New study: vaping no more toxic than breathing air

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jpargana

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You really can't see that the study was to promote BAT's vapor products? Wow...


What about other "studies", clearly biased and/or poorly designed *on purpose* to put ecigs under a bad light - promoted by e-cig opponents (For example, the 2009 FDA's "nitrosamines study")? Do they not bother you also?
What about studies that are *favourable* to vaping overall, but what's reported in the media is only a distorted, parcial view of that same study (For example, the "formaldehyde study")? Does that bother you?

So, this favourable study is NOT to be believed, because all it does is "promote BAT's vapor products" ?
While anti-vaping "studies" are all done by honest researchers, with absolutely no conflicts of interest in the matter... right? Right...
 

skoony

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You really can't see that the study was to promote BAT's vapor products? Wow...
i course they are promoting their products.
so what?
whats good for the goose is good for the gander.
if its a valid study,its a valid study.
does anyone believe in this day and age
BT would release a bogus study knowing the
ANTZ of the world would see it?
:2c:
mike
 

3mg Meniere

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It all means rebuilding the tobacco industry from making cigs and loose tobacco, to nicotine extraction. Massive overhaul, and they are not ready for it. They need to slow things down, but the bell has rung. In the meantime, small operations are developing to do that extraction, and BT sees them as threats.

They are not changing fast enough to adapt to consumer demand. It looks like BAT is on the leading edge of that adaptation. It is inevitable. Adapt or die;
 

stevegmu

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i course they are promoting their products.
so what?
whats good for the goose is good for the gander.
if its a valid study,its a valid study.
does anyone believe in this day and age
BT would release a bogus study knowing the
ANTZ of the world would see it?
:2c:
mike

The way studies have become, studies from either side are meaningless... The formaldehyde study wasn't quite accurate, but very effective...
 

stevegmu

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What about other "studies", clearly biased and/or poorly designed *on purpose* to put ecigs under a bad light - promoted by e-cig opponents (For example, the 2009 FDA's "nitrosamines study")? Do they not bother you also?
What about studies that are *favourable* to vaping overall, but what's reported in the media is only a distorted, parcial view of that same study (For example, the "formaldehyde study")? Does that bother you?

So, this favourable study is NOT to be believed, because all it does is "promote BAT's vapor products" ?
While anti-vaping "studies" are all done by honest researchers, with absolutely no conflicts of interest in the matter... right? Right...

No. Studies by either side are meaningless and crafted to obtain a specific result, rather than the truth...
 

jpargana

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No. Studies by either side are meaningless and crafted to obtain a specific result, rather than the truth...

Many favourable studies have already been done without any sponsorship from the "e-cigarette industry", whatever that means.

In fact, those studies were part of what convinced me to start vaping in the first place - and there was not a "big, powerful e-cig industry" in the beginning of 2009. Not even today.

The other part that convinced me? Seeing powerful organizations already lying to the public, even back then. Just like that 2009 FDA "nitrosamines study"(*).

I figured that if the e-cig was indeed that bad, *all* they had to do was to present those studies to the public. Unadultered.

Clearly, they already had an agenda against e-gigs. If they had to lie and spin those studies results, it was simply because those studies were *contradicting* what they wanted the public to believe. Therefore, those studies had to be *favourable* towards e-cigarettes.

(*) What is the point of making a *comparative* study (Nicotrol inhaler vs electronic cigarettes), if you then *hide* the data about the inhaler, so that people cannot actually *compare* anything? Easy. It was done so that people could not even realize that the nitrosamine levels were similar on *both* products, and therefore, it made no sense advising for a ban of the latter - after aproving the former as safe.

If the levels found on the e-cig were really as bad as FDA would have us believe, all they had to do was simply present the charts, side by side, for *both* products, so that people could *see* how terrible the e-cig was. That was to be expected on a *comparative* study, after all. But it did not happen. And it was not because they found how terrible an e-cig is.
 

Kent C

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Just as in some parts of the deeming, studies are required by regulatory agencies to ensure safety. Again, it's why Campbells, GM, (all car companies), every pharmaceutical company, and so many others, test their products to avoid shutdowns by agencies or to avoid or respond to lawsuits
 

Alien Traveler

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They have a conclusion and do a study to support it. That's how they usually go. I'll wager the next one will say closed systems, like they sell, are the safest...
Exactly. I am awaiting study from them to show dangers of open/high wattage tanks.
 

zoiDman

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Exactly. I am awaiting study from them to show dangers of open/high wattage tanks.

Given the Study's Funders.

If the Protocol had been such to model High Wattage vaping, or if another e-Liquid had been Tested, and the Results had not be Favorable, do you think the Study Authors would have been Allowed to Publish the Results?
 
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Jman8

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No. Studies by either side are meaningless and crafted to obtain a specific result, rather than the truth...

Can't agree that the studies / results are meaningless, but do agree that research appears to be crafted to obtain a specific result. Which is, in sound bite terms, a knock on science more than anything. People routinely say anecdotal evidence is not reliable, but seemingly can't see how utterly unreliable scientific research routinely is, with almost nothing to change this in the near future.
 

zoiDman

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Can't agree that the studies / results are meaningless, but do agree that research appears to be crafted to obtain a specific result. Which is, in sound bite terms, a knock on science more than anything. People routinely say anecdotal evidence is not reliable, but seemingly can't see how utterly unreliable scientific research routinely is, with almost nothing to change this in the near future.

This Isn't a "Knock on Science".

It is a knock on People who use Science to promote a Personal, Political or Monetary Goal.
 

Kent C

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This Isn't a "Knock on Science".

It is a knock on People who use Science to promote a Personal, Political or Monetary Goal.

Science became Junk Science when science gave way to 'Consensus', where number of those in agreement with a certain position overruled actual science. Second-hand smoke effects was an early example, by cherry picking parts of studies and altering standard statistical constants (as stated by the judge in the court case which threw out the EPA's results). But there were some instances before that. It is a fairly recent phenomena - with a few exceptions earlier.... and the most significant later was (Michael) Mann-made global warming.

In general, leftist activists and their comrades in university science departments started it by attempting to remove or or stop products they didn't like from coming to market and business and their comrades in science responded in kind.

As far as ecigs go, Bill G listed a bunch of examples here:

Bill Godshall and Smokefree Pennsylvania submit 158 pages of comments to FDA on e-cigarette evidence | E-Cigarette Forum
 
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