new blood with a possible idea

[leavitodeaver]

don't laugh at the new guy please, but i think i understand the concept of the contraption of an atomizer now. going to back to basics, normal vaporizers are made of glass, is there any reason not to use it with the heating coil provided with any of the PV's available? has anyone tried this? seems to me it might give a more even hit, as opposed to the metal whatever-it-is wrapped around the thing. might be an issue with time, but i'm sure somebody's got a thin piece of glass somewhere that'll fit. just throwing an idea out, ordered my 510 today, looking forward to gutting it after i burn thru the 2 packs i ordered. also, it may have been done before, but i couldn't find it, all this talk of "pen-style" things made the wheels turn, has anyone made a custom shell out of a pen casing? one of the high class metal ones maybe? i figure having a cap over the mouthpiece would be great if you're keeping the thing in your pocket.

 

[mogur]

Good morning and welcome. Good questions. I am not quite sure what you mean by normal vaporizers, though. For pot? About half of those are glass and half are metal, from what I've seen. Vaporizing plant material is a different science than vaporizing a liquid. Ecigs are fog machines with a little nicotine tossed in. The nickel foam metal around an atomizer is there to wick the juice from the cartridge to the front of the atomizer, and to help aerosolize the juice when air is drawn through it. The actual vaporization is done in a ceramic pot by a heating coil wrapped around glass fibers, at least in most ecigs. A few disposable atomizers just jam the heating coil right into the juice cartridge.

I have seen one penstyle cap for ecigs on the internet, but that was just the cap. Haven't seen anyone modify a real pen casing to fit an ecig. That would be elegant.

 

[leavitodeaver]

morning? this is my late night . yeah, every vap i've ever seen before was for some sort of illicit substance, never seen a metal one before, but i've never been into that whole scene either. so you're saying the nickel foam acts like a sponge instead of a conductor, that's good to know. or wick, i guess that's a better description. has there been any talk of eliminating all that? sorry to drag you back to basics, but i like to work my way up to the ungodly complicated, engineer's mind. despite vaporizing plant life versus liquid, is it really that different? i'm thinking about putting the liquid in a non-removable container with a heating element (maybe 2 or 3) wrapped around it. it could be done easily, would vaporize evenly, no more loss thru a wick, and could be done with a stopper. think of a mason jar with hot wires wrapped around it and a hole in the top. god i wish i had a scanner. i've got two days off and i'll be damned if i don't make this happen

 

[mogur]

Big grin, and good evening. Your idea is excellent, it is used extensively to vaporize plants, oils, and liquids. As a tabletop unit, would be awesome. But the trick with ecigs is to atomize a small drop almost instantly on demand. There's no time to wait for a 'vessel' to heat up.

 

[happily]

I personally wouldn't want to break the glass every time i dropped, and am also assuming this would require the liquid maintaining contact w/ the glass in order to heat. I also agree with mogul on the wait time

 

[leavitodeaver]

that's where i get stuck . pretty sure i can get it hot enough in under a second or 2, just need a near-perfect conductor, platinum maybe, to use as a container, and about 5 volts. the issue i can't get past is finding a way to keep the juice inside, while being able to inhale vapor without relying on gravity. and i'm sure i'm the first person ever to contemplate this problem too 8D. some kind of "state of matter check valve"? ideas?

 

[leavitodeaver]

then of course comes the problem of crafting an actual container made of platinum. and that assumes that heating it doesn't create chlorine gas or the like 8-o. found a good looking pen in my desk though, today's already going my way. happily, you in austin?

 

[kinabaloo]

You can just have a very tiny nozzle or valve for the vapor to escape.

But as it stands, this approach is just not usable - it would work but the power requirements and heating delay would be very serious problems.

But there is merit here - need a major rethink so that heating just a tiny amount of liquid.

I still believe that the best approach for e-cigs would be piezo mister sends droplets of juice to heater coil to be vaporised. No leaks, no fiddly inconsistent cart.

 

[surbitonPete]

You can just have a very tiny nozzle or valve for the vapor to escape.

But as it stands, this approach is just not usable - it would work but the power requirements and heating delay would be very serious problems.

But there is merit here - need a major rethink so that heating just a tiny amount of liquid.

I still believe that the best approach for e-cigs would be piezo mister sends droplets of juice to heater coil to be vaporised. No leaks, no fiddly inconsistent cart.

I am with you on the piezo mister, I am sure that is possible and I expect there wouldn't even be a need for the atomizer to have any of the wicking mesh if a fine mist was sprayed on it every time you took a draw.

 

[kinabaloo]

I am with you on the piezo mister, I am sure that is possible and I expect there wouldn't even be a need for the atomizer to have any of the wicking mesh if a fine mist was sprayed on it every time you took a draw.

Indeed, piezo misters, as used in inkjet printers, can be finely controlled and accurately directed.

The standard order would then be battery ~ juice, piezo & atomizer ~ mouthpiece. The juice container can be refilled via the same valve employed when inserted into the e-cig.

 

[leavitodeaver]

port injected vaporizer?! that's a hell of an idea. never seen anything like the mister you mentioned, but i am new to this. what're the voltage/current specs on that? i'd be worried about extra battery drain from adding a new component into the mix, the stock batteries don't last long enough as is. but you vets probably have screwdrivers anyway 8D. great idea! anyone else have any revolutionary theories to add?

 

[kinabaloo]

port injected vaporizer?! that's a hell of an idea. never seen anything like the mister you mentioned, but i am new to this. what're the voltage/current specs on that? i'd be worried about extra battery drain from adding a new component into the mix, the stock batteries don't last long enough as is. but you vets probably have screwdrivers anyway 8D. great idea! anyone else have any revolutionary theories to add?

Piezo misters are low power. 1 AA powers those room perfumer gadgets that release a puff every so often.

A piezo mister is an alternative to heater coil vaporizer; I think the best of both world's comes from combining the two. Mentioned this a few months ago now but nobody's built one yet. So I will as soon as I get some free time

 

[EDO]

Kinabaloo...I think the original Ruyan patent was the combination of piezo and Heating coil. I don't know why no one has made it....seems logical enough.

 

[kinabaloo]

Kinabaloo...I think the original Ruyan patent was the combination of piezo and Heating coil. I don't know why no one has made it....seems logical enough.

Are you sure? I know it had a piezo but didnt know it had both (in same device); although I expect they have patented both (each).

Perhaps dry residues can clog up the piezo / delivery? Though simple hot water rinse would clean that out as the residue there would not be burnt/hardened.

 

[EDO]

Yeah...I seem to remember that one of their patents was piezo and heating coil combo. I am pretty sure but not 100%. Just a piezo...wouldn't make sense since the vapor would be cold. Hey kinabaloo...just because they have a patent doesn't mean you can;t make one for yourself and share it with us...lol. Anyway, Ruyan owns all the patents...but it seems like everyone and their mother is making ecigs...how does that work?

 

[leavitodeaver]

you can patent anything so long as it's slightly different from the original product, "upgraded" in some fashion. how much juice would this piezo mister use? you've got me interested now, i'd like to see it in action. i'll do some research and get back to you guys. i appreciate all the ideas so far, just talking with you guys has got my brain going in all sorts of directions 8D. keep up the good work!

 

[kinabaloo]

you can patent anything so long as it's slightly different from the original product, "upgraded" in some fashion. how much juice would this piezo mister use? you've got me interested now, i'd like to see it in action. i'll do some research and get back to you guys. i appreciate all the ideas so far, just talking with you guys has got my brain going in all sorts of directions 8D. keep up the good work!

'Cool steam' (mist) generators are those room humidiers. Similar tech is employed in some plug-in room perfumers and also in inkjet printers. So this 'vapor' would really be 'just water'. The vapor from most e-cigs is PG/VG that becomes visible as it momentarily recondenses (crystalizes, anhydrous); disappearing as water is absorbed and becomes a dispersed liquid mist, gaining in particle size all the while.

IBM has/had an alternative to piezo for printers: bubblejet; this works by vaporising a tiny amount of liquid. This technique, in perhaps an adapted form, would also be an alternative for us, in this case able to replace the heater coil (and allowing a sealed but refillable juice container). Imagine that juice can flow along a tiny tube to a tiny bubble-shaped boiler; heating this this tiny amount of liquid creates a vapor that pushes out through a tiny nozzle/valve. The vapor does not return in the other direction by perhaps valve, or resistance provided by liquid weight or narrowness of tube (capillary strength) or both.