Nicoticket Testing Results

[wbbrn1952]

I have been with Clark since the beginning - I think he told me one time I was his 4 or 5th customer. I will say that there is no other person who is more up front about his ingredients and his business. He is truly passionate about providing a product that is tasty and safe.
vaping is something that is chosen - most vapers started out as smokers and each time you lit up a stinky you did not care that the numerous carcinogens and other toxin were in each puff. I say hooray to each one of you that has stopped smoking because you are now vaping. Well again you made the choice to vape - you could have done the totally responsible thing and just quit cigarettes but you didn't - no one has ever said that vaping is 100% safe - you are not safe taking a shower - you are not safe breathing air in our cities. So quit ragging on Clark to make your vaping safe - it is not his job - he provides you with a quality juice that he has been most transparent about - one on the first to test and release data to the public - his juice is flavorful and I trust him to make a quality product - if your concern is being able to vape with a 100% safe guarantee you are in the wrong place and have chosen the wrong habit or hobby. Thanks to Clark for being a true pioneer in the vape industry.

 

[Lacit1707]

whoa, are those responses to my post lol? damn, did i insult you personally? did i insult the company?

i simply asked a question as to what the "safe" levels are. and there obviously ARE levels in place if there is a system to put ND or J next to the results. i am simply curious as to what those levels are so I, MYSELF, can make the decision for what I THINK is appropriate to purchase for myself...

so again, anyone know what the numbers are?

 

[Megan Kogijiki Ratchford]

whoa, are those responses to my post lol? damn, did i insult you personally? did i insult the company?

i simply asked a question as to what the "safe" levels are. and there obviously ARE levels in place if there is a system to put ND or J next to the results. i am simply curious as to what those levels are so I, MYSELF, can make the decision for what I THINK is appropriate to purchase for myself...

so again, anyone know what the numbers are?

I've sent a note to Clark about your post as I think it was a fair question and would like to know the answer too!

 

[Elizabeth Baldwin]

Vaping flavorful juices got me off smoking. And cigarettes contain well over a 1000 toxins. It also works by combustion. That's what causes cancer. Vaping is much, much safer even with diketones. It may be concerning to some, and I understand that. But being a previous 2 pack a day smoker for over 20 years I put a lot of toxins in my system. So I see vaping as safer either way. A 1000 toxins being combusted to my lungs or a chance that trace amounts of a couple?

I've been vaping for nearly 4 years now. I can honestly say my lungs are clear, I can run again, and I can climb stairs without losing my breath. I feel much healthier too. I couldn't say that had those delicious flavors not been available. There's no real evidence that diacatyl causes anything at the trace amounts we vape. What if, by taking away the key ingredients that makes juices so delicious, that many who would have quit smoking will keep smoking because the juices they try aren't as tasty? It actually could cause more damage than good. Who knows.

I enjoy the delicious juices and I will keep enjoying them.

 

[Lacit1707]

Vaping flavorful juices got me off smoking. And cigarettes contain well over a 1000 toxins. It also works by combustion. That's what causes cancer. Vaping is much, much safer even with diketones. It may be concerning to some, and I understand that. But being a previous 2 pack a day smoker for over 20 years I put a lot of toxins in my system. So I see vaping as safer either way. A 1000 toxins being combusted to my lungs or a chance that trace amounts of a couple?

I've been vaping for nearly 4 years now. I can honestly say my lungs are clear, I can run again, and I can climb stairs without losing my breath. I feel much healthier too. I couldn't say that had those delicious flavors not been available. There's no real evidence that diacatyl causes anything at the trace amounts we vape. What if, by taking away the key ingredients that makes juices so delicious, that many who would have quit smoking will keep smoking because the juices they try aren't as tasty? It actually could cause more damage than good. Who knows.

I enjoy the delicious juices and I will keep enjoying them.

well, id suggest offering a dikteone free line but thats just me...and further, ill never understand that argument... i smoked for however long and stopped so it doesnt matter, this is better...its just ignorant imo....its the whole beginning of ciggs coming out, no one thought those were bad, then they were... do we not learn from past mistakes? sub ohm'ing, deep lung hits etc etc... Vaping is in its infancy so to say "trace" amounts when we dont know is counter-intuitive. fact reamains, we wont know until problems come up 10, 20, 30 years from now...

 

[wbbrn1952]

whoa, are those responses to my post lol? damn, did i insult you personally? did i insult the company?

i simply asked a question as to what the "safe" levels are. and there obviously ARE levels in place if there is a system to put ND or J next to the results. i am simply curious as to what those levels are so I, MYSELF, can make the decision for what I THINK is appropriate to purchase for myself...

so again, anyone know what the numbers are?

My response was not directed at you - I was saying that everyone is screaming for AP and DP free juice - may not be possible - especially with flavoring in the juice - if a number is below the lab detectable level - no number was probably reported - just saying. You have to make the decision as to what is best for you - as for me I have no problem with the juice Clark is producing - I don't smoke any more and this is my alternative - I try not to worry what will happen - just be prepared for what does. At my age I am not so concerned about the long run -- if you are young then don't smoke or vape that would be my suggestion.

 

[Elizabeth Baldwin]

well, id suggest offering a dikteone free line but thats just me...and further, ill never understand that argument... i smoked for however long and stopped so it doesnt matter, this is better...its just ignorant imo....its the whole beginning of ciggs coming out, no one thought those were bad, then they were... do we not learn from past mistakes? sub ohm'ing, deep lung hits etc etc... Vaping is in its infancy so to say "trace" amounts when we dont know is counter-intuitive. fact reamains, we wont know until problems come up 10, 20, 30 years from now...

That was just my opinion. Not trying to argue. It wasn't meant to be argumentative. It's just my honest opinion.

I knew smoking was bad but I still did it. It's written right on the side of the pack.

I have no problem if they offered a diketones free line. Just as long as my choice isn't taken away too.

 

[Mazinny]

whoa, are those responses to my post lol? damn, did i insult you personally? did i insult the company?

i simply asked a question as to what the "safe" levels are. and there obviously ARE levels in place if there is a system to put ND or J next to the results. i am simply curious as to what those levels are so I, MYSELF, can make the decision for what I THINK is appropriate to purchase for myself...

so again, anyone know what the numbers are?

There are no " safe levels " set for DA and AP. NIOSH has recommended safe levels for factory settings, but OSHA ( the regulatory body ) has not issued a directive as of yet. Dr. F has extrapolated the NIOSH levels for e-liquid, but neither NIOSH nor those who are not convinced of the potential risk of diketones agree that this type of extrapolation is suitable for e-liquids ( for seemingly opposite reasons ). ECTA ( a Canadian trade group has set a safe level ( for their 50 Canadian member vendors ), but that's just a number their member vendors voluntarily decided on.

" nd " and " j" have nothing to do with " safe levels ", they are related to the limits of detection of the lab testing methods.

 

[Megan Kogijiki Ratchford]

There are no " safe levels " set for DA and AP. NIOSH has recommended safe levels for factory settings, but OSHA ( the regulatory body ) has not issued a directive as of yet. Dr. F has extrapolated the NIOSH levels for e-liquid, but neither NIOSH nor those who are not convinced of the potential risk of diketones agree that this type of extrapolation is suitable for e-liquids ( for seemingly opposite reasons ). ECTA ( a Canadian trade group has set a safe level ( for their 50 Canadian member vendors ), but that's just a number their member vendors voluntarily decided on.

" nd " and " j" have nothing to do with " safe levels ", they are related to the limits of detection of the lab testing methods.

Well pewp...I had hoped that someone had made a definitive proclamation about the levels (a pipe dream I know). Thanks for the information Mazinny!

 

[Pinggolfer]

I have no problem if they offered a diketones free line. Just as long as my choice isn't taken away too.

You are not alone. The test numbers are there so we are adult enough to make up our own mind. Some are on a mission to take your right away, and we have to fight for our right to choose what we want to vape. As far as I know there are no chemist with a PHD on this site who is a expert on this matter.

 

[zoiDman]

You are not alone. The test numbers are there so we are adult enough to make up our own mind. Some are on a mission to take your right away, and we have to fight for our right to choose what we want to vape. As far as I know there are no chemist with a PHD on this site who is a expert on this matter.

Who exactly is taking away your "right" to vape what you want?

I think you are Grandstanding when you say things Like This. Why don't you Dial the Hype Back a Tad.

 

[M4rtin]

Just want to give Kudos to Kent and his team at Nicoticket! Thank you for helping me find a way to stay off the chemical sticks that I was going to be buried with. I was at a point in my vaping journey where I was getting extremely frustrated with the e-juices out there and then found Nicoticket! So thank you and also a huge thank you for being transparent with the choices you make as a company and with your juices.

You are truly vaping community oriented.

This whole ap/dp concern could be a concern could not be concern. So unless the FDA/CDC/AMA/ and whatever other regulatory / testing commission comes up with something that shows, this will cause this I do not see the hype. I have been vaping Nicoticket exclusively for 10 months and I have not grown a third arm. Maybe 20 years from now, maybe not. I feel healthier, look healthier and feel fine.

All these rebuttals made me think of how things have changed in my own life. So depending on the generation you grew up in you may be able to relate. I feel lately that there have been all sorts of links found to cause something these days. Never heard of Peanut allergies until my daughter attended 1st grade and they said the birthday cupcakes needs to list the exact ingredients used and no trace of peanut must be in it so it must be store bought or bakery bought. Her pre-k school did not have this?? Never heard of autism until there was a huge rise in it, never heard of gluten allergies or possible links to other things. Eggs are now healthy, before no yolks, just the egg whites.

Going to primary school it was pb&j, twinkies and a fruit in a Metal lunch box like Dukes of Hazard, Star Wars, Dallas Cowboys etccc... There were no allergies, you can't bring this, okay we did have a dress code.

Now it's FDA approved lake colors leads to something. People are allergic to Gluten and that could lead to several things. Peanut, shell fish, lactose etcc...New things are causing this or leading to other things are found every year.

Point I am trying to make is anything can cause something. So depending on your cultural history, where you grew up, what you ate, how you live, where you live, what you eat, what you put on your body, how you modify your body, how your body metabolizes, fights off infections etccc... all effects how eventually vaping will effect you.

So unless some laboratory comes up with some test that can effectively measure what the effects will be in a human, evaluate how the lung filters it, how does the body absorb e-juice through the sinus cavities, throat, mouth lining, tongue, esophagus, the environmental changes that effect the body, food that is ingested etccc.....Then come to a base line of what is a safe level and what is not. We will probably have to wait to see if someone grows a third arm. Who knows how the human body will develop in later generations and it all depends on outside influencing factors. Who knows what type of foods, bathing products, deodorants, perfumes, hair products, watches, cell phones etccc... may influence our own development. So who knows what type of e-juice we may be vaping 10 years from now. I just hope it will still be there.

We as consumers can stay informed and buy from vendors, like Nicoticket, that say these are our results, make your own decision. If there is a viable change to make it safer, we will try. They try to produce the safest juice possible and keep people of the smellies. Is that not what started the journey for most of us?

Who knows, instead of pills, someday all you have to do is add aspirin to your e-juice? Multi-vitamins in e-juice, how about your full days supply of your daily calories in a e-juice?

Or

Remember the eighties and hairspray, we might be contributing to the depletion of the ozone layer or protecting the ozone layer with all of our vapor, who knows. Kent, do you have ozone e-juice??

In all seriousness, thank you for being a true vaping community vendor and keeping us informed! I am just happy to have stayed of the stinks, my car, house and me smell delicious.

That's my Vape on Brothers and Sisters

 

[Pinggolfer]

Who exactly is taking away your "right" to vape what you want?

I think you are Grandstanding when you say things Like This. Why don't you Dial the Hype Back a Tad.

Who? Why you. You DIY and you're hear requesting test results. No hype but you travel from vendor to vendor asking about how they test. I'm not running for a job on the vape police. Grandstanding? I want to vape what I like.

 

[zoiDman]

Who? Why you. ...

Please post where I have ask this Vendor to Post Test Results. That will be Funny in a Thread where the Vendor Is posting Test Results.

And Please post where I have Asked another Vendor to besides Five Pawns what their Test Protocols for testing are.

Which BTW, Rob at Five Pawns thought was a Great Idea.

I am not Suggesting that Five Pawns set the Testing Standards for the Industry.

But if you Recommend that Others use your Testing Method, how can they Do So if you do Not Publish what this Method is?

Clearly you feel that your Testing Protocol yields Accurate and Repeatable results. Else you would Not be using it. So wouldn't it Benefit the Entire Industry for Others to have Access to your Testing Methods?

That is a great idea. Ill see if and how we can accomplish this.

Working on it... I appreciate you staying on top of this. Keep you posted with any new developments with regards to this.

zoiDman, our lab will be publishing our method. Dont know how long this will take to get into a publication but the ball is moving in the right direction. Thanks again for the great idea.

Right On Rib.

I think this is Good for Five Pawn. And I think it is Good for the Vaping Community as a Whole.

 

[Pinggolfer]

Please post where I have ask this Vendor to Post Test Results. That will be Funny in a Thread where the Vendor Is posting Test Results.

You have a habit of asking where you said anything. I'm not looking through 10,000 posts.

And Please post where I have Asked another Vendor to besides Five Pawns what their Test Protocols for testing are.

Which BTW, Rob at Five Pawns thought was a Great Idea.

He is humoring you. BTW This is not a Five Pawns thread. I believe it reads Nicoticket.

 

[zoiDman]

He is humoring you. BTW This is not a Five Pawns thread. I believe it reads Nicoticket.

When you get up on your Soap Box and say that Members to "Do This" and Members "Do That" but you Can't Back Up what you say, your Street Cred goes to Zero.

Kinda like when you made this Claim and Couldn't post Anything to support it.

The chemical I was refering to is Butyrate ethy, which is what I believe a substitute for DA/AP. You may be vaping it right now and don't know it. It's worse than diketones.

I'll help you out. And save people the Time of Searching this thread for what I have Posted.

https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/search/1523540/

 

[Pinggolfer]

Below are your posts as you made them. They can not be quoted as the thread is closed.

"Hi Rob. Welcome to the ECF.

Since there seems to be a Large Divergence in the Numbers that your Lab has Reported and the Numbers that Cloud 9's Lab Reported, would you be Opposed to Random Samples (obtained from Random Retail sources) of your e-Liquids being Tested by an Independent Laboratory? And then the Results being Publically Published?

That is, of course, if an Unbroken Chain of Custody could be Shown.
See here is the Problem that I think Many People are having with this line of thought.

If there are "no standardized validated methods of testing currently approved or adopted in the industry" and hence, we should Not Consider the Results that Cloud 9's Lab reported as accurate, why would we then consider the Lab Reports that S & N Labs or Newport Scientific, Inc. provided to be any More Accurate?

And as I believe you Mentioned Earlier, if there are Numerical Differences in what the separate Chemical Analysis showed your e-liquids Contained, what Criteria was used in deciding which Results were Published to the Public?


If you believe strongly that the Protocols that Newport Scientific used were accurate in assessing the True Levels of Diacetyl and Acetyl Propionyl in your e-Liquids, perhaps you could Publish these exact protocols to the Vaping Community for Scientific Consideration.


Whereas I do agree and see Importance in Standardized Testing Methods to provide accurate and repeatable reports as to the levels of Potentially Harmful chemical compounds that may be present in an e-Liquids. I would like those who's Area of Expertise is in such Testing to be able to review these Protocols.


Because at the Core of all this there seems to be a Discrepancy between what your Company says are Accurate Levels of Diacetyl and Acetyl Propionyl that are present in your e-Liquids. And what another Distributor/Retailer's Lab says the Levels are.


If I was a controlling interest in Five Pawns, I would want my published Labs Results Verified by an Impendent Laboratory. Not only to Validate the Levels of Diacetyl and Acetyl Propionyl in Five Pawns e-liquids. But to also give a Reasonable Justification to the need to serve Could 9 with a Notice of Demand.

When you say "Accurate", I am assuming you mean what the Lab that Five Pawns used says the Levels of Diacetyl and Acetyl Propionyl are.

Because to Me, I Don't See that any level of Accuracy has been Establish. Or that the levels that Five Pawns reported for Diacetyl and Acetyl Propionyl has been Verified by anyone Independent of Five Pawns.

Someone tried to do this. But they got Lawyered Up."

You know quite well the FP results where from a private lab.

Good luck Clark as you will need it.

 

[zoiDman]

Yep... I posted all that. And I never got an Answer when I asked Rob if Five Pawns planned to Publish their Testing Protocol.

Which Rob later did After that thread was Closed. See the Quotes in Post # 195 of this Thread.

So we are All still waiting for this...

"Please post where I have ask this Vendor to Post Test Results. That will be Funny in a Thread where the Vendor Is posting Test Results."

And this one Also...

"And Please post where I have Asked another Vendor to besides Five Pawns what their Test Protocols for testing are."

You might keep in mind what Happened the Last Time you made Wild Accusation about what I have Posted.

You are 100% right you had nothing to say about DA/AP being safe or harmful.

I was wrong and read every post you made on this thread. I'll blame my mistake on too much Gambit.

 

[Megan Kogijiki Ratchford]

Okay guys, take this off this thread please....

 

[Pinggolfer]

I'm not going to reply and I'm not going to derail this thread. God bless you Clark for all the hard work you have done.