Idea for auto-drip; will this work?

[Vapo]

Hi, this seems to be the only forum I can post in, I know its the wrong one so sry about that.

I don't even have my ecigs yet and I'm already getting excited about playing w/ the design The greatest failing of these products I can tell just from reading the forums seems to be the application of the liquid.

Now here's what I understand. The atomizer has a mesh bridge (I'm imagining a little arch pointing towards the cartridge here, so correct me if I'm wrong). This bridge presses lightly into the filler material, theoretically allowing it to wick the liquid up at a steady rate keeping its surface constantly covered in a thin layer for maximum vaporization.

Since this is the real world, it is almost impossible to get the filter at exactly the right density (and I should think placed in the right position) for the bridge to be constantly saturated. So instead people resort to saturating the bridge directly with drops of liquid which seems to me like a pain in the .... even if it is rather logical.

I was thinking of ways to make this easier. The basic principle seems to be a fibrous mesh which is saturated in liquid drawing more in through the use of cohesion (I would think anyway). The as the bridge dries up, the liquid in it attracts more from the filler to keep it optimally saturated.

So if the filler's too dry then the bridge cannot stay saturated, it overheats and maybe even burns some filler. If the filler is too wet then the bridge floods, maybe some runs off, it can't heat... correct?

So I was giving blood today and it gave me an idea. Everyone knows the little pipettes they use when they ..... your finger to get a small sample of blood. Blood wells up on your finger and the slight pressure and the various forces acting on water in confined places force it up the narrow pipette and hold it in there w/ no seals. So what I was thinking was that you would mount a pipette (probably fashioned from a narrow needle tip, or whatever was handing) or more as needed inside of the mouthpiece. This would be positioned (a blob of silicon and some steady hands should do for quick and dirty work) so that when the cartridge was fully onto the atomizer the pipette came into place a very small distance from the middle of the bridge. Think a bit wider than the width of a fingernail (this would be something you would monkey around w/ until you got it just right).

To fill the cart the tip of the pipette would be applied to the dropper bottle, one drop at a time until it was filled (or alternatively you could put however many drops you needed in a small dish and suck it up from there, but its been a while since chemistry class and I think you might need the pressure the dropper would provide for things to go smoothly). The next step would be to drip the bridge like normal to get it good and moist. Once the cartridge is placed on the two close bodies of liquid should naturally attract and attach. As the atomizer is fired up the liquid will evaporate from the bridge, which should in turn draw more liquid from the pipette to saturate the bridge.

This is all guesswork, but I don't see any reason why it shouldn't work. My biggest worry would be what happens to the liquid in the pipette once it gets up to higher temperatures - dunno how much heat would transfer in there. It should be relatively easy to test for someone who has an atomizer and a suitable bit of narrow pipe material handy though. I'll definitely be giving this a shot once I get mine, because I don't want inconsistent vapor and I don't want the hassle of constantly dripping. If this did work one should be able to get the effect of a drip with much longer times between re-application (or even the possibility to have enough carts preloaded for the auto-drip to last you the day, only having to drip in between carts).

Anyway, I know this is kind of a rant and I know I'm a noob so I don't have the experience w/ these devices that some of you guys do. It seems like a pretty simple concept to me though, and I'd love to know if any of you vets think it would work.

 

[Osculum]

I actually read all of that. Sounds awesome. Although I have no idea if this would work or not please let me know when and if it does.

I'll buy some.

 

[four2109]

I guess I'm having trouble visualizing your idea. If you suck it up, how do you not have a vacuum, that prevents flow? How long is this pipette? How much liquid would it hold?

 

[Vapo]

Yeah, it's not really a pipette that's not the correct term. I meant basically a mini pipe. The best comparison I can give is the tiny plastic tubes doctors will use when they ..... your finger. They ....., blood wells up, and then they put the small pipe to the spot of blood and it travels up to fill the tube.

The force holding it in w/o vacuum is either cohesion or adhesion, forget which. Basically it's a tiny tube, tiny enough that the attraction of the water to the walls is more powerful than that of gravity pulling the fluid downwards. As to how it goes up the tube, I think it's just the minute pressure in the blood welling up but I'm not really sure. As I said, bit rusty on the mechanics of the thing.

Another thing I'm not really sure of is if the cohesion of the water in the fluid in the tube and the bridge will be enough to overpower the forces holding the reservoir of fluid in the pipe. I think it should, though, and if not then the size and material composition of the pipe could almost certainly be modified so that it would. This really needs to be tested though, it should be simple to see whether it might be made to work.

 

[lordmage]

vapo all you need is 15 post they will come in time if you like i can move this out when the time comes or even now PM me and i will be glad to.

 

[Nestran]

I think you are talking about a capillary tube.

In theory I think it may work but it would be a very sensitive system unless you have the means to produce the design with very tight tolerances.

The mounting alone is tough as both ends of the tube need to be open for the fluid to flow.

Filling would be tricky, you need to have fluid right to the end of the tube as it would require contact with the bridge in order for capillary action to occur.

Heat may be another factor that would change or even stop the action.

Then consider how much fluid one of those tubes would hold once it is cut to fit in a cart, maybe a drop. Then you are back to filling all the time.

Not trying to poopoo your creativity, it's thinkers such as yourself that have been at the root of the many great mods out there today.

P.S. Check out the Rho cart mod using the PTB mod as it's basis. Wonderful consistent vapor.

Nestran

 

[Vapo]

I think you are talking about a capillary tube.

In theory I think it may work but it would be a very sensitive system unless you have the means to produce the design with very tight tolerances.

The mounting alone is tough as both ends of the tube need to be open for the fluid to flow.

Filling would be tricky, you need to have fluid right to the end of the tube as it would require contact with the bridge in order for capillary action to occur.

Heat may be another factor that would change or even stop the action.

Then consider how much fluid one of those tubes would hold once it is cut to fit in a cart, maybe a drop. Then you are back to filling all the time.

Not trying to poopoo your creativity, it's thinkers such as yourself that have been at the root of the many great mods out there today.

P.S. Check out the Rho cart mod using the PTB mod as it's basis. Wonderful consistent vapor.

Nestran

There ya go, capillary tube and capillary action, couldn't get the word on the tip of my tongue last night

All the concerns you raised are valid of course, but other than the effects of heat on the system (my own biggest question since I never had a blood sample drawn while my blood was boiling ) I think a lot of them could be overcome by simply tinkering with materials and layout rather than worrying about designing it perfectly for the application (if only we all had desktop factories to play with )

The placement would be very finnicky, but I don't think it'd be hard to do with a bit of silicon (or even better, something that expands a tiny bit as it dries dunno what would be appropriate). Put a big enough dab in the cart to fill most of it but with enough space to slide the capillary around it on the edge. Lodge the capillary in the silicon then place a spacer above the atomizer w/ a little pin that will fit in the capillary (a tiny tack would work great). Then apply the cartridge to the spacer and fit the capillary to the spacer tack or whatever (dunno how you get the spacer to stay firmly on the atomizer bridge, but something could be worked out). Let the cartridge sit there long enough for the silicon to dry a bit so the capillary won't wiggle, then pull it off for a full drying. It should leave the cap perfectly spaced; or all of this could be done measurement and precise application, but I prefer to do the quick jury-rig methods

I wouldn't think filling would be too hard. I was imagining it as just pulling off the cart and filling the tip of the capillary w/ a dropper bottle - again I don't have my own ecig yet so I dunno how far a cart slides onto an atomizer so I don't know how much space there would be. You might want a modified longer cart for this anyway (the length of a cart looks about good to me, but how much of that length is just sitting around the outside of the atomizer?). You wouldn't be able to see when it was fully filled but I think it would quit absorbing more liquid when it was. As long as you filled from the bridge end the liquid should be at that end, and should be able to make a connection w/ a saturated bridge (which the heat might very well break of course).

Amt of load is, of course, a big question. I was honestly just looking for some way to extend past what one gets from dripping. So for instance if for a 510 it held three drops then that would be worthwhile b/c that'd be twice what you can effectively load onto the atomizer alone. However in reality of course I'd try to expand this even more. I dunno how large the atomizer bridge is, but of course you would apply as many capillaries as can span the bridge. If this were being made ideally it'd be a set of glass caps wound tightly around the inside of the cart for maximum volume but of course I'm not too up on bending glass hehe. I'd say a capillary like they use at the doctors would probably take three drops or so if it was the length of a cartridge... dunno how much of that cartridge you've actually got free once it's pressed on the atomizer though.

Its all just an idea I was trying to think of some automatic way to get a constant drip w/ simple equipment because inconsistent smoke is really not what I'm looking for and neither is lots of inconvenience (the short battery life and constantly swapping already seems inconvenient enough). Before this I was thinking of ways to have a manual drip mechanism in the cart and while you could quite possibly build one just w/ things you get from the hobby shop in a slightly extended cartridge (I'm not interested in big bulky mods; if I wanted that I could buy a normal hand held vaporizer which have been around for ages, are very reliable and under full warranty, and take large amts of substance for vaping) but it would be a PAIN. Though if you did it and made it in a clear cart it would look very retro-punk

Oh and don't worry about moving it I'm sure this is a noobish idea anyway it just seemed to me to be relatively easy to implement as a way to get a good constant vapor. I'll definitely be giving it a shot, though heh.

 

[Nestran]

I think once you get going you will find that the battery swap and such is not any more of a pain than it was to have to go get a pack of analogs, pack it, open it.

Once you get a routine it all just works.

Nestran