Is this a better approach to vaporizing e-liquid?

[Yozhik]

Below is shown an invention claimed by Lik Hon in U.S. Pat. Pub. No. 2015/0034103. Unlike most e-cigs, where the wick is in contact with the coil, he presents a different approach. When a user inhales at the nozzle (42), air is drawn through a heating coil (40). The air is heated (e.g., to 500 F) and then proceeds through a thin mesh element (32) containing e-liquid. The hot air vaporizes the e-liquid, which then travels down the outlet (36) and out the nozzle. The e-liquid to feed the mesh is located in chamber (34), which helps to cool the vapor.

Lik Hon Vaporizer

• Yozhik
• Jun 22, 2015
• 1

Claimed advantages by the inventor of this approach:

- Liquid does not come into contact with the coil, which avoids the loss of heating efficiency resulting from deposits and liquid residue collecting on the heater coil.
- Longer coil life, due to lower thermal shock to heater coil and less corrosion.
- May reduce chemical changes in the liquid as it is only heated by air.
- Heater coil can be played with corrosion resistant materials to prolong coil life, such as silver or nickel-chromium, which degrade when in contact with an e-liquid.
- Since the coil heats air, not e-liquid, it can achieve faster vaporization.

So what do you think? Is a better or worse design than the current approach?

My biggest doubt is whether heated air alone can provide enough heat energy to achieve sufficient vaporization. Maybe if the mesh element pre-heated the e-liquid just below vaporization, this approach might work better than the current method.

 

[NathanielFT]

Can't comment on whether this would be an improvement as I have no idea, it's nice to know there are people thinking outside of the box though...

 

[Bunnykiller]

ever try to boil water with a hair dryer???

and if the "sponge" goes empty.... talk about a "dry" hit...
with no liquid to take up the heat, one just might get a blast of 500 degree air on the tip of the tounge... ouch...

 

[Yozhik]

ever try to boil water with a hair dryer???

The idea here isn't to boil a whole pot of e-liquid, but to heat a thin tissue of e-liquid.

 

[Bunnykiller]

but the majority of the liquid would need to be near vapor temp for it to occur, elsewise the heat will go into the liquid before the vapor temp can be achieved.... unless there is some type of insulator that allows the liquid to be thermally separated from the mass of the liquid supply... kinda like trying to sublimate an ice cube with a propane torch rough analogy...

 

[Bunnykiller]

break out the Heat Transfer books from collage and do some calcs to see if it would even be feesible.... look at the differences between direct coil contact and air flow transfers, see which of the 2 are more efficient ...

 

[Big Me]

Looks like the end result would look like the cartomisers you'd find at the end of a cigalike.

Which is probably not surprising as doesn't Hon Lik now "consult" for Fontem, which is owned by Imperial Tobacco?

 

[K_Tech]

break out the Heat Transfer books from collage and do some calcs to see if it would even be feesible.... look at the differences between direct coil contact and air flow transfers, see which of the 2 are more efficient ...

Air is a poor heat transfer medium.

I'm concerned what happens as the surface of the adsorbent media gets "gunked up" and the small amount of heat transfer decreases even further. My guess is you'll be sucking in a jet of superheated air.

 

[sonicbomb]

I started doing some maths, then gave up and went with my gut. I would say that solution would result in a lot of hot air and not a lot of vapor.

 

[Yozhik]

I started doing some maths, then gave up and went with my gut. I would say that solution would result in a lot of hot air and not a lot of vapor.

Well, keep in mind that the current method wastes at least 95% of its energy in just heating a wick. Here, you only need to heat up a much smaller amount of e-liquid.

 

[retired1]

Here's a full description of the filing: Patent US20150034103 - Electronic cigarette - Google Patents

From what I can gather, this looks like it would be something along the lines of a cigalike. If so, the amount of power required to consistently heat the air pretty much negates the practicality of the methods being used.

 

[Yozhik]

It looks like the specific heat of PG/VG would be max 2.5 kJ/kg-C. So if you want to heat 5mg of e-liquid to vaporization, that's (2.5)(180)(.005)=2.25J.

Maybe I'm doing something wrong in the math, but that doesn't seem like an excessive amount of energy required.

 

[Yozhik]

Here's a full description of the filing: Patent US20150034103 - Electronic cigarette - Google Patents

From what I can gather, this looks like it would be something along the lines of a cigalike. If so, the amount of power required to consistently heat the air pretty much negates the practicality of the methods being used.

A cigalike might be the preferred embodiment described in the patent, but that does not mean the claimed invention is limited to a cigalike.

 

[retired1]

If you're using a battery the size of an 18650, sure, there'd be no issue. But the batteries contained in the self contained disposables (which this appears to be geared towards) would die rather quickly before you'd even get close to using up the eliquid inside the thing. Which, I suppose, would be good marketing on the part of Big Tobacco, but horrid for the user.

 

[Steamix]

Dry hit with hot air doesn't sound appealing. Could be avoidable by cramming more electronics into it. Like moisture sensors. Doable ? Perhaps. Or a dead end. Same time last years there was some hype about using piezoceramic elements instead of heat to vaporize liquid. Gotten kinda quiet around that. In theory, overcoming the liquid's viscosity by osicllation is doable. But is it also practicable ?
If I need a backpack weighing in at 100 lbs to keep a contraption like that powered up, it won't sell very well, I gues

Let's remember - the concept of vaporizing a liquid with or without nicotine to give smokers n alternative has been around for quite a while. But e-cigs took off only after reliable and sufficiently powerful batteries became available. In theory, I could have hooked a toaster to an old car battery in the sixties to get a vape. Concept is the same, but lugging aroud samething like the 'Anyvape 2000' isn't really practical

 

[Yozhik]

If you're using a battery the size of an 18650, sure, there'd be no issue. But the batteries contained in the self contained disposables (which this appears to be geared towards) would die rather quickly before you'd even get close to using up the eliquid inside the thing. Which, I suppose, would be good marketing on the part of Big Tobacco, but horrid for the user.

Perhaps, but just because a patent describes something in the context of a cigalike doesn't mean that feature won't be useful elsewhere. TC, for example, was described in patent literature with respect to cigalikes well before the DNA40, SX350J, etc. As much as we might dislike them, cigalike manufacturers have money for R&D.

 

[retired1]

It still appears to be a closed system, which is exactly what Big Tobacco wants. The big companies don't like our free wheeling ways of open systems and using our own juice. This is why they're pushing the FDA to allow closed systems only.

No, this isn't a good idea. Nor is it something that's good for vaping.

 

[Yozhik]

Dry hit with hot air doesn't sound appealing. Could be avoidable by cramming more electronics into it. Like moisture sensors. Doable ? Perhaps. Or a dead end. Same time last years there was some hype about using piezoceramic elements instead of heat to vaporize liquid. Gotten kinda quiet around that. In theory, overcoming the liquid's viscosity by osicllation is doable. But is it also practicable ?

Lik Hon has a recent patent describing a piezoceramic element, but it's to improve on the heating element, not to replace it.

Patent US8899239 - Electronic cigarette - Google Patents

"The effect of the ultrasonic piezoelectric element 20 mounting on the nozzle is that, firstly, the large liquid droplets in the unstable thermal airflow under high pressure will be in sufficient contact with the electric heating element, and thereby be vaporized. Secondly, the liquid droplets in the nozzle 17 are directly fragmented and atomized. Thirdly, possible bumping when the liquid is above a boiling point will be avoided. The effect of integrated atomization will allow aerosol droplets with diameters of 0.2-3 um to enter into the alveolus easily and be absorbed."

Edit: I had to look up what "bumping" is. Bumping is where a liquid becomes super-heated above its boiling point due to special conditions. If then agitated, it can violently erupt as it transitions to a gas.

 

[Steamix]

Lik Hon has a recent patent describing a piezoceramic element, but it's to improve on the heating element, not to replace it.

Patent US8899239 - Electronic cigarette - Google Patents

"The effect of the ultrasonic piezoelectric element 20 mounting on the nozzle is that, firstly, the large liquid droplets in the unstable thermal airflow under high pressure will be in sufficient contact with the electric heating element, and thereby be vaporized. Secondly, the liquid droplets in the nozzle 17 are directly fragmented and atomized. Thirdly, possible bumping when the liquid is above a boiling point will be avoided. The effect of integrated atomization will allow aerosol droplets with diameters of 0.2-3 um to enter into the alveolus easily and be absorbed."

Who you said the guy is now consulting for ?

Seems he is pretty busy staking out legal claims on anything that could be used to turn a liquid into a vapour.

Hmmm.... that could bring innovation....or stifle it.

Wouldn't e the first time that this approach has been used primarily to keep other teams off the playing field.

We'll see...

 

[Yozhik]

Who you said the guy is now consulting for ?

Seems he is pretty busy staking out legal claims on anything that could be used to turn a liquid into a vapour.

Hmmm.... that could bring innovation....or stifle it.

Wouldn't e the first time that this approach has been used primarily to keep other teams off the playing field.

We'll see...

Lik Hon is often called the inventor of the modern electric cigarette, so he is sort of the guy to beat when it comes to patent rights. Otherwise, patents are what they are. In return for a shot at a limited monopoly, companies have to disclose their trade secrets. We might not always like that monopoly, but it gives us a window into potential innovations we might not otherwise see.