Little to no vapor with SS 316L

[Manopka]

Today I received a shipment of 316L Stainless Steel wire. I built a dual coil in my Crius rta. 0.46mm wire, 9 wraps, 0.2 ohms.

in Escribe I have used the steam-engine CSV file for SS316L as well as using the "Special" button and changing the value to 0.001. I have changed Preheat Power from 1-150 W. Changed temperature from 400-600F and everytime I get very little vapor. Temperature Protected message pops up within 1-2 seconds of firing. At 600F it takes slightly longer but not by much.

I don't really know what else to change in order to get this to work.

 

[EverPresentNoob]

ok, I missed your entire first sentence... Dont ask. Sorry....

 

[Manopka]

ok, I missed your entire first sentence... Dont ask. Sorry....

not sure what you said anyway haha.

 

[EverPresentNoob]

I was asking for details about your coil and explaining why we would need that info to give you advise. But your coil is in the first sentance... That is why I shouldnt comment post-margarita...

 

[BigEgo]

Where did you get your wire?

 

[stylemessiah]

If you head over to the evolv forums you'll notice that there seems to be a trend of the DNA200 needing a lot of tweaking to work with SS, i was going to buy an efusion DNA200 earlier in the week, so i did my homework

Heres a evolv forum search for stainless, the links i saved may have been individual to the DNA200 mod i was looking at buying....

Searched for : stainless - DNA 200 Early Adopters Forum

One place i can refer to is this thread where the files being shared were successful for some people

stainless steel and temperature control - DNA 200 Early Adopters Forum

Post 32 ...but read a page before and to the end before downloading, ymmv


Dunno what DNA200 mod you have, but for some mods people had shared their own SS profiles rather than using the Steam Engine ones, which didnt seem to work for a number of people/mods

I can tell you from my experience of using SS for months (single coil) on non-DNA mods that builds 0.5 and above tend to work better for me than even a 0.4 as theres not a lot of measurable change in the resistance curve below 0.4, at least in my experience (i did a 0.4 build last week, it wouldnt work reliably on my TreeBox, but on the SX it worked, though not great and i tossed it and put a 0.6 build back in) and have seen this theory elsewhere as well. Normally im at around 0.6, working fine on both mods.

Make sure your DNA200 box is set up correctly, i.e. latest version of EScribe, latest firmware for mod, mod resistance and other mod parameters set correctly (you can check this via an evolv forum search as well)

If it were me i would also try a single coil 0.5 or above build (not sure if this is possible on a crius), or a 0.5 or above dual build.

 

[Shigura]

"Special" button and changing the value to 0.001. I have changed Preheat Power from 1-150 W.

Try cutting down the preheat to around 40-50w or so (what I use). I've been using SS316L exclusively for the past few weeks using the CSV from Steam Engine. Not a single complaint thus far. Also, did you try to use the baseline TCR .00092 first and adjust from there?

 

[J Wo]

Did you check to make sure your coils are evenly spaced so you won't get any shorts?

 

[BigEgo]

Did you check to make sure your coils are evenly spaced so you won't get any shorts?

This. I am pretty sure one of two things is happening:

1) He has a build issue -- uneven coils, shorts, loose coils, etc.

2) His wire really isn't 316L as he thinks and thus the .csv and TCR are all wrong.

 

[stylemessiah]

This. I am pretty sure one of two things is happening:

1) He has a build issue -- uneven coils, shorts, loose coils, etc.

2) His wire really isn't 316L as he thinks and thus the .csv and TCR are all wrong.

As for 2), plenty of people have found the SS csv from Steam Engine isnt working for them. So i wouldnt rule this out

 

[BigEgo]

As for 2), plenty of people have found the SS csv from Steam Engine isnt working for them. So i wouldnt rule this out

Could be people are getting 304 wire (it's cheaper) and thinking it's 316. There's no way to tell by looking at it and I wouldn't be surprised if some vendors are passing 304 off as 316. I don't have any 316, but I do have some 317 and it works just as steam-engine says it should.

OP, you could try adjusting the TCR to "taste." You can probably get it in the ballpark of the real temp just by feel. This is what I did with Joyetech's "316" coils. The TCR and .csv didn't work for those either. Then I changed it to the 304 TCR and it was about right.

 

[Manopka]

Where did you get your wire?

I got it from a company in the UK. No way for me to really check if its legit. They have all sorts of wire on their website though. wireandstuff.co.uk

If you head over to the evolv forums you'll notice that there seems to be a trend of the DNA200 needing a lot of tweaking to work with SS, i was going to buy an Efusion DNA200 earlier in the week, so i did my homework

Heres a evolv forum search for stainless, the links i saved may have been individual to the DNA200 mod i was looking at buying....

Searched for : stainless - DNA 200 Early Adopters Forum

One place i can refer to is this thread where the files being shared were successful for some people

stainless steel and temperature control - DNA 200 Early Adopters Forum

Post 32 ...but read a page before and to the end before downloading, ymmv


Dunno what DNA200 mod you have, but for some mods people had shared their own SS profiles rather than using the Steam Engine ones, which didnt seem to work for a number of people/mods

I can tell you from my experience of using SS for months (single coil) on non-DNA mods that builds 0.5 and above tend to work better for me than even a 0.4 as theres not a lot of measurable change in the resistance curve below 0.4, at least in my experience (i did a 0.4 build last week, it wouldnt work reliably on my TreeBox, but on the SX it worked, though not great and i tossed it and put a 0.6 build back in) and have seen this theory elsewhere as well. Normally im at around 0.6, working fine on both mods.

Make sure your DNA200 box is set up correctly, i.e. latest version of EScribe, latest firmware for mod, mod resistance and other mod parameters set correctly (you can check this via an evolv forum search as well)

If it were me i would also try a single coil 0.5 or above build (not sure if this is possible on a crius), or a 0.5 or above dual build.

Im going to try those CSV files/numbers and report back. If that doesnt work ill try building a higher resistance as well.

This. I am pretty sure one of two things is happening:

1) He has a build issue -- uneven coils, shorts, loose coils, etc.

2) His wire really isn't 316L as he thinks and thus the .csv and TCR are all wrong.

My coils are def even. 9 contact wraps and glowing evenly.

Its possible the wire isnt legit but it seems like decent quality wire.

 

[Manopka]

Alright I used the CSV file from Jaquith and its working much better but still not great. Im just going to have to spend a lot of time tweaking the numbers and builds I put in here. I think im just used to RDAs and the vapor/flavor I get from the fused claptons and alien coils i put in there.

 

[cobalt327]

Spaced coils might work better for you- they do for me...

 

[Manopka]

Im personally not a fan of spaced coils. I think its the cloud chaser in me. But I have to find a balance cuz I'm used to much more vapor just from the builds I usually use. The main reason I want to use TC is for my tank when I have a long drive.

However I think I am going to try to SS claptons. I read some people getting good results with TC claptons. Most people are using the TC wire as the core and then wrapping Kanthal or N80 around the outside.

 

[cobalt327]

It's more about getting stable resistance so TC mode works as intended than it is cloudzzz. My understanding is, unlike Kanthal, SS doesn't form a non conductive layer so using contact coils w/SS makes for a lot less resistance when firing. In TC mode, less resistance equates to less lower applied, as I'm sure you already know.

 

[cobalt327]

I believe it has also been mentioned already that dual coils can be problematic. If possible, maybe you could try a 0.5-ish ohm single coil as a 'proof of concept'-type build (also mentioned earlier- I don't want to take credit for others' suggestions). One of your dual coil coils will suffice quite nicely I believe. Then at least you would know w/certainty that TC mode was- or was not- working as it should.

 

[dwroblewski]

I forgot to dry burn my SS on my first build and it didn't perform well at all. I pulled the wick, gave it a good burn and it made all the difference in the world. Might not apply for your situation, but something to remember...

 

[BigEgo]

I got it from a company in the UK. No way for me to really check if its legit. They have all sorts of wire on their website though. wireandstuff.co.uk



Im going to try those CSV files/numbers and report back. If that doesnt work ill try building a higher resistance as well.



My coils are def even. 9 contact wraps and glowing evenly.

Its possible the wire isnt legit but it seems like decent quality wire.

Are you sure your resistance is stable? Go to atomizer analyzer, then put your finger on the coil and wiggle it around. If the resistance changes a lot, you have a loose coil. (Don't use a metal bit to do this as it is conductive and will throw the resistance off).

Also, it's possible different wire manufacturers use slightly different combinations of nickel, chromium and molybdenum in their "mixes." It could be that a percent or two difference could throw things off significantly. Since your wire was most likely made in the UK, it could be that their equivalent of 316 (which is an American grade designation) is slightly different.

 

[Joe KY]

I can tell you from my experience of using SS for months (single coil) on non-DNA mods that builds 0.5 and above tend to work better for me than even a 0.4 as theres not a lot of measurable change in the resistance curve below 0.4, at least in my experience (i did a 0.4 build last week, it wouldnt work reliably on my TreeBox, but on the SX it worked, though not great and i tossed it and put a 0.6 build back in) and have seen this theory elsewhere as well. Normally im at around 0.6, working fine on both mods.

Make sure your DNA200 box is set up correctly, i.e. latest version of EScribe, latest firmware for mod, mod resistance and other mod parameters set correctly (you can check this via an evolv forum search as well)

If it were me i would also try a single coil 0.5 or above build (not sure if this is possible on a crius), or a 0.5 or above dual build.

I would say, for me anyway, stylemessiah hit the nail on the head! I had this exact same issue with my DNA 200 with the SS 316L build in my Crius. My initial build was around .25, couldn't get a good vape and hit TP immediately. Tried using the SS 430 CSV and this worked pretty well, but I still had an issue with not being able to use the 316 CSV (OCD). It was strictly by accident I found that the resistance seemed to be the issue. I had been using the Crius in a profile for SS 430 and wanted to try the other profile I had set up with SS 316. When I changed it, it asked "new coil up, same coil down," I wasn't paying attention and hit new coil. The tank was warm and the resistance now was over .3 ohm's and it vaped fine using the 316 CSV at 430F and 35W.

I have since re-coiled at .4 ohm's and for me the vape is MUCH better. You appear to be using about 24 ga wire (I'm using 28) and I don't think you will be able to get there with that gauge wire.

I'm currently having similar issues with Ti 26 ga and I'm gonna try going to 28 ga with it.

Hope this helps.