$$$$ to out-and-out stockpile....plus I want to cut my nic down a little at a time, my goal is to get down to 0 nic, and just vape to enjoy the flavors.

 

[bleck]

It seems to me that quitting vaping because you can't do it while your indoor at work seems trivial. Just because it's limited to the area and times that you were able to smoke analogues previously does not seem like a good reason to go back to analogues. If you feel it's healthier, why isn't that reason enough to continue? I feel that employers have a right to say you can't vape at work, during work etc.

Am I way off base in believing that this is being blown a bit out of proportion?

 

[deeanne59]

bleck....I guess my total frustration gets in the way sometimes. I am frustrated because of the FDA's scare tactics, I am frustated at the people who are believing the FDA hook-line-and sinker without checking the facts, I am in a little bit of a tight right now because my vaping is only keeping my cravings slightly "out of reach" instead of under control. I loved my smoking, but decided to start vaping as a better way to get my nicotine fix.

Now, I am getting frustrated because my attempts to cut down my nic level isn't succeeding too well. Plus, now, the FDA is helping to keep us away from the higher nic liquids (see the unavailability of 48mg and sometimes hard to get 36mg). Add on top of that the STUPIDITY of people treating this like it is a joke or a game...when we vapers know that it is deadly serious....ad nauseum!

Also:

1) smoking in the building
my PV vaping does not last me indefinitely...and my first break is 3 1/2
hours into the shift. My cravings kick in sooner than that. Since the
"ban", I do take my PV to the bathroom to vape- but I feel like a
criminal having to "hide" to vape
2) I don't believe it is right to force vapers, who are now "non-smokers",
to go to smoking areas only to vape...where we are again breathing
cigarette smoke. If I were going to do that, why not go back to
breathing it first-hand? As was asked in a previous post... patch and
gum users are not asked to go to the smoking area. I can sit in my
car to vape, but I feel it is alienating me even further as a vaper.

I guess today was the day it all piled on me at once, and I have been craving an analog all day....even after over a month of vaping only.

 

[Michele]

bleck....I guess my total frustration gets in the way sometimes. I am frustrated because of the FDA's scare tactics, I am frustated at the people who are believing the FDA hook-line-and sinker without checking the facts, I am in a little bit of a tight right now because my vaping is only keeping my cravings slightly "out of reach" instead of under control. I loved my smoking, but decided to start vaping as a better way to get my nicotine fix.

Now, I am getting frustrated because my attempts to cut down my nic level isn't succeeding too well. Plus, now, the FDA is helping to keep us away from the higher nic liquids (see the unavailability of 48mg and sometimes hard to get 36mg). Add on top of that the STUPIDITY of people treating this like it is a joke or a game...when we vapers know that it is deadly serious....ad nauseum!

Also:

1) smoking in the building
my PV vaping does not last me indefinitely...and my first break is 3 1/2
hours into the shift. My cravings kick in sooner than that. Since the
"ban", I do take my PV to the bathroom to vape- but I feel like a
criminal having to "hide" to vape
2) I don't believe it is right to force vapers, who are now "non-smokers",
to go to smoking areas only to vape...where we are again breathing
cigarette smoke. If I were going to do that, why not go back to
breathing it first-hand? As was asked in a previous post... patch and
gum users are not asked to go to the smoking area. I can sit in my
car to vape, but I feel it is alienating me even further as a vaper.

I guess today was the day it all piled on me at once, and I have been craving an analog all day....even after over a month of vaping only.

Maybe an increase in nicotine level will curb those cravings. I know that I started low and then jumped too high. I pulled it back down a bit and now seem to not have cravings for the analogs. It's still a bit higher than what my analogs were.

As for vaping in the smokers area is that outside or inside? Our smoking area was outside and (had I been vaping when I worked there) I could still enjoy my break time with co-workers and friends without feeling alienated--with minimal contact with second hand smoke.

Just my 2 cents...

 

[deeanne59]

Thanks Michele...I guess I could try upping the nic- I am vaping 24mg right now. My problem is I am chain vaping more than I need to (again, maybe my nic level is too low)...either that, or vaping now is a constant habit. I was trying to cut the nic down, in case of a ban...but it is bringing the cravings back with a vengence.

Now that you mentioned it...our smoking area is a "carport" outside. I was upset at the idea of being out there with the smokers, because seeing them smoking made my cravings worse! That, and I have one friend who asks me if I want a cigarette, and she would give me one if I said yes....that temptation is driving me CRAZY!

Plus, today was one of those days when I sat at the table and went through the troubles of blowing out the atty...changing out batteries seemingly every few minutes, getting a mouthful of nic juice (using a teabag), not getting a throat hit consistently, no vapor at times, etc. Then I sat and thought how easy it would be to just take an analog out of the pack and light it. No fuss and no muss. I hate what analogs was doing to me, and I had tried to quit for years...I am happy to be off of them, but it is rough for me at times because I don't have the cravings under control yet.

Plus, I have been afraid to go on up to 36mg...didn't know if that would be too high, but I was a 2 pack a day smoker, so maybe that is what I need. I have a 30ml bottle of 36mg unflavored here right now...I could add some flavoring and try it- but wouldn't the flavoring water the nic-level down from 36mg?

 

[Instinct]

I have to agree with JD (whose avatar creeps me out for some reason) that there is not much you can do. It's within their rights to tell you not to do whatever they don't want. And trust me when I say it has to do with people complaining about it. We are probably years away from this being accepted as common as drinking soda at the office.

I would suggest you give 36mg a go. Keep it in a seperate device maybe till you see how you react to it. If I vape hard on 36 I end up with insomnia and crazy dreams (anyone who has slept with a patch on knows what I mean). Maybe use it early in the day or just at work.

Also, even though you seem like an honest and upfront person, you can always take a little break in the bathroom with your PV. Or hide the vapor when people are looking. I know, not ideal.. but better than being with out there with the analog smokers.

Just stay off the analogs. In the end it's about you and your health right? Just my thoughts...

 

[Michele]

I'll be honest, I could never vape that strength! LOL but as far as lowering the nicotine strength I think jumping from 24 to 36 is too big of a jump IMO. I mean, what were you smoking to begin with? I was a 1-1.5 pack a day of ultra lights. I'm a power smoker--I could suck down a cigarette in about 2 minutes. I believe that's from only being able to smoke during my breaks at work for so long, plus I didn't smoke in the house and with three kids I needed to be back inside as quickly as possible. I tell you all this because I REALLY needed to slow down when I started vaping. If you draw on the e-cig like you did a cigarette you'll not get the same hit as you did from an analog. You'll over heat the atomizer and not get as much nicotine as you're needing. Maybe this is a combination of not enough nicotine and hitting the e-cig like you do an analog. ???

 

[bleck]

Hey I understand frustration and wanted to try to not be around other smokers. I tend to crave analogues when I am also. I just feel that some vapers seem to feel they have this right to vape wherever and whenever they please (not saying your that type). Confrontation in this manner seems to create an us versus them attitude which we'll never win. I work in a business setting (brokerage) and wouldn't even think about asking the HR department about it while I was working. It simply would be unprofessional to be doing so, and would probably make a lot of people very uncomfortable.

Also I haven't ever seen any information posted on secondhand vapor really. Maybe I have missed it, this forum is huge. I mean long term effects of vaping are unknown, but we are doing it to ourselves. My concern is that in 10 years of vaping indoors what are going to the effects on people around it? I wouldn't think it'd be as bad as cigarette smoke, but if there was any ill effect on my family or co-workers I'd feel horrible. Hence the reason I'm stuck still vaping outside or in the garage at my own house. Couldn't live with myself if I endangered my daughters health in any way.

 

[deeanne59]

Hey Instinct...got a question. As I mentioned in my previous post, I have 30 ml of unflavored 36mg. right now- if I add some flavoring to it, wouldn't it water down the 36mg a little?

 

[deeanne59]

Michele...I am uncertain about that strength too, but maybe that is what my body is craving. If it is, I may have a hard time getting AND KEEPING the juice at 36mg. if I flavor it.


Bleck.....thank you for understanding. I have NEVER been the kind of person to flaunt something in anyones' face just "because". I try to always abide by the rules, unless the rules are totally illegal .

I am not totally "perfect" at vaping yet...still get frustrated, still have cravings, but I am trying to settle it out without analogs. Is anyone having too much trouble getting 36mg. juice- flavored or unflavored?

 

[Instinct]

Hey Instinct...got a question. As I mentioned in my previous post, I have 30 ml of unflavored 36mg. right now- if I add some flavoring to it, wouldn't it water down the 36mg a little?

Yes it will. I've never mixed my own flavors so I don't know what kind of % of flavor it takes. I always imagined it as pretty low. You can always bust out the maths to find out exactly how much you are lowering it. As that's not a strong point of mine, I'll let someone else finish that thought.

While we all react differently, I don't think even the straight 36mg would bother you. I only smoked a pack a day and 36 only bothers me if I chain on the passthrough for an hour or 2 before bed... but during the day when I use it I find just a couple of hits do the trick and I don't treat it like a pacifier (like I do with anything lower).

and just saw your last post.. yeah it takes awhile to get the vaping down perfectly to match your style. Took me a few weeks. Funny enough the first week or 2 was cool, then I was getting mad analog cravings... but refined my vaping usage and that passed. Best wishes.

 

[Boom!]

Hey Instinct...got a question. As I mentioned in my previous post, I have 30 ml of unflavored 36mg. right now- if I add some flavoring to it, wouldn't it water down the 36mg a little?

Yes. "How much" all depends on what you do to it.

Check the DIY e-liquid section and also the "Hack-O-Matic Sheet". There are lots of recipes, suggestions, and tips if you search.

First tip = start with a very small batch so you don't ruin your entire bottle.