Need advice for a safe E liquid formula

[RocketPuppy]

You may want to look at the msds for those. After reading it, I wouldn't inhale xantham gum.

 

[tayone415]

You may want to look at the msds for those. After reading it, I wouldn't inhale xantham gum.

Thanks, I didn't look into that before buying or using it as it's steeping ATM. I looked into food grade xantham gum in msds like you suggested and only am seeing information in dust form.

 

[RocketPuppy]

This would be the liquid form:
http://www.rigchem.com/_literature_108342/MSDS_-_RigXan-L_plus_Liquid_Xanthan_Gum_Viscosifier

 

[Aheadatime]

I'm not sure if you won't buy online because you don't have a credit card to use or because you like seeing the product first hand before you purchase, but like 99% of the flavoring companies out there are online-only. It would be in your best interest as a DIYer to try out some of the more popular, higher-quality flavoring companies like FA, Hangsen, Inawera, TFA, etc.

As far as diacetyl goes, I'll try to keep this short and informative. Diacetyl is bad for your lungs. There are other flavor molecules that can catalyze into diacetyl, such as acetoin. Because the flavorings we buy only have between 0-1% acetoin, diacetyl, etc., they are not required to inform consumers about their presence, since these flavorings are for food use and diacetyl is no issue if you eat it in such small amounts. When a company says "diacetyl free" without providing spreadsheets, it almost always means they are within the 1% category.

There has been research showing that diacetyl can negatively impact our lungs even if there's only 1% in the concentrates. Diacetyl can appear in flavors not related to butter at all, like blueberry. There are only two companies so far who have provided full spreadsheets on the chemical make-up of their flavoring concentrates - TFA and FA. Both of these companies either contain no acetoin, diacetyl, etc., or they warn you when a flavoring does contain it.

 

[tayone415]

I'm not sure if you won't buy online because you don't have a credit card to use or because you like seeing the product first hand before you purchase, but like 99% of the flavoring companies out there are online-only. It would be in your best interest as a DIYer to try out some of the more popular, higher-quality flavoring companies like FA, Hangsen, Inawera, TFA, etc.

As far as diacetyl goes, I'll try to keep this short and informative. Diacetyl is bad for your lungs. There are other flavor molecules that can catalyze into diacetyl, such as acetoin. Because the flavorings we buy only have between 0-1% acetoin, diacetyl, etc., they are not required to inform consumers about their presence, since these flavorings are for food use and diacetyl is no issue if you eat it in such small amounts. When a company says "diacetyl free" without providing spreadsheets, it almost always means they are within the 1% category.

There has been research showing that diacetyl can negatively impact our lungs even if there's only 1% in the concentrates. Diacetyl can appear in flavors not related to butter at all, like blueberry. There are only two companies so far who have provided full spreadsheets on the chemical make-up of their flavoring concentrates - TFA and FA. Both of these companies either contain no acetoin, diacetyl, etc., or they warn you when a flavoring does contain it.

I normally don't like to order online, because of bad luck, and having to wait, and yes I like to see what I buy before paying for it, and was hoping to buy in store, so I would be able to finish steeping it before I ran out of e liquid. But, looks like it's not the best option after rocket puppy pointed out a certain ingredient I over looked, based on posts saying the flavor I purchased was safe, and also seeing it sold on DIY e juice sites.

Is FTA the flavor apprentice and what is FA?
and

 

[tayone415]

I do have a question, after reading several posts as the responses were all completely different.

So I've been told and read that pure glycerin is safe as long as it has USP on it even if it says for external use only, and food grade isn't good enough.

What about Kosher USP Vegetable Glycerin is it any better or safer if it's USP and says food grade, that it can be used internally? (I know Kosher makes no difference)

I also read that the best glycerin is pharmaceutical grade for inhalation in asthma inhalers, but also read somewhere pure USP glycerin was the same as pharmaceutical grade. Is it different?

 

[MotherNatural]

There are two "stickies" at the top of the DIY forum page that go into great detail about quality and grades of PG and VG.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/diy-e-liquid/52669-pg-vg-labeling-purity-please-read.html
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/diy-e-liquid/277267-purity-pg-vg-peg-short-version.html

TFA is The Flavor Apprentice
FA is Flavour Art

 

[juggalofisher88]

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=558845

Powered by Area Rom Centura 1.3

 

[Not A One]

There has been research showing that diacetyl can negatively impact our lungs even if there's only 1% in the concentrates.

There has? Can you link me? So far all the "research" I've seen on the trace levels issue has been people making wildly inaccurate comparisons to the NIOSH recommended exposure limits.

 

[FStopFive]

There has? Can you link me? So far all the "research" I've seen on the trace levels issue has been people making wildly inaccurate comparisons to the NIOSH recommended exposure limits.

Do a search for diacetyl on here and you'll be rewarded with countless hours and threads about the issue...some containing links to research, others containing good information.

As far as the question about Triacetin, yes, it can crack tanks. Moreover, a lot of people (myself included) don't like using anything with Triacetin in it because we can taste/feel it in a mix, and it also gives a lot of people (myself included) canker sores. Not sure what specifically about Triacetin causes this, but since I stopped vaping anything containing it my mouth is a lot happier.

 

[Not A One]

Do a search for diacetyl on here and you'll be rewarded with countless hours and threads about the issue...some containing links to research, others containing good information.

No, I'll be rewarded with countless hours and threads of people calculating the ppb of diacetyl in a hypothetical juice, then assuming that number is an actual exposure level and comparing it to the NIOSH RELs, which has no basis in reality. I've done this search already. That's one of the reasons I signed up for this forum, I couldn't take seeing that same weird assumption anymore.

Yes, I see a lot of threads on diacetyl, and I've seen reports on the effects of diacetyl; I've never seen a study on nasty effects from "trace" diacetyl, and given the NIOSH RELs, I doubt there has been one, but maybe it could be too recent for them to have taken into account? That's why I asked for a link to the study.

 

[Crunktanium]

There has? Can you link me? So far all the "research" I've seen on the trace levels issue has been people making wildly inaccurate comparisons to the NIOSH recommended exposure limits.

I concur it's a witch hunt likely being provoked by those manufactures who want to dominate the industry. John from WL and myself had a discussion about this and he just laughs at much of what people write on the subject. I trust someone with his background who has yet to see any study to back the never ending claims. Those with an agenda will likely ramble forever about non existent studies that will likely never happen. If anyone did a real study on Diacetyl and vaping it would impact some very big players who could potentially be sued off the face of this earth.

But everyone on ECF who makes juice is an expert on things even the experts don't have a clue about.

Many who eat foods made corn syrup wont touch and warn others to stay away from foods with real sugar. I wonder when people will crusade against foods with corn sweeteners because it's actually worse then real sugar. Probably never because the people who control the mass media are to busy cashing in from the advertisers pushing the cheap foods that are killing people. In fact I bet there are high trace amounts of Diacetyl being released into the air of every home that cooks microwave foods.

 

[DeviantDigi]

I've been vaping the most thick, almost chunky, tobacco absolute for about 5 years. Way past due, same bottle when I was like 20 years old. I just take a bottle of what looks like %50 pg/vg, and add an estimated 20% of %100 nicotine. Just dropping some weird flavors wherever, whatever, some concoctions like bitter wizard wherever needed.

I'm just saying after 10 year of use, I'm still alive with no side effects. It turns out if when parents let their children play in the mud, their immune system become stronger. That's not the answer to your question lol.

 

[BobC]

I've been vaping the most thick, almost chunky, tobacco absolute for about 5 years. Way past due, same bottle when I was like 20 years old. I just take a bottle of what looks like %50 pg/vg, and add an estimated 20% of %100 nicotine. Just dropping some weird flavors wherever, whatever, some concoctions like bitter wizard wherever needed.

I'm just saying after 10 year of use, I'm still alive with no side effects. It turns out if when parents let their children play in the mud, their immune system become stronger. That's not the answer to your question lol.

This has to be about the most dangerous post I've ever seen on ECF

Folks, don't try this at home, the poster is brain dead already, but just doesn't know it

 

[Boletus]

I just take a bottle of what looks like %50 pg/vg, and add an estimated 20% of %100 nicotine.

Did you mean 20% of 100 mg/ml nicotine? As stated, your mixture is a recipe for disaster.