Negating Steeping

[Frenchfry1942]

Thanks @dannyv45. It seems that some are asking, and myself included, about experience in specific procedures. I test initially my mixes, but I always prepare DIY recipes way before being required to vape them. I think that is an advantage. As soon as I taste the juice a couple times throughout the day, I consider the steeping. But, it is inevitable that it will be a few weeks before I have reach for it in vaping need. I don't mind having juices sitting in a dark drawer.

For the crock pot, I put the bottles in ziplock bags and put the temp on low. Because their is a "some" air in the bags, they float and so I turn them over occasionally in the pot. But, their is no stirring in this process.

The question of the hot plate and stirrer is just a learning for me. Obviously, the crock pot is cheaper, but what are people that do use a hot plate/stirrer experiencing. What temp is good, how long is good? Hopefully, some one will chime in.

 

[FACE MEAT]

Because their is a "some" air in the bags, they float and so I turn them over occasionally in the pot.

Put some marbles or something else heavy in the zip lock bags.

 

[Frenchfry1942]

Hmmm, I have no marbles, but...I do have rocks in my head. (As my wife says)

Thanks!!! [emoji4]

 

[FACE MEAT]

You can use some of her gold jewelry.

 

[dannyv45]

You can use some of her gold jewelry.

Only use gold jewelry when steeping in a UltraSonic cleaner this way you can stay on her good side by cleaning it while you were steeping.

 

[Vaslovik]

I don't bother with steeping at all. Nic and flavors in my juice amounts to 28 ml in a 100 ml batch, 10 ml of that being nic. I find my juice ready to vape and quite tasty the next day. I've never understood the whole steeping controversy.

 

[dannyv45]

Entirely to much emphases is placed on steeping. My philosophy is if it taste good right away vape it right away. If it's weak or missing taste give it a week or two and see what develops. If it's down right disgusting dump it because no amount of steeping will make it good.

True there are mixes such as tobaccos that benefit from steeping and experience will tell you what those are but it's not nessessary to obsess over what needs and what don't need steeping. Simply stated "if it's good vape it if it's not steep it, if it's still not good after a steep adjust it or dump it".

 

[Tbev]

I'm glad to hear that, it's what originally turned me off of diy, prolly cost me a hundred grand by now in juice, not really, but a lot, I go thru 30ml/day easy, I'm pretty excited about starting, just trying to do everything I can do vape right away, I'm just impatient. It's like that for me building mods, waiting for the cnc machine to get done running parts off, engraving patterns is especially gruling, takes forever. It's the anticipation that kills me!

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

 

[JCinFLA]

@Tbev - I've been buying & using gallons of PG & VG from Bulk Apothecary in Ohio, and it's always very good. Is labeled Nature's Own brand, which I think they're affiliated with, and/or are a part of the same parent company.

Their VG reg. price has been $13.40/10lb. bottle (gallon jug), and is labeled "100% Pure, USP Grade-Kosher".

Their PG reg. price has been $18.52/8lb. bottle (gallon jug), and is labeled "100% Pure, Propylene Gylcol".

At regular price, for a gallon jug of each...it costs $31.92 + $12.59 shipping = $44.51 from Ohio to FL with FedEx Home Delivery. Your cost for delivery might be less if it's to a business. They have sales every now & then, too, and I got it once for 15% off and another time for 17% off.

You might want to check them out, too, as another option to consider for your PG & VG. Quite a few people on the Flavor Apprentice Thread use it, too.

 

[dannyv45]

I'm glad to hear that, it's what originally turned me off of diy, prolly cost me a hundred grand by now in juice, not really, but a lot, I go thru 30ml/day easy, I'm pretty excited about starting, just trying to do everything I can do vape right away, I'm just impatient. It's like that for me building mods, waiting for the cnc machine to get done running parts off, engraving patterns is especially gruling, takes forever. It's the anticipation that kills me!

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

Being this is all new to you let me give you some reference resources.

My blogs will give insight into all aspects of DYI, from steeping to what supplies to have on hand to a basic walk through mixing your first E-juice.

E-Cigarette Forum - dannyv45 - Blogs

Then read hoosier's blogs. These blogs concentrate on fine tuning your mix and give insight on additives.

E-Cigarette Forum - Hoosier - Blogs

Then read Boletus's blog's. These blogs concentrate on formulation of nicotine bases regarding proper calculations methods for figuring Nicotine concentration as well as safety.

E-Cigarette Forum - Boletus - Blogs

Then read Ginger's book "E-Cigarettes 102: DIY E-Liquid". It is a book which I've contributed to that delivers an in depth easy to follow guide in the art of DYI.

E-Cigarettes 102: DIY E-Liquid

I recommend viewing VPLive Vape Team Episode #82: DIY Safety and bookmark it for future reference. It explains safety in all aspects of DYI.

VPLive Vape Team Episode #82: DIY Safety

List of suppliers and other useful links courtesy of ECF Member Sir2fyablyNutz

List of suppliers and other useful links | E-Cigarette Forum

then read the stickies at the top of the page.

Reading the above will explain a lot of the how's and why's and help you formulate questions on what you may not understand. Best of luck.

 

[Tbev]

That's fantastic, thank you guys! I just ordered a liter of nude nic 100/MG and a pile of flavors from bull city vapor, they have better prices than the the flavor companies and I got flavors from tfa, cap, fw, and a couple more all from the same place, free shipping over a hundred bucks, nude was the same free shipping. I got a couple recipes I want to try so I got all the ingredients for them and a handful more . I'm shopping for hotpate\magnetic stirrers at the moment, not sure about them, they seem to be crappie unless you spend a lot on them, I'm gonna figure out the best one for the money, I'll report back regarding that.


I haven't seen anyone noting a difference between vg suppliers? I was concerned about the differences in nic and got that figured out, I think, but as long as I get vg from a real source, BA in Ohio, or the guys on amazon, it's good, no worries?

 

[minimalsaint]

I haven't seen anyone noting a difference between vg suppliers? I was concerned about the differences in nic and got that figured out, I think, but as long as I get vg from a real source, BA in Ohio, or the guys on amazon, it's good, no worries?

Essential depot is a good place to get VG. I've been using them for a couple of years now and have always been happy with the price and quality of the product.

 

[engmia]

I don't consider myself a "real" mixer as you put it, but generally there is no such thing as speed steeping. You might find many techniques posted, but they are not really speeding up the steeping process, they are rather creating a new process. Putting higher flavour percentages might be effective to get the particular task "make this liquid vapable NOW" work, but it's DEFINITELY not steeping.

This is a discussion that has been going on for months on Reddit DIY Liquid now and the people who are on the proposing side of speed steeping are now changing their mind after some experiments. Especially heat speed steeping is alleged to degrade the shelf life of e-liquids greatly.

Check this two threads, they contain great info:
DIY Mythbusting • /r/DIY_eJuice
Mythbusting Skiddlz Mythbusting is Busted! • /r/DIY_eJuice

There are some liquids that you can vape right after you make them, but I suggest to just stick to regular old time for steeping.

I don't see why people are always trying to skip on this. With some basic planning you'll never notice a liquid steeping. In my eyes it's like trying to undercook your meal.

 

[dannyv45]

I would have to agree with both links above but expecially the first one. This writer really knows there craft and what they say makes complete sense. I've given up on speed steeping for passage of time steeping quite a while ago and must admit that I enjoy my mixes much more. In fact most of my mixes I just mix and vape and just enjoy how they get better with the passage of time. As was mentioned timing is everything. I make enough (Usually 120 - 240ml) to last until the next batch is ready. My UC and crock pot these days is used for hot alcohol tobacco extraction only these days and I'm not even convinced if hot tobacco alcohol extraction is better over cold alcohol extraction. I just don't use extracts that much these days to warrant a long experiment.

I also agree with the statements on flavorings and additives. Great links above I think everyone should have a look at them.

 

[ENAUD]

I would have to agree with both links above but expecially the first one. This writer really knows there craft and what they say makes complete sense. I've given up on speed steeping for passage of time steeping quite a while ago and must admit that I enjoy my mixes much more. In fact most of my mixes I just mix and vape and just enjoy how they get better with the passage of time. As was mentioned timing is everything. I make enough (Usually 120 - 240ml) to last until the next batch is ready. My UC and crock pot these days is used for hot alcohol tobacco extraction only these days and I'm not even convinced if hot tobacco alcohol extraction is better over cold alcohol extraction. I just don't use extracts that much these days to warrant a long experiment.

I also agree with the statements on flavorings and additives. Great links above I think everyone should have a look at them.

I gave up on the whole speed steeping thing after only a few experiments about two years ago. I settled on just seed steeping, and/or shake and vape. The flavors that I had that required extensive air steeping with the cap off I wound up tossing, and stuck with the ones that were pleasing upon mix and shake. My flavors that I keep as my regulars, I mix 100 or so mls at a time and have a row of bottles on a closet shelf lined up in the order they were mixed, fresh ones go to the back of the line. Living with DIY, I found it best to just have a routine, where I keep ahead of my needs with very little effort.

 

[Tbev]

I totally understand making juice in advance to give it time, but I'm just stsrting, I realize it's not rocket science too, but if I'm trying to put something together and taste how it's coming along, to see what it needs, waiting days,weeks,month between tuning a recipe just sounds really lousy to me. Ya know that I mean?? I understand that it's probably the best way, but anything I can do to cut down on time and allow me to fine tune a recipe without having to wait I'm all for.
It makes sense to me that some flavors would be good to go right out of the gates and some would take a little longer and some may need to air out and still take a long time etc.. maybe we should make a list of the flavors that are good, or tend to be better, maybe that's more applicable, right off the bat? I just ordered a bunch of flavors and that would have been something I would have liked to know. I looked for recipes that sounded good to me, and that said they required minimum time to vape and those are mostly what I tried to order. I got a lot of others too, I guess I'll find out.
I'm still hunting for the right stirrer/hotplate, If anyone's using one I'd love to hear what you think. Maybe I'll just forget about that...

 

[engmia]

I totally understand making juice in advance to give it time, but I'm just stsrting, I realize it's not rocket science too, but if I'm trying to put something together and taste how it's coming along, to see what it needs, waiting days,weeks,month between tuning a recipe just sounds really lousy to me. Ya know that I mean?? I understand that it's probably the best way, but anything I can do to cut down on time and allow me to fine tune a recipe without having to wait I'm all for.
It makes sense to me that some flavors would be good to go right out of the gates and some would take a little longer and some may need to air out and still take a long time etc.. maybe we should make a list of the flavors that are good, or tend to be better, maybe that's more applicable, right off the bat? I just ordered a bunch of flavors and that would have been something I would have liked to know. I looked for recipes that sounded good to me, and that said they required minimum time to vape and those are mostly what I tried to order. I got a lot of others too, I guess I'll find out.
I'm still hunting for the right stirrer/hotplate, If anyone's using one I'd love to hear what you think. Maybe I'll just forget about that...

Yeah I really get the concept of speed steeping and why people would want to do it. Everyone has toyed with the idea, including me.

However the answer is simply no. Sure, you can change the process, don't expect to get the same results though. And I'm not talking about "best" method vs "worst" method here. All I'm saying is that if you're expecting that your heat stirred/more flavour percentage/and various other methods that got discussed in this thread is going to taste and behave the same as just waiting it steep, you're dead wrong. You're tasting a different recipe really.

And if you might think I'm talking bul.... and such small details might not matter -- take cooking for example. Find three different people, one who can't cook, one can cook well and a professional chef. Give them the same ingredients and same task -- bake a chicken. Just by changing the preparation method (still using same ingredients) the three different cooks will produce marginally different results.

Back to e-juice mixing, many people have reported success with speed steeping and some swear by it. However as the threads above I posted point out, it might greatly alter the chemical reactions and the shelf life of the juice.

 

[Tbev]

I believe you 110%, I've never mixed a drop off juice, I build mods, I just see how bad the government wants to put the screws to us so I'm thing to get all the info I can amd give mixing a shot. Years ago I wanted to start but steeping is the past that really turned me away from it. ... I figured I would just end up with a bottle of everything I had all mixed together into puddle scum.

So I follow that heat application is the same as another ingredient so my thought is to aim at ingredients and recipes that are mix and vape or maybe that do turn out well if heat\mix steeped. .. I keep thinking, everyone pretty much uses the same flavors, so a list of flavorings that are good right off the bat would be way cool ? What are your thoughts on that?

I hope everyone knows that I am really excited about mixing my own juice, I'm not trying to sell it or anything, just not pay for it. I'm really just looking for info and opinions , and I really appreciate hearing everyone's.

 

[ghola1was]

I don't have a list of flavors for you, but imho the following is a reasonable guide.

Fruits - shake and vape, or a couple days steep at most to let things settle

Fruits with low percentage creams - one week steep

Creams and custards - two weeks steep to let the flavors develop

Tobacco flavors - one month minimum

The above is based on my own tastes, your mileage may vary.

 

[Tbev]

Cool, thanks for all the tips! Anything you've got to share I'm happy to listen. I'm trying to figure out if I'm more excited to try it, or more curious to see if I can actually vape something I mix together, haha.