I was was Fired for Smoking my Ecig!!

[ladyraj]

I think the key to your dilemma may be in analyzing your training books in fire safety and researching the ship rules. What ever is NOT in your training/manuals or ship policy can be disputed via resources on the government site or via a maritime representative.

The general idea that no electronic devices can be used in certain areas is way too broad. Example: Are you allowed to use an MP3 player in the same area? Good luck!

 

[dragonshp56]

Hi Mustang,
The situation was this I was approximity 8.5 feet awat from this small locker that the ship's bosun uses as a paint locker. He approuched me I was never near his pait locker as he alleges. To date I have have under gone a certified Polygraph exam. He asked me what I had in my hand I wasn't regularly smoking since I was engaged in loading my food stores and having longshore personell put them away.I explained what it was and he asked how it worked. I took one drag that was that. My unit is a smoking Everywhere. The temperature of the atomizer maxs out at 90 degrees. That is also what smoking Everywhere claims. A friend of mine that works at boeing tested his and a friends exact smae model and came in at 91 degrees. Further more I have taken off the fillter and stuck my tounge in it and sucked very hard and feel hardly nothing but vapor still comes out when I exhale. Smoking Everywhere claims it is a Non Flammable electric device CE certified. As for my own investigation I feel that there clain holds up. The other night I got call in response from some guy at CE in europe he said u can didp it in lighter fluid and it wont ignite. I am waiting for his email with the technical data on theier certification process and what exactly was that. I am certainly trying to get the facts rather than speculate. I was well away from this jerks paint locker and this is merely a vicious unseemly stab in the back. I have sailed the world for 35 years and it amazes me the new breed of american sailor where-as in the old days a Rat,a snitch anyone who did harm to a fellow mariner would be taking the long swim. thank you for your advice and I do agree with you I would go directly into an enclosed space filled with paint vapors. The Polygraph test was positive 100%

 

[lhaddix]

It seems that a paint locker should be secured in such a way that no explosive vapor from it could accumulate elsewhere in the ship. What are the rules about ignition sources in the passageway adjoining it? If you can start a fire just by walking by with a lit cigarette or an e-cig, cell phone, static discharge, etc. then the real hazard is the paint locker not being sealed or ventilated. otherwise it's just a matter of time. I'm sure the Coast Guard has rules about what must be properly ventilated or sealed such as bilges, paint lockers, empty tanks, etc.

 

[mwa102464]

Sounds like your Bosses son asked you to demonstrate what you had and you followed orders to me especially being the bosses son????

 

[dragonshp56]

This unseemly person that made a big to do always carries a Motorola Commercial radio over his shoulder. The battery and power surge is Numerous times more powerful that the e cig. The paint locker is not my work area. To elaborate I also think it is dumb idea to vap while pumping gas. ut most for the reason that the E cig looks just like the real thing and why create a Panic situation. Also as a Chef I never would Vap around the Kitchen where I work. Often people are looking to create conflict and my feeling are why create unecessary speculation.

 

[dragonshp56]

Yeah sort of like that---one single puff--There is rule about smoking on public spaces on ships just like anyplace else. Even though we can mostly agree that there is big difference between smoking and vaping. Again I see no reason to create conflict and mere speculation. Trying to create anything one puff because I thought the jerk was curious. Across the passage way plus their are fans and over ventilation in his space taking the fumes up and out.

 

[rob33]

Sorry for the raw deal, but my thoughts Scottbee has nailed it. Not to mention the battery, the risk of a quick discharge explosion, and added static electricity that the device can cause. In a hazardous area one may think twice about vaping. Around hazardous materials all kinds of weird stuff can happen. I'm sure with your training you know this. Everyone has to remember these are untested devices and treat them accordingly. I wish you luck and support, hope you keep us informed on what happens.

 

[dragonshp56]

May I share my Polygraph results with You:

where u smoking a lit cigarette in this Paint Locker as GW implies NO
you where standing across the Paint locker in your work area YES
He asked you what it was Yes
He asked you how it worked Yes
You took One Puff Yes
Could you smell any paint fumes where you were standing across the passage No
Did he warn you about any Dangerous Paint fumes NO
Did he Tell the ships Captain that you where directly inside the Paint Locker Smoking a real Lit Cigarette Yes
Where You smoking inside his Paint Locker A real Cigaretee NO
Does this Person Like You NO
So you took a puff off this Ecigarette Yes
That is All Yes
So during this whole time did GW express any concern about the E -Cigarette NO
So you feel this person doesn't Like You because you filed Charges with Your Union about his abusive behavior with other union Members YES
As the Senior Union Representive does this GW represent the Needs of the membership involved No
You as Chief Steward are the other Senior Union Rep onboard YES
Do you follow your Union Contract and enforce all work rules Yes
Do you represent your union fairly without playing games Yes
Does the Captain respect your Union NO
Is the Captain and this GW friends YES
Is that type of conduct a good thing NO
You said that you always respect the Position of the Captain regardless of your personal Feeling Yes
Do you respect this Captain NO
Do you follow all lawful orders of this Captain Yes
Does this Captain ever engage with GW in making what you feel is Unlawful Orders and Policy YES
Do you feel that this Captain dislikes you because you have brought such Unlawful orders to your Union Yes
You say the Union often informs the Company when Unlawful orders and requests are made YES
Does the Company Correct the situation YES
You feel this Ecigarette is Safe Yes
Do u often smoke it in Public areas of the Ship NO
You say a month previous that the Captain and others asked you to demonstrate this E-cigarette Yes
At that time was it in Public Space on ship Yes
So the Caprtain knew you had it and used it Did the Captain ever express any concerns about it NO
you explained that there is No open Flame Yes
Normally you smoke or Vap in your private Cabin Yes
would you have smoked or Vaped this E-cigarette if this GW hadn't asked you NO
In hindsight to you feel he was setting you up YES

I passed with flying colors

 

[jlmanno]

Sorry to hear about your situation. It is a tough case. As Sun stated you need a qualified Maritime Lawyer who can gather all the facts as well as the policies etc. Best of luck to you!

 

[dragonshp56]

Thank You all again for Your Inpute and opinions I sincerely appreciate it. You have to all understand I was not in this Paint Locker as this GW claims. Also this Paint Locker is well ventilated. Also I think that if GW was so concerned of some danger why would he ask me to demonstrate it. To be honest Most ships Bosuns I have sailed with always wash their brushes with paint thinner outside the paint locker on deck where there is better ventilation anyway. Can anyone tell me why the company hasn't taken issue with him for possibly creating a hazardess situation with out warning anyone. Even though it is not my department I have witness most Bosuns and sailors mix their paints outs side as well. The paint locker I would think is mainly to store sealed container since it is actually located in the ships house where people live and breath. Thank U lhadexx for your commen sense observation as I said now that you make the point I see clearly. I didn't even know this guy was mixing paint in there. Yet he asked me to demonstrate the E-Cig

 

[skydragon]

You say a month previous that the Captain and others asked you to demonstrate this E-cigarette Yes
At that time was it in Public Space on ship Yes
So the Caprtain knew you had it and used it Did the Captain ever express any concerns about it NO


If you can prove the above, I think you have a very good chance of winning and if I were you, I think I would concentrate more on that than being set up. The fact that the Captain not only allowed but encouraged you to use your e-cig in a Public Space is basically telling you it is okay.

If that argument doesn't do it, (and it should unless maritime laws prohibit that defense) at the very least the Captain should be considered complicit in any wrongdoing. See how he likes that.

So you fall under maritime laws?

 

[Wireguy]

I hope the manufacturer can get you some good info. The 91 degree number can't be right. If it was you could squeeze your fingers together on a drop it would vaporize. Or a drop in your mouth would vaporize. Human temp 98.6

 

[Mustang394]

Hi Mustang,
The situation was this I was approximity 8.5 feet awat from this small locker that the ship's bosun uses as a paint locker. He approuched me I was never near his pait locker as he alleges. To date I have have under gone a certified Polygraph exam. He asked me what I had in my hand I wasn't regularly smoking since I was engaged in loading my food stores and having longshore personell put them away.I explained what it was and he asked how it worked. I took one drag that was that. My unit is a smoking Everywhere. The temperature of the atomizer maxs out at 90 degrees. That is also what smoking Everywhere claims. A friend of mine that works at boeing tested his and a friends exact smae model and came in at 91 degrees. Further more I have taken off the fillter and stuck my tounge in it and sucked very hard and feel hardly nothing but vapor still comes out when I exhale. Smoking Everywhere claims it is a Non Flammable electric device CE certified. As for my own investigation I feel that there clain holds up. The other night I got call in response from some guy at CE in europe he said u can didp it in lighter fluid and it wont ignite. I am waiting for his email with the technical data on theier certification process and what exactly was that. I am certainly trying to get the facts rather than speculate. I was well away from this jerks paint locker and this is merely a vicious unseemly stab in the back. I have sailed the world for 35 years and it amazes me the new breed of american sailor where-as in the old days a Rat,a snitch anyone who did harm to a fellow mariner would be taking the long swim. thank you for your advice and I do agree with you I would go directly into an enclosed space filled with paint vapors. The Polygraph test was positive 100%

Smoking Everywhere is not known for being an honest company, check this forum about them and you will see what I mean. As some one else already pointed out the 91 degree thing makes no sense at all. If I left my juice in my car this summer it should have disappeared in to a cloud of vapor, guarantee it gets out than that in my car during the day.

Please don't stick in a can of lighter fluid I would bet the results would not be pleasant. That claim alone should tell you they are full of crap.

I realize the Merchant Marine is not the military but a civilian organization, if your going to spend the money to fight this make sure you have all your fact correct and that this incident is the only reason they can claim for firing you and you might have a chance.

I don't know about where you live but here you can be fired for almost anything except for discrimination. ie: your age, religion, etc etc and there is nothing you can really do about it. Except try and collect unemployment and look for a new job. I say try and collect because if they can show justification for firing you, you will lose your case for unemployment.

 

[Wojtek]

I hope the manufacturer can get you some good info. The 91 degree number can't be right. If it was you could squeeze your fingers together on a drop it would vaporize. Or a drop in your mouth would vaporize. Human temp 98.6

Might it be that this 91 degree number be in Celcius? not Fahrenheit?

 

[AlexTM]

Dear me, that sounds like a lawyers dream. Do get the facts about PVs straight, or you won't have a chance - what you have been told is mostly crap. PVs are electronic devices, and they have bits in them that do get pretty hot. Especially slightly malfunctioning ones easily glow red-hot when out of liquid; you don't get that at 91 degrees.

BTW, 91 degrees celsius is not all that hot, either - that is still below the temperature of boiling water and far away from metal glowing red-hot.

 

[Wireguy]

Could be. I can only assume that its Fahrenheit. English speaking and all that. Almost 200 degrees F sort of blows his argument.

Might it be that this 91 degree number be in Celcius? not Fahrenheit?

 

[Wojtek]

Could be. I can only assume that its Fahrenheit. English speaking and all that. Almost 200 degrees F sort of blows his argument.

I googled a bit and here's what I found:

Propylene Glycol Flash point: 99C (210F) CC
PROPYLENE GLYCOL

The flash point of a volatile liquid is the lowest temperature at which it can vaporize
Flash point - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[dragonshp56]

Thanks your logic makes perfect sense. I also run a small Expresso shop here in Magnolia and had fruitful conversation this AM with the guys that quite often come by for their morning Cafiene fix from local Fire Station. Their logic was this: Isn't the paint locker primarily for paint storage. Why would a dumb ... be mixing paints and working with Thinners and such in enclosed area adjoining a common Passage inside the living & working area. You wouldn't do that in your home. I refinish a lot of furniture and in the past owned boats and always work in well ventilated area. Or if this paint locker is well ventilated with exhaust equipment and such why is the dumbass leaving the door open so exposing other people to harmful vapors.?? But also they looked at my E-cig and said that where I was way too far-away to cause a problem. I would still have to have the atomizer somehow open and exosed directly to the vapors like halfway into a glass with the substance an inch away. Even if I had smelled any vapors they would have to be so concentrated that nobody would want to be in the area and I would have definity sounded a fire alarm

 

[mwa102464]

What is written on the actual termination report that they gave you when you where fired, I'm sure you saw this and had to sign something apon termination. Would you also display this for us all to see, I feel this would give us some better insight on the company's exact words and reason for termination. Another question I have is: have you been written up before, and if so on what and how many times. I find it really hard to believe that a good employee on good terms with his boss or not would be terminated like this without warning. Will you provide the following that im asking you for??

 

[martha1014]

If they were planning on firing you why did they bother to give you a polygraph espeically in lieu of you passing it. I can't hardly believe they fired you for this one incident. They don't usually fire people for doing something they thought was not harmful. I can see a warning. Is there anything else involved in this situation. It is in their policy that this type of incident would result in losing your job.