Oral cancer scare for vapers, I hope they're wrong!!!!

[bhayes]

SAN FRANCISCO, July 29 (Xinhua) -- Scholars from University of California, San Francisco (UC San Francisco) have found that people who consume E-cigarettes and tobacco product are more likely to develop oral cancer, a U.S. non-profit advocating oral health said over the weekend.

The International Association for Dental Research (IADR) said UC San Francisco researchers Benjamin Chaffee and Neal Benowitz, the co-author of a paper on nicotine and carcinogen exposure from consumption of tobacco product, examined the risks of people who are exposed to known carcinogen resulting from the use of different tobacco products, alone or in combination.

They assessed a national sample of 32,320 U.S. adults collected between 2013 and 2014, who provided urine specimens for analysis of tobacco-specific nitrosamines (TSNAs), N'-nitrosonornicotine (NNN), a known oral and esophageal carcinogen, and 4-(methynitrosamino)-1-(3)-pyridyle-1-butanol (NNAL), a metabolite of lung carcinogen (NNK), as well as total nicotine equivalents.

Among the participants, 48 percent are female and 61 percent non-Hispanic white aged from 18 years old to 90 years old, with a median age of 35 years.

More than 6,000 of them were characterized according to use of combustible products such as cigarettes, cigars, waterpipe, pipes, marijuana-containing cigar, smokeless products including moist snuff, chewing tobacco, snus, and e-cigarette, as well as nicotine replacement products.

The researchers found that all tobacco use categories showed elevated nicotine and TSNA concentrations compared to non-users.

Smokeless tobacco users have the highest level of TSNA exposure, whether they use one tobacco product or together with other product types.

The study discovered that the vast majority of non-cigarette tobacco users are exposed to carcinogen levels that are likely to put them at substantial risk, just as much as exclusive cigarette smokers would suffer.

 

[bhayes]

Deleted (I think), and posted in health and safety.

 

[sdennislee]

I'd like to see a separate study corroborating this. Personally I consider anything coming from California other than coffee recipes to be biased especially topics related to nicotine, ecigs, tobacco, etc...

 

[Nermal]

I'd like to see a separate study corroborating this. Personally I consider anything coming from California other than coffee recipes to be biased especially topics related to nicotine, ecigs, tobacco, etc...

You forgot cancer. Everything in California causes cancer. Don't go to California.

 

[Myk]

So where is the oral cancer risk?
All they say is nicotine from tobacco has TSNA and NNN. Typical of UCSF.

10 years, show me the risks. No more of this "we just don't know" BS.

 

[brewbear]

The study discovered that the vast majority of non-cigarette tobacco users are exposed to carcinogen levels that are likely to put them at substantial risk, just as much as exclusive cigarette smokers would suffer.

They are playing with numbers, they include the vaping folks in the larger group of non-combustible use, the one with tobacco chew and snus...Blurring the lines...

 

[ExtremeDooty]

San Francisco...the porta potty capitol of the States.

 

[dripster]

Urine samples and oral cancer? I'm so glad I don't pee into my own mouth.

 

[stols001]

Um. Things I don't like about this study.

1. Performed in California, I believe that any institution of higher learning there has forgotten what research is.

2. I could not even make OUT who was tested against WHO but the categories seemed a little muddied to me, sort of like, "We tested a bunch of consumers of nic and tobacco products and we found that WE HATE ECIGS."

3. No control group. None. Well I'm not sure if there was one or not, but like, if there was, it was so muddied among the other groups, it's hard to determine which one was it.

4. Maybe the control group was the IMAGINARY group of ECIG ONLY users, and since the conclusion (forgone) had to be "we hate vapers" well, guess WHAT? They were the ones with lowest WHATEVER we were looking for.... wait, was it urine? Was it ACTUAL oral cancer? You mean no one in our groups has, or ever HAD oral cancer? Shoot, man, we'd better test the PEE.

5. PEE, to the best of my knowledge, does not predicate OR predict rates of oral cancer, to the best of my knowledge.

6. A conclusion with the words "likely to" is JUST as bad as using the word may (I didn't spot a MAY maybe the CA researchers have been reading my scathing posts about including the word "may" in your conclusion, maybe this was written by someone studying for the SAT, (frankly I bet they get a 300 score) but synonyming the word "may" with "likely to" is also grounds for me to TAKE that group to my special island of lonely researchers where I offer Disneyland style trips to vapers having a horrible TIME, and they get to taunt, throw pies in the faces of the ex-researchers and I'm not OPPOSED to a little torture, I mean they are KILLING people with this stuff, so who am I to judge if you want to taunt, make fun of, educate, kick and or water board the islanders etc. I'm frankly just having trouble locating an island I HATE enough to DO that to. Unoccupied, obviously but I'd feel bad for the wild life.

7) It appears the entire study has been dada-ized which is something a pal of mine did in HS, she wrote a legit paper on Dadaism, and then used word randomizer and turned it in and got an A. She would allow NO ONE to find out if she actually wrote a real paper, but knowing her, I am betting she did, and I'm fairly sure the researchers actually took some predetermined WORDS and conclusions they wanted to make and worked their way backwards, BUT OMG, even they were having trouble making it work ,so one of the brighter ones was like, "Let's just Dada it."

8) I hope doing this kind of research results in the type of brain injury that means you can't write things down anymore, and also does not allow them to remember things more than 10 minutes, so they'd say the same thing over and over. I knew a dude like that, very sweet, but he would like introduce himself every 10 minutes and it sure was an exercise in living in the now, but with that lot we could just sit them down and one would say, "Lets do some research on how Ecigs suck." "Okay, let's what is our target conclusion this time?" "Lets get all freaky on oral cancer!" "How will we measure that?" "OOH, haven't done PEE in a long time, and it's really far from the mouth let's do that."

"Lets do some research on...."

We would all be happier and I'd still let you water board if you wanted, you wouldn't have to feel guilty because in 10 minutes they wouldn't remember it.

Anna

 

[Violetti Usva]

The majority of what I wanted to say has already been covered, so I'm going to go off on a tangent instead. This post is barely related to vaping so just a quick warning, read ahead with your tin foil hat at the ready...otherwise just ignore me...like the rest of the lizard people

"International association of dental research"

Many people were scared of their dentist as a child. I was not, but instead believed that they were unknowingly part of a worldwide conspiracy to sell dental products and services by giving bad advice on how to look after your teeth. Since I was about 6 I believed that what they were taught seemed truthful and had been stuck to for so long that it is impossible to find proper control groups to confirm whether or not the information was factual or simply better for previous eras social circumstances and now entrenched in tradition.

What did humans do before toothbrushes? Their teeth fell out and rotted away more, sure, but their diet was vastly different from ours and they didn't have antibiotics to help fight infections nor help their adaptive immune system build resistances to more dangerous bacteria. "Our diet has way more sugar than previous generations!" I hear you cry. Sugar is highly soluble in water and passes our teeth easily - really its complex sugars and acids that cause the most damage to your teeth and with food less easily available to previous generations carbohydrate-rich meals were the norm. To many they still are. My dentist sold my family these really stiff brushes and told us to really scrub our teeth clean. Modern research shows this was wrong soft brushes are recommended instead. Furthermore, my refusal to use those brushes, belief that twice a day was causing more damage than good, and my parents complete inability to question nor control me provided me a very small sample to base my hypothesis on. My brothers and sisters, older and younger all have far worse teeth than I do.

These days I brush twice a day, very gently with a really soft brush and unflavoured, sodium laureth sulfate free toothpaste and have a very dilute menthol spray to freshen my breath. This is all in the hopes that there's one less abnormality about me to scare off potential love interests; the paranoid child still lives inside me - he just really likes sex, drugs and...classical guitar and metal.



What I'm getting at is that this research is probably just a preliminary step towards trying to convince smokers to try nicotine toothpaste in order to damage teeth and increase their profit margins. Or just demonise vaping. Definitely one or the other.

 

[djsvapour]

The study discovered that the vast majority of non-cigarette tobacco users are exposed to carcinogen levels that are likely to put them at substantial risk, just as much as exclusive cigarette smokers would suffer.

I'm sure there are risks. Throwing all non-cigarette tobacco products into one study is kind of dumb. If you chew tobacco... yeh... if you vape.. I suspect the risk is exponentially lower.

Statistics and lies. I'm not saying we don't appreciate you bringing this to our attention.

 

[untar]

I'm getting buttcancer allright but it's not from vaping it's from reading BS reports about doctored studies with exaggerated/misinterpreted/misleading measurements.
It's known for a long time now the nitrosamines in vape juice are trace amounts.
Telling us "that the vast majority of non-cigarette tobacco users are exposed to carcinogen levels that are likely to put them at substantial risk, just as much as exclusive cigarette smokers would suffer" is a bold lie that would claim all past testing got it wrong by several orders of magnitude (example source: Comparing the cancer potencies of emissions from vapourised nicotine products including e-cigarettes with those of tobacco smoke).
I suggest those "scientists" go perform an act of self-fornication.

 

[Hawise]

What did humans do before toothbrushes?

To follow your interesting tangent, humans have been brushing their teeth with the ends of twigs for quite some time. And of course the diet change you mentioned is also significant - although that hasn't always been negative. In times and places where grains were stone-ground, by middle age many people had teeth worn down to the nerve by rock dust that got into the flour.

Returning to the topic, even if there is evidence that vaping increases the risk of oral cancer (and this study is a long way from proving it), that statement really doesn't mean much on its own. The next step is to quantify the increase. 35%? OK, that could be significant. 0.02%? Um, I think I'll stick to worrying about a swallow dropping a coconut on my head.

 

[Vinnybagodoughnuts]

To follow your interesting tangent, humans have been brushing their teeth with the ends of twigs for quite some time. And of course the diet change you mentioned is also significant - although that hasn't always been negative. In times and places where grains were stone-ground, by middle age many people had teeth worn down to the nerve by rock dust that got into the flour.

Returning to the topic, even if there is evidence that vaping increases the risk of oral cancer (and this study is a long way from proving it), that statement really doesn't mean much on its own. The next step is to quantify the increase. 35%? OK, that could be significant. 0.02%? Um, I think I'll stick to worrying about a swallow dropping a coconut on my head.

African or European Swallow?

 

[dripster]

I'm also willing to bet both shoes neither the teeth nor even the urine were as yellow as the journalism that they are wanting to attract.

 

[bhayes]

I agree with all of the replies above, I mainly hope this encourages researchers in favor of END (electronic nicotine devices) to debunk this study, because of all the foreign objects we put in our mouth (growing up consists of finding alternatives to the thumb to stick in our mouths), including caffeine, I am sure nicotine vapor is not the very harmful.

 

[stols001]

This is all in the hopes that there's one less abnormality about me to scare off potential love interests; the paranoid child still lives inside me - he just really likes sex, drugs and...classical guitar and metal.

I hate to say I'm already taken, but I'd love for you to be my dentist. LOL.

I also have dentures though, so that's like a niche kinda market.

I just think a lot of it genetics, though, also, and yeah what you eat and everything. I also had braces for like 5 years as a kid, and I really really needed them, frankly, as I had the kind of smile that would scare off small children, well, braces are AWFUL for your teeth.

But, with the same level of oral hygenery (or not) as my ex husband, well, he just had these awesome straight teeth, like, naurally, they NEVER stained and etc, and I had these porous dreadful teeth that stained horribly with like tobacco. My little brother (no braces) has the same thing, he smoked, he eats okay but so did I. My kid inherited my ex's teeth and I was SO THANKFUL he did. Just perfect teeth (and he does use soft brushes and etc. and all that) and they've actually determined LOTS of new stuff all the time, dentistry about what is wrong and what isn't and etc.

My husband had super HARD teeth, like they're cracked all over because he was always getting in fistfights where he got punched in the face enough to shatter the enamel and etc.

What killed my teeth off in the end was a med that literally changed the Ph in my mouth and while it's a RARE side effect to sort of peer in the mirror and NOTE the DAILY VISIBLE disintegration of my teeth, so I had them all removed as by that point in my life I had firmly decided that my teeth were FAR less important than my brain's ability to cope with remaining alive, and while I Regret Nothing, I will also say:

a) dentures suck
b) to fluoride or not to fluoride--- meh go talk to the autism as a vaccine people for the love of GOD
c) I miss my teeth but I'm still about 100% happier.
d) the topic is simplified it's a little more than using a soft or hard brush but FOR SURE like, scraping the enamel off your teeth SUCKS much like dental surgery SUCKS and like some people still don't believe in dentistry (my husband is like that, any intervention that has happened on his teeth has been at MY BEHEST and he once PULLED OUT A TOOTH ROOT that ways dying USING RUSTY GARAGE PLIARS) and pretty soon here he will have to get some partials given he will need something to chew with but his thoughts are "Stay away from dentists for as long as you can because dentists just want to do stuff that make you dependent on them and hasten your teeth's death UNTIL they have all your money.

I think it's a valid thought process, if you aren't vain. Like, I'm glad I had the braces although kinda sorry my parents spent so much on them, ONLY for me to get dentures and frankly dentures look BETTER than my real teeth, but man if I hadn't gotten brace I think I might still have been a virgin. I'm pretty serious about that and my teeth would have sucked regardless they just sucked ah, HARDER.

LOL sorry to digress at your digression.

Anna

 

[djsvapour]

To follow your interesting tangent, humans have been brushing their teeth with the ends of twigs for quite some time.

I frequently use twigs. Cocktails sticks. Perfect for Pork and Beef... and Spinach....

 

[tearose50]

I may be out of touch -- but I haven't heard any stories of any oral cancer in years. Used to be a concern with chew and maybe snuff -- but even cigs were "better for you" back in the day.

Who knew?

(They should have included vegetarians on the list as they eat more tomatoes, eggplant and other nicotine source foods.)

 

[bhayes]

I hate to say I'm already taken, but I'd love for you to be my dentist. LOL.

I also have dentures though, so that's like a niche kinda market.

I just think a lot of it genetics, though, also, and yeah what you eat and everything. I also had braces for like 5 years as a kid, and I really really needed them, frankly, as I had the kind of smile that would scare off small children, well, braces are AWFUL for your teeth.

But, with the same level of oral hygenery (or not) as my ex husband, well, he just had these awesome straight teeth, like, naurally, they NEVER stained and etc, and I had these porous dreadful teeth that stained horribly with like tobacco. My little brother (no braces) has the same thing, he smoked, he eats okay but so did I. My kid inherited my ex's teeth and I was SO THANKFUL he did. Just perfect teeth (and he does use soft brushes and etc. and all that) and they've actually determined LOTS of new stuff all the time, dentistry about what is wrong and what isn't and etc.

My husband had super HARD teeth, like they're cracked all over because he was always getting in fistfights where he got punched in the face enough to shatter the enamel and etc.

What killed my teeth off in the end was a med that literally changed the Ph in my mouth and while it's a RARE side effect to sort of peer in the mirror and NOTE the DAILY VISIBLE disintegration of my teeth, so I had them all removed as by that point in my life I had firmly decided that my teeth were FAR less important than my brain's ability to cope with remaining alive, and while I Regret Nothing, I will also say:

a) dentures suck
b) to fluoride or not to fluoride--- meh go talk to the autism as a vaccine people for the love of GOD
c) I miss my teeth but I'm still about 100% happier.
d) the topic is simplified it's a little more than using a soft or hard brush but FOR SURE like, scraping the enamel off your teeth SUCKS much like dental surgery SUCKS and like some people still don't believe in dentistry (my husband is like that, any intervention that has happened on his teeth has been at MY BEHEST and he once PULLED OUT A TOOTH ROOT that ways dying USING RUSTY GARAGE PLIARS) and pretty soon here he will have to get some partials given he will need something to chew with but his thoughts are "Stay away from dentists for as long as you can because dentists just want to do stuff that make you dependent on them and hasten your teeth's death UNTIL they have all your money.

I think it's a valid thought process, if you aren't vain. Like, I'm glad I had the braces although kinda sorry my parents spent so much on them, ONLY for me to get dentures and frankly dentures look BETTER than my real teeth, but man if I hadn't gotten brace I think I might still have been a virgin. I'm pretty serious about that and my teeth would have sucked regardless they just sucked ah, HARDER.

LOL sorry to digress at your digression.

Anna

Great digression, I also wear dentures and they irritate my mouth a lot of the time, but my regular dental checkups say my mouth is fine, lately I have been getting dry mouth more often than usual, all advice from vapers say stay hydrated, good idea, I also read that during high humidity weather like now summertime, dry mouth is worse, so people shouldn't worry about dry mouth much as long as they stay hydrated, VAPE ON...........