Measuring concentrates and making funk
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Drip a little of that funk in my liquid and I'll sell it and call it That Funky Cloud. Steep it till it's brown.......
We Got That Funk !!!
I've only used TFA Strawberry. I don't think it really needs steeping but it does change color (yellows) when mixed (at least in VG/nicotine, and I've heard it from others, I assume they weren't all max VG like me). Because it changes I usually wait for that (probably about a week or less). But I would have no problem shake and vape with it.
While it is a good single flavor its lacking. The only reason for the raspberry in my strawberry peach is to add to/round out the berry flavor.
Similarly my watermelon has 2 brands of watermelon and pineapple, cucumber, wintergreen in small amounts all to help it taste like the watermelon flavor I want.
But you are measuring. A reason baking is a good analogy is a lot of baking is science. Some things measured wrong equals complete failure. My niece makes cake from scratch and flips out when I measure flour for pies, but I've been making pies so long I can compensate for measuring the wrong way.
The reason eliquid is better measured is a flavor that is strong at 1% is only .3ml in 30ml. That doesn't leave much room for error. If you've measured your drops you could get away with adding a few drops to make it taste right and it wouldn't change your unflavored nicotine strength much. But when you tell someone drops and they end up using 2% because their drops are bigger it doesn't work.
I really don't find measuring with syringes to be time consuming.
Have I ever found a .1ml mistake to be the difference between good and bad? No, at least not when I've made them (not with TFA Caramel Cappuccino).
I do use some single flavoring or single flavoring + menthol recipes.
If there are five notches between whole numbers, obviously each marks 0.2... so 3 notches = 0.6
Don't be discouraged. Asking questions as you've done is a great route to take. I've been mixing my own for a few years. When I started I had some dismal, unvapable failures. Like cooking, you're bound to have a few failures when you're learning.
I have an assortment of syringes for measuring liquids, from 1ml to 20ml. The smaller syringes have more precise graduations, which is good for measuring flavorings. The larger syringes are for measuring the larger volume base liquids. I would absolutely advise against using drops as a means of measuring liquids, as drops vary in volume by both viscosity and the nature of the dispensing container. If you're finding recipes which go by drops, look elsewhere.
And, as has already been mentioned ... Keep it Simple, especially when you're getting your feet wet. Steer away from complex formulations for now.
Don't be discouraged. Asking questions as you've done is a great route to take. I've been mixing my own for a few years. When I started I had some dismal, unvapable failures. Like cooking, you're bound to have a few failures when you're learning.
I have an assortment of syringes for measuring liquids, from 1ml to 20ml. The smaller syringes have more precise graduations, which is good for measuring flavorings. The larger syringes are for measuring the larger volume base liquids. I would absolutely advise against using drops as a means of measuring liquids, as drops vary in volume by both viscosity and the nature of the dispensing container. If you're finding recipes which go by drops, look elsewhere.
And, as has already been mentioned ... Keep it Simple, especially when you're getting your feet wet. Steer away from complex formulations for now.
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Some old school syringes may have a secondary scale on them; marked as "CC"s. A "CC" stands for cubic centimeter.
1CC = 1mL (milliliter).
Small syringes (typically 1mL) can also have a second scale on them marked in "units" ("U"). There are 2 different types of units; "insulin," and "tuberculin." An insulin syringe is pretty straight forward, as there are always 100 insulin units in 1mL. An insulin syringe will be labeled as such on the barrel.
100U (units/insulin) = 1mL
Tuberculin units are a different matter. A tuberculin unit is based on the volume of the specific antigen it was calibrated to measure. There is no fixed equivalent to mL; so disregard for DIY use. A tuberculin syringe will be labeled as such on the barrel.
What does all this mean? Simply; pay attention to which scale (unit of measure) you are measuring with.
How to read/use a syringe is explained quite well (both written and a short video) here:
How to Read a Syringe
I have yet to find a dropper bottle dispense even close to 20 drops/mL. Usually(?) it is somewhere closer to 30 to as much as 45 drops per milliliter. Bottom line; don't use drops to DIY.
Truthfully; DIY is all about repeatability.
Because DIY has so many variables (personal preference, method of measurement, accuracy of data, precision of equipment, ambient temperature, ingredient temperature, calibration, tolerance of error, even atmospheric pressure... if you want to start splitting hairs), it really comes down to each DIYer's ability to duplicate his/her methods.
I have yet to find one single recipe that was "perfect the way it was posted." Something always needs a tweak to be most pleasing to my own taste buds. Once I figure out what that is; the skill becomes being able to repeat it. That means, doing the same thing... the same way... every time. Find what works for you.... and stick with it.
Where having "conventions" (doing things the same way as others) becomes important; is when you want to share your recipes with others, or using other's recipes for yourself. I, personally, will never use "drops" as a method of measuring. But, I will also never disparage those that do. If it works for them... then all the more power to them!
It doesn't work for me; so I choose not to personally use it.Remind yourself; that everything (including this post) is what works for others. It is only through trial, and error (and success too), that you will find what works best for you.
As for aging (aka. "steeping;" gawd I hate that word); it can never hurt. Aging usually won't hurt a given mix (though some concentrates can suffer "flavor fade"), and it has yet to save a truly "awful" mixture. But, it can allow some flavors to settle down (become less intense/dominating), and others to "bloom" (or "blossom")(develop and become more pronounced). I never write off as "bad;" a DIY mix before the two-month mark.
VERY first red flag I see is Lime Oil. Don’t mix with or vape anything containing oil. First of all, obviously, it isn’t water soluble. Second, it’ll do a number on clogging your coils. Lastly, who knows what effect it could possibly have on your lungs. (Someone might have a more educated explanation here.) You’re not the first and won’t be the last to make this mistake. I’m also guilty
I’ve noticed years ago (2009 & earlier), mixers used them more. I guess over time it was figured out.Don’t be hard on yourself for grabbing some commercial for the moment! This will help keep you satisfied while your figuring it out and help keep you from throwing in the towel in the process.
As it’s already been mentioned, I can’t recommend using a juice calculator strongly enough. This is where you’ll learn more about accuracy. Although it tells you exact percentages or mls to use, you see it from a different perspective. The more you understand exactly what you’re doing, the better you’ll be able to mix. I strongly feel you get out what you put in, in all things! A little passion goes a long ways
If you just want to use drops atm, for whatever reason, I recommend you looking up Bill’s Magic Vapor (he’s on here also) and reading up on the 100 drop test. I know a handful of people who got started this way without many issues.
There’s lots of great advice already here on ECF and to be given. Don’t be afraid to ask! I’ll be happy to help with all I can, as I know many other here will also. We all started somewhere and I’m not far behind you. Most importantly, don’t give up without giving it a fair chance & enjoy the journey!
Well, the drop method is best avoided, especially in smaller tester recipes, unfortunately. I use a single dropper for flavors I use, so I am at least giving myself "consistent" drops, and I just lay it in some vodka to prevent flavor transfer. I have also marked a certain number of "drops" if using larger recipes, for example, if I want 50 "drops" of a flavor, I have that marked on my syringe.
IDK if it's as precise as some methods, but it works for me, consistency wise.
You won't know how your flavors are without a bit of steeping. How much can depend on the flavor itself, (e.g. creams and custards and tobaccos and a whole lot of other flavors can increase steep time).
Since you have started, I'd probably recommend a couple one shots, that can pretty much be shaken and vaped, as you get up to speed and etc.
How I started: tasted a lot of storebought juice so I knew my flavor profiles, read a ton of recipes, to get ideas, and then single flavor mixes, usually steeped a week before I even tasted them. Once I had some single flavors under my belt I combined them in the tank. Not identical to steeping together, but it gave me a sense of what went with what.
Keep notes the ENTIRE time, heat may decrease steeping ,but sometimes at the cost of flavor loss. I have never heat steeped, although I have used an ultrasonic cleaner on occasion, if in a rush, but it's pretty infrequent that I do that anymore ,I have a mixing schedule and more flavors than I can keep up with.
I am happy to say that my e-liquid recipes are really my own. I stayed patient during the initial phase because I really wanted to understand my flavoring building blocks and how they tend to interact. After time, it sort of becomes more "organic and natural" (IMHO as always) and there's tons of great info and recipes to look at in the DIY forum.
I'm glad I set my expectations low at the start, it has paid dividends for my flavoring skills. I don't use a ton of flavor and if I mix for someone else, I usually have them pick a dominant flavor, then send them away and overflavor and over sweeten (to my taste). As I've progressed and gotten new taste buds, it's nice to be able to really enjoy my creations. Apart from a few vendors I am usually happy with my DIY efforts (with some vomitous ones along the way.) I usually try to fix them before discarding as trying to fix a flavor can be as much of a learning experience (for me).
I'd hazard most "mixologists" don't have a degree in it, or anything. I'd imagine they learned via experience like everyone else. And have a larger commercial area. But, I'm pretty sure that you may someday say that you prefer your own DIY creations to commercial juices.
1) start small
2) write down everything
3) taste stuff, as much as you can
4) Steep.
5) Good luck, and welcome
Anna
IDK if it's as precise as some methods, but it works for me, consistency wise.
You won't know how your flavors are without a bit of steeping. How much can depend on the flavor itself, (e.g. creams and custards and tobaccos and a whole lot of other flavors can increase steep time).
Since you have started, I'd probably recommend a couple one shots, that can pretty much be shaken and vaped, as you get up to speed and etc.
How I started: tasted a lot of storebought juice so I knew my flavor profiles, read a ton of recipes, to get ideas, and then single flavor mixes, usually steeped a week before I even tasted them. Once I had some single flavors under my belt I combined them in the tank. Not identical to steeping together, but it gave me a sense of what went with what.
Keep notes the ENTIRE time, heat may decrease steeping ,but sometimes at the cost of flavor loss. I have never heat steeped, although I have used an ultrasonic cleaner on occasion, if in a rush, but it's pretty infrequent that I do that anymore ,I have a mixing schedule and more flavors than I can keep up with.
I am happy to say that my e-liquid recipes are really my own. I stayed patient during the initial phase because I really wanted to understand my flavoring building blocks and how they tend to interact. After time, it sort of becomes more "organic and natural" (IMHO as always) and there's tons of great info and recipes to look at in the DIY forum.
I'm glad I set my expectations low at the start, it has paid dividends for my flavoring skills. I don't use a ton of flavor and if I mix for someone else, I usually have them pick a dominant flavor, then send them away and overflavor and over sweeten (to my taste). As I've progressed and gotten new taste buds, it's nice to be able to really enjoy my creations. Apart from a few vendors I am usually happy with my DIY efforts (with some vomitous ones along the way.) I usually try to fix them before discarding as trying to fix a flavor can be as much of a learning experience (for me).
I'd hazard most "mixologists" don't have a degree in it, or anything. I'd imagine they learned via experience like everyone else. And have a larger commercial area. But, I'm pretty sure that you may someday say that you prefer your own DIY creations to commercial juices.
1) start small
2) write down everything
3) taste stuff, as much as you can
4) Steep.
5) Good luck, and welcome
Anna
I've found everyone has an opinion and many times they're all different. Though I can usually learn something from everyone, one way or the other. As IDJoel said, find what works for you
Thank you all for the good advise, direction, and guidance. I hate to ask questions in a new thread because I'm sure somewhere in the forum the questions have been asked. But the forum is huge, and the time it will take reading and paging through the responses takes a lot of time when you would like an answer to a specific issue... That doesn't stop me from reading on something and following a rabbit hole then to another then another. There are many people who have written in the forum who I feel genuinely care about helping others live smoke free.
So, if I ask questions that shouldn't be asked in a new thread, Please byte me.
It's a dog eat dog world and I have my milk-bone underwear on.
So, if I ask questions that shouldn't be asked in a new thread, Please byte me.
It's a dog eat dog world and I have my milk-bone underwear on.
I don't mind you or anyone using drops for themselves. It's people who post recipes in drops that bugs me.
It's no different than baking recipes I come across that are obvious to me won't work (egg whites instead of egg yolks). Either the person was going from faulty memory or they were just putting stuff on the internet for the sake of putting stuff on the internet.
I can easily make up a recipe but that doesn't mean it won't taste like cleaner. That's what some of them seem like to me on the recipe sites. Not tried and true but ideas.
Okay, so at 30ml, that makes roughly 14mg/ml. At 70VG...is that what you were aiming for? Not to say you can't vape that, but usually, what I see with high VG levels like that is low-nic (3-6mg/ml) for use in high-powered tanks and drippers. When people use higher nicotine levels like 14mg where your mix is at, they often mix it with higher PG levels (~50%) for use in lower-powered tanks and like vape pens. What kind of vape gear (hardware) are you using, and what nic/pg/vg ratio were the liquids you were buying for it before you started DIY?
Drop the drops and learn to use your syringes, you'll be much happier with the results. Measurements on flavorings need to be accurate for repeatable results.
Gear? 95% of the time I use a drippers. 0.25 to 0.1 ohm at around 52 degrees F.
Most PG based flavorings are 40-50 drops per ml and I've heard of drops as small as 60 per ml. However it sounds like that recipe had plenty of flavoring even when using only half. I've found that some really great ejuice flavors taste like a unrecognizable wall of darkness when too strong. Many of the recipes I see seem like they'd become very tiring due to their strength. The strength would be right at 5 watts, but hardly anyone vapes like that anymore. Most of my mixes are between .8 and 2% (that's about 8-20 drops in 25 ml).
I disagree drops are a bad method of measurement. They're good when you're not using a lot of flavoring -- fewer drops to count and no method is going to be super accurate (except prediluting the flavor so you can measure out a more easily measured amount, which is more trouble).
Also, if you're mixing in 30 ml bottles, make only 25 ml so there's shake room. Even if the juice is considered suitable for "shake and vape" I would consider the first round of bubbles rising out of it (20 minutes) part of the shaking process.I don't emphasize steeping as much as some, most are good after overnight, but I have seen flavors that really need a couple of weeks.
I've made single flavor mixes of most of my flavors to try, and sometimes mix the juices (I did it with store bought, but this is truly appropriate). There are some flavors that just don't seem to work like this, such as milk (IMO), and certainly some flavors are good for subtle use that are sad by themselves. Still, it can be good to know what flavorings just aren't good for you and set them aside for now. The rest is at least vapable.
I don't use many of those flavors. Looking at my notes, I used 7 drops Lemon Sicily in 11 ml base (47/52) and I did like that. Various mixes of that and other fruits at no more than twice that total concentration (effectively -- some are less concentrated) should be good.
I disagree drops are a bad method of measurement. They're good when you're not using a lot of flavoring -- fewer drops to count and no method is going to be super accurate (except prediluting the flavor so you can measure out a more easily measured amount, which is more trouble).
Also, if you're mixing in 30 ml bottles, make only 25 ml so there's shake room. Even if the juice is considered suitable for "shake and vape" I would consider the first round of bubbles rising out of it (20 minutes) part of the shaking process.I don't emphasize steeping as much as some, most are good after overnight, but I have seen flavors that really need a couple of weeks.
I've made single flavor mixes of most of my flavors to try, and sometimes mix the juices (I did it with store bought, but this is truly appropriate). There are some flavors that just don't seem to work like this, such as milk (IMO), and certainly some flavors are good for subtle use that are sad by themselves. Still, it can be good to know what flavorings just aren't good for you and set them aside for now. The rest is at least vapable.
I don't use many of those flavors. Looking at my notes, I used 7 drops Lemon Sicily in 11 ml base (47/52) and I did like that. Various mixes of that and other fruits at no more than twice that total concentration (effectively -- some are less concentrated) should be good.
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Once figuring out the ML and or portions of a ML, I ended up with 1ml, 3ml, 5ml, 10ml and a 20ml syringe. I also have glass cylinders for larger mixes. I make my base (Nic, PG, VG) in bulk because they are the same percent's. The flavorings are usually PG based so I take that into account.
Some flavors are anti-plastic and will wear a syringe out quickly. Banana for one. If you are not sure what I mean, just try it. Have a back-up syringe.
Some flavors are anti-plastic and will wear a syringe out quickly. Banana for one. If you are not sure what I mean, just try it. Have a back-up syringe.
If your using the same dropper for every flavor then drop method kinda works. Big range in drop sizes in droppers, squeeze too hard makes a bigger drop so very inaccurate method.
Starting out with syringes like most do then graduate to scale and never look back. A 500 gram cheapo scale is less than 10 bucks from an overseas vendor, been doing the job for me now a few years.
I got my syringes from the vet. I explained that I was making juice, a quick vape education for them, that I quit smoking to vape, the fact that vaping does work and they were happy to sell them to me. I got needles there also then blunted them myself. I may have paid a bit more but having them inhand along with being accurate(some cheap syringes aren't accurate) so for medical vet use, the syringes should be good quality.
It was the constant syringe mess and cleanup that moved me into using a scale with no cleanup unless you spill. Lots of cool jars in the dollar stores to store juice in then dispense into jugs. I still use syringes mostly to remove juice from a atty or fill a atty with new juice that hasn't got put into a jug yet.
Money spent on syringes could be spent on a scale with much better DIY results in the end.
Starting out with syringes like most do then graduate to scale and never look back. A 500 gram cheapo scale is less than 10 bucks from an overseas vendor, been doing the job for me now a few years.
I got my syringes from the vet. I explained that I was making juice, a quick vape education for them, that I quit smoking to vape, the fact that vaping does work and they were happy to sell them to me. I got needles there also then blunted them myself. I may have paid a bit more but having them inhand along with being accurate(some cheap syringes aren't accurate) so for medical vet use, the syringes should be good quality.
It was the constant syringe mess and cleanup that moved me into using a scale with no cleanup unless you spill. Lots of cool jars in the dollar stores to store juice in then dispense into jugs. I still use syringes mostly to remove juice from a atty or fill a atty with new juice that hasn't got put into a jug yet.
Money spent on syringes could be spent on a scale with much better DIY results in the end.
Where you get flavors surely has syringes and large blunts. You can get boxes and assortments on amazon. I go to the farm store, although I did buy a box of 100 of what I use for flavors because the farm store in town closed so I only go there when I'm getting dog food now.
So on this scale thing. I have a scale that could measure .15ml. That's 2.3gr and I get to .Xgr for reloading. Wouldn't I be sucking up flavorings in a syringe or a pipette to squirt into a bottle to weigh?
What about when the scale is sitting there at 3.6g and you're dripping trying to get to 3.7g and it decides to jump to 3.8g? You don't weigh everything separate do you?
My scale has to be the quality you're talking about, I know how it acts trying to trickle charge tenths of grains, it can't be simple. And an expensive diamond scale (you wouldn't spend that much on syringes in a lifetime) would drive a person crazy trying to do more than putting something on it and covering it with the wind cover. I just can't come up with a way to make it as easy as people say.
I haven't used them other than the check weight but I now grams measure much finer than I do with grains. Am I just thinking too exact?
Walk me through what you do. For the sake of the OP's learning, yeah that's the ticket.
I have piles of pipettes that came with some of the vendor juices I've bought eons ago. Just cut the bulb off and the dropper rubber part fits nice and you have a single use dropper that can be cleaned.
My mixes only have a couple/few ingredients, mostly tobaccos so a 10th here or there isn't a biggie. I've thought many times to upgrade my scale but just never pulled the trigger. Depending on the flavoring container you using, you still have to count drops so the trickle over doesn't happen or stop the pour just short then use the dropper to finish.
I use a DIY magnetic mixer so my mixing procedure is all flavors and PG, mix several minutes. Add the VG then mix quite high for a hour then let sit overnight to dissipate all the air bubbles, add the nic the next day and mix bout 30 min at a much slower speed not to introduce extra air into the mix.
Sitting down to make several mixes produces a lot of syringes to clean, I don't believe in water clean then into a new flavor with the syringe, very easy contamination of a flavor.
My mixes only have a couple/few ingredients, mostly tobaccos so a 10th here or there isn't a biggie. I've thought many times to upgrade my scale but just never pulled the trigger. Depending on the flavoring container you using, you still have to count drops so the trickle over doesn't happen or stop the pour just short then use the dropper to finish.
I use a DIY magnetic mixer so my mixing procedure is all flavors and PG, mix several minutes. Add the VG then mix quite high for a hour then let sit overnight to dissipate all the air bubbles, add the nic the next day and mix bout 30 min at a much slower speed not to introduce extra air into the mix.
Sitting down to make several mixes produces a lot of syringes to clean, I don't believe in water clean then into a new flavor with the syringe, very easy contamination of a flavor.
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