Hey ecf rebuilders, we need a rebuildable handbook or wiki. I've had a terribly hard time with my aga t, 8 months later I finally got it to not only work, but hit amazingly - to my satisfaction. I've got it to work amazingly to the point where today on my break I couldn't see out my trucks windows, and it tastes damn good. Finally, satisfied with my damn frustrating ecig experience. Now I can enjoy it, instead of trying to get my god d*amn vapor and nicotine out of it. Wasted too much money and time trying to get this ecig setup right.
I'm a total noob so I ain't claiming to be a master but here is what finally worked for me and here is what I've learned so far that I believe to be true.
Rebuildable experiment results
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Successful Experiment #1.
Pics to be added tomorrow.
Hardware:
Mech mod [sigelei 13b] - trustfire 18650 2500mh
Aga T2 - autodrip mode, fill hole screw removed
Wick:
Ekowool 3mm hollow, torched, non boiled - cut 1cm past top coil and on the other end almost touching the tanks bottom.
Wick hole: 1/8", seems to be choking 3mm ekowool wick
Air hole: 2.5x original
Coil:
28g Kanthal, 4/5 wraps, 1/8" drillbit-coiled as tight as can be.
Coil notes:Kinked on the top coil right where the wire stops touching the ekowool and goes to the center post. The kink makes this small gap of unwicked wire not so hot by increasing resistance I believe.
juice used:
12mg, 80mg/ml pg based wizardlabs nicotine
34/66 pg/vg [humco vg from walmart]
17% tfa blackberry, flavor concentrate aged 3 months periodically opening
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
My method:
Every single piece of this information here is crucial to my rebuilding success.
1.Wrap 28g kanthal tightly around a 1/8" drillbit. Pull it as tight as can be, then use pliers or fingers to squish the wraps together real close while pulling on either leg. This is very important to get it very tight. Air gap/insufficient wicking contact=froggy burnt flavor.
2.Arrange the coilso the bottom wire points to your left and the top wire points straight in front of you, aligned at a 45 degree angle so it is ready to perfectly slip onto posts.
3.Make this 45 degree angle while it is on the drillbit so you can pull it real hard with pliers to make it tight. Otherwise, moving the coil legs to wrap on a post will result in opening the coil wider or more narrow, resulting in uneven and inadequate wicking contact, which results in areas of too high a temperature which results in burnt, cooked, or harsh flavors upon prejuice-vg inspection. 4.Negative screw wrapped clockwise, do not pull on it, add a very delicate amount of tension so that it does not bite into the wick more than the other wraps effectively choking it, but so that there is no visible air gap between wick and coil.
5.Positive post wrapped counter clockwise - double it around the post so it won't come loose. Do not pull on the wire, that would cause tension resulting in hotspots, or a squished wick, decreasing wicking efficiency.
6.Torched 3mm ekowool is slid through coil by twisting downwards gently. A straight paper clip can be put inside the ekwool to make this easier.
7.Coil inspection: Remake coil tighter if any miniscule gap between wick and coil can be seen, especially once wick is saturated and explanded- coil is too loose, resulting in cooked or burnt juice and uneven temperature of the coil. If wick is brand new and tank is clean, hold fire until coil glows. Adjust while glowing to even out coils if necessary, do not touch ground while touching the coil or it will pop - Look for any hotspots, indicated by brighter yellow color. Coil should glow from inner coils to outer coils - if not, something is making either the top or bottom coils glow cooler or hotter, by either a kink which increases resistance, or tension, which decreases resistance resulting in hotspots. Check for even spacing of wraps - a wrap very close to another wrap will be hotter, because I suppose a warmer wire has lower resistance. I try to make the coil just right while still on the drillbit, because adjusting after coiling will change the perfectly round shape of the coil to uneven.
8. Vg prejuice inspection: Once it passes the wick-coil airgap and hotspot inspection and is found to be an acceptable resistance, saturate the wick with pure blank vg - don't waste juice, and there's no need to fill the tank as you will have to wash it out to avoid contaminating future juice if so - just saturate the wick. Mixed juice at this point will only add more variables to your troubleshooting. Fire and blow air at it, removing the off flavors and watching for hotspots and just observing its performance and where the bubbles form. See if the wick stays wet or goes dry, and see how long it takes to re-saturate. Now test saturation speed from dryish to wet with device horizontal, and vertical. Check if wick hole has a bubble in it, causing a vacuum. Drop more VG and after scraping your tongue clean with your teeth, observantly note the flavor and characteristics of the vape. Record your results. If there are no unpleasant flavors, try juice. If the vapor is too cool and takes too long of a drag to produce a reasonably big cloud to your satisfaction, try unwrapping one wrap or making another coil with one less wrap. As you keep dropping resistance, you will get to a point where you max out your wicking speed, consuming juice faster than it will fully saturate around the coil, resulting in your favorite froggy burnt flavor.
Juice testing notes:
-Try a juice that you know works well. Now try that flavor in max vg, starting at a low flavor percentage and increasing until it's just like wow. Mix in only 1ml increments, use a 1ml syringe for accuracy, avoiding drop measurements. After mixing a max vg mix, run it under hot water for 30 sec and shake for 30 sec until uniform consistancy - when it is cold, it will not mix properly.
Temperature:
Distance between top wrap and center post should be minimized, either by adding a small washer or by slanting the wick without compromising wicking. If wick is too squished or slanted it will reduce in wicking efficiency/speed, perhaps by compressing cell matrices.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Problem:SS mesh gave terrible burnt flavor and would not wick in my experience.
Solution: If the electricity flows to the mesh instead of through the coil [a short], it will cause a terrible flavor. Thus the mesh must be well oxidized so that it is harder for the electricity to flow through the ss mesh wick than the coil. I recommend any RBA noob to skip SS mesh wicks - try it once you have success with squishy wicks like ekowool or silica. Because more factors apply, it's easier to make it taste terrible, and b/c the wick will not expand into your coil, making room for error much less.
----
Problem: Cooked froggy flavor, but not quite burnt
Solution: Make the coil tighter. Make it perfectly even by coiling on a drill bit. Cooked flavor I theorize to be from airgap distance between coil and wick, at any miniscule spot. Kind of like a hotspot, to a smaller degree.
----
Problem: Metal flavor
Solution: For noobs, do not attempt mesh first. Try ekowool or silica if problem persists. Try oxidizing less - I've noticed burnt metal has a distinct smell to it that I tasted from ss mesh and ss rope wicks. Try a quick pass of the torch just to make it greyish blue, not all black and sooted.
----
Problem: Burnt flavor
Cause: Inadequate wicking, miniscule wick to coil airgap, hotspots, shorts. It can also be caused by dry burning a wick which leaves residual burnt flavors; or by burnt juice contaminating new juice evidenced by darker color mixing from wick into tank, or contaminated mixing ingredients or tools.
Solutions:
-Make sure second to bottom wrap is not touching negative - that's the same as dropping a wrap.
-Make the coil have an even temperature [glow color] throughout each wrap.
-Reduce distance from where the wire stops touching the wick to where it wraps around the post ( it has no liquid to cool it down to keep it at an even temperature), and make sure to kink the wire on the top wrap just as it leaves the wick. Do not allow any gap to exist between the very top wrap and wick - it must wrap around then shoot straight out at the coil, not a curve. The top coil often gets hot so this one is important, you can't let the top wrap get too hot or it will ruin it all. If you have to force it and readjust, it's probably .....ed because you will tamper with the perfect coil the drill bit provided- straighten out the wire or toss it and make another.
-It might be a really harsh juice, or contaminated ingredients, like if you don't clean your mixing syringe before dipping it in. I had some nicotine that was giving a smokey burnt flavor once. If your juice is too thick to wick fast enough, that can cause it to burn, too - wicking speed is correlated to juice thickness and wick medium. The hotter your coil is, the faster wicking speed is required to keep the wick at optimal saturation.
-Air hole may not be big enough, or is not properly lined up with the wick. The air hole and drag intensity affect temperature and cloud thickness. The air hole will cool down the wick and produce more vapor if set up right. With too small an air hole, an otherwise fine coil would burn hotter because it is not being cooled down, and not supplied enough air flow to atomize vaporizing eliquid.
-If it just isn't wicking fast enough, drip some drops onto your coil and wick every 5 or so hits once it gets dry, have a vape and call it an autodripper. That's where I'm at right now. If the burnt flavor disappears after one hit, you probably just need to make it wick faster, by widening the wick hole or wrapping the coil just a little looser, or changing your wick material or size, or pg/vg ratio.
----
Problem: Insufficient wicking speed
Solution: Try a new wick material or size. Enlarge wick hole to reduce squishing. Try adding ss rope or something to the inside of hollow ekowool or xc-116. Make sure wick hole does not have a bubble in it, which would cause a vacuum making juice not want to flow up the wick. As a bandaid, do a genny tilt so gravity will bring the liquid down to the wick, and drip drops here and there.
----
Notes: Now that I rebuild, I notice how much adding pg was completely ruining my juices. Try max vg with a bit more or double flavor % and you may be amazed, even if you do have to drip.
-----
I've used about 20 feet of kanthal so far, with every result but three so far, in that special burnt froggy or metal flavor. This is the information I gained from hundreds of experiments and sleep lost getting burnt vapor smoke in my eyes all night saying just one more coil :facepalml:
So add in your information, scientific findings and results, and let's make the best RBA wiki ever, so that smokers around the world can enjoy a real ecig experience without months of burnt flavored failure frustration and wasted money. Please correct me if I am wrong about anything. I wish to master the RBA because it seems to be the only way to a satisfying vape.
Experiment #2
I will drill the wick hole a little larger than 1/8", then widen a torched ekowool with a 1/8" drillbit, then torch the ekowool again, and slip in some double boiled non torched 3/32 ss rope with the straight center strand removed so as to allow for gravity feeding. Ekowool will extend all the way to near the bottom of the tank, as with just a coil-sheath, wicking was not sufficient. Hopefully all of these changes will increase wicking efficiency. Will report back.
Please add your experiment results. If someone has an infrared viewer, it would be great to see how the abovementioned problems affect temperature, and at what temperature juice starts to taste bad.
This is a bit long and unorganized but my eyes are bloodshot at this point so I will organize principles and troubleshooting later.
I'm a total noob so I ain't claiming to be a master but here is what finally worked for me and here is what I've learned so far that I believe to be true.
Rebuildable experiment results
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Successful Experiment #1.
Pics to be added tomorrow.
Hardware:
Mech mod [sigelei 13b] - trustfire 18650 2500mh
Aga T2 - autodrip mode, fill hole screw removed
Wick:
Ekowool 3mm hollow, torched, non boiled - cut 1cm past top coil and on the other end almost touching the tanks bottom.
Wick hole: 1/8", seems to be choking 3mm ekowool wick
Air hole: 2.5x original
Coil:
28g Kanthal, 4/5 wraps, 1/8" drillbit-coiled as tight as can be.
Coil notes:Kinked on the top coil right where the wire stops touching the ekowool and goes to the center post. The kink makes this small gap of unwicked wire not so hot by increasing resistance I believe.
juice used:
12mg, 80mg/ml pg based wizardlabs nicotine
34/66 pg/vg [humco vg from walmart]
17% tfa blackberry, flavor concentrate aged 3 months periodically opening
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
My method:
Every single piece of this information here is crucial to my rebuilding success.
1.Wrap 28g kanthal tightly around a 1/8" drillbit. Pull it as tight as can be, then use pliers or fingers to squish the wraps together real close while pulling on either leg. This is very important to get it very tight. Air gap/insufficient wicking contact=froggy burnt flavor.
2.Arrange the coilso the bottom wire points to your left and the top wire points straight in front of you, aligned at a 45 degree angle so it is ready to perfectly slip onto posts.
3.Make this 45 degree angle while it is on the drillbit so you can pull it real hard with pliers to make it tight. Otherwise, moving the coil legs to wrap on a post will result in opening the coil wider or more narrow, resulting in uneven and inadequate wicking contact, which results in areas of too high a temperature which results in burnt, cooked, or harsh flavors upon prejuice-vg inspection. 4.Negative screw wrapped clockwise, do not pull on it, add a very delicate amount of tension so that it does not bite into the wick more than the other wraps effectively choking it, but so that there is no visible air gap between wick and coil.
5.Positive post wrapped counter clockwise - double it around the post so it won't come loose. Do not pull on the wire, that would cause tension resulting in hotspots, or a squished wick, decreasing wicking efficiency.
6.Torched 3mm ekowool is slid through coil by twisting downwards gently. A straight paper clip can be put inside the ekwool to make this easier.
7.Coil inspection: Remake coil tighter if any miniscule gap between wick and coil can be seen, especially once wick is saturated and explanded- coil is too loose, resulting in cooked or burnt juice and uneven temperature of the coil. If wick is brand new and tank is clean, hold fire until coil glows. Adjust while glowing to even out coils if necessary, do not touch ground while touching the coil or it will pop - Look for any hotspots, indicated by brighter yellow color. Coil should glow from inner coils to outer coils - if not, something is making either the top or bottom coils glow cooler or hotter, by either a kink which increases resistance, or tension, which decreases resistance resulting in hotspots. Check for even spacing of wraps - a wrap very close to another wrap will be hotter, because I suppose a warmer wire has lower resistance. I try to make the coil just right while still on the drillbit, because adjusting after coiling will change the perfectly round shape of the coil to uneven.
8. Vg prejuice inspection: Once it passes the wick-coil airgap and hotspot inspection and is found to be an acceptable resistance, saturate the wick with pure blank vg - don't waste juice, and there's no need to fill the tank as you will have to wash it out to avoid contaminating future juice if so - just saturate the wick. Mixed juice at this point will only add more variables to your troubleshooting. Fire and blow air at it, removing the off flavors and watching for hotspots and just observing its performance and where the bubbles form. See if the wick stays wet or goes dry, and see how long it takes to re-saturate. Now test saturation speed from dryish to wet with device horizontal, and vertical. Check if wick hole has a bubble in it, causing a vacuum. Drop more VG and after scraping your tongue clean with your teeth, observantly note the flavor and characteristics of the vape. Record your results. If there are no unpleasant flavors, try juice. If the vapor is too cool and takes too long of a drag to produce a reasonably big cloud to your satisfaction, try unwrapping one wrap or making another coil with one less wrap. As you keep dropping resistance, you will get to a point where you max out your wicking speed, consuming juice faster than it will fully saturate around the coil, resulting in your favorite froggy burnt flavor.
Juice testing notes:
-Try a juice that you know works well. Now try that flavor in max vg, starting at a low flavor percentage and increasing until it's just like wow. Mix in only 1ml increments, use a 1ml syringe for accuracy, avoiding drop measurements. After mixing a max vg mix, run it under hot water for 30 sec and shake for 30 sec until uniform consistancy - when it is cold, it will not mix properly.
Temperature:
Distance between top wrap and center post should be minimized, either by adding a small washer or by slanting the wick without compromising wicking. If wick is too squished or slanted it will reduce in wicking efficiency/speed, perhaps by compressing cell matrices.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Problem:SS mesh gave terrible burnt flavor and would not wick in my experience.
Solution: If the electricity flows to the mesh instead of through the coil [a short], it will cause a terrible flavor. Thus the mesh must be well oxidized so that it is harder for the electricity to flow through the ss mesh wick than the coil. I recommend any RBA noob to skip SS mesh wicks - try it once you have success with squishy wicks like ekowool or silica. Because more factors apply, it's easier to make it taste terrible, and b/c the wick will not expand into your coil, making room for error much less.
----
Problem: Cooked froggy flavor, but not quite burnt
Solution: Make the coil tighter. Make it perfectly even by coiling on a drill bit. Cooked flavor I theorize to be from airgap distance between coil and wick, at any miniscule spot. Kind of like a hotspot, to a smaller degree.
----
Problem: Metal flavor
Solution: For noobs, do not attempt mesh first. Try ekowool or silica if problem persists. Try oxidizing less - I've noticed burnt metal has a distinct smell to it that I tasted from ss mesh and ss rope wicks. Try a quick pass of the torch just to make it greyish blue, not all black and sooted.
----
Problem: Burnt flavor
Cause: Inadequate wicking, miniscule wick to coil airgap, hotspots, shorts. It can also be caused by dry burning a wick which leaves residual burnt flavors; or by burnt juice contaminating new juice evidenced by darker color mixing from wick into tank, or contaminated mixing ingredients or tools.
Solutions:
-Make sure second to bottom wrap is not touching negative - that's the same as dropping a wrap.
-Make the coil have an even temperature [glow color] throughout each wrap.
-Reduce distance from where the wire stops touching the wick to where it wraps around the post ( it has no liquid to cool it down to keep it at an even temperature), and make sure to kink the wire on the top wrap just as it leaves the wick. Do not allow any gap to exist between the very top wrap and wick - it must wrap around then shoot straight out at the coil, not a curve. The top coil often gets hot so this one is important, you can't let the top wrap get too hot or it will ruin it all. If you have to force it and readjust, it's probably .....ed because you will tamper with the perfect coil the drill bit provided- straighten out the wire or toss it and make another.
-It might be a really harsh juice, or contaminated ingredients, like if you don't clean your mixing syringe before dipping it in. I had some nicotine that was giving a smokey burnt flavor once. If your juice is too thick to wick fast enough, that can cause it to burn, too - wicking speed is correlated to juice thickness and wick medium. The hotter your coil is, the faster wicking speed is required to keep the wick at optimal saturation.
-Air hole may not be big enough, or is not properly lined up with the wick. The air hole and drag intensity affect temperature and cloud thickness. The air hole will cool down the wick and produce more vapor if set up right. With too small an air hole, an otherwise fine coil would burn hotter because it is not being cooled down, and not supplied enough air flow to atomize vaporizing eliquid.
-If it just isn't wicking fast enough, drip some drops onto your coil and wick every 5 or so hits once it gets dry, have a vape and call it an autodripper. That's where I'm at right now. If the burnt flavor disappears after one hit, you probably just need to make it wick faster, by widening the wick hole or wrapping the coil just a little looser, or changing your wick material or size, or pg/vg ratio.
----
Problem: Insufficient wicking speed
Solution: Try a new wick material or size. Enlarge wick hole to reduce squishing. Try adding ss rope or something to the inside of hollow ekowool or xc-116. Make sure wick hole does not have a bubble in it, which would cause a vacuum making juice not want to flow up the wick. As a bandaid, do a genny tilt so gravity will bring the liquid down to the wick, and drip drops here and there.
----
Notes: Now that I rebuild, I notice how much adding pg was completely ruining my juices. Try max vg with a bit more or double flavor % and you may be amazed, even if you do have to drip.
-----
I've used about 20 feet of kanthal so far, with every result but three so far, in that special burnt froggy or metal flavor. This is the information I gained from hundreds of experiments and sleep lost getting burnt vapor smoke in my eyes all night saying just one more coil :facepalml:
So add in your information, scientific findings and results, and let's make the best RBA wiki ever, so that smokers around the world can enjoy a real ecig experience without months of burnt flavored failure frustration and wasted money. Please correct me if I am wrong about anything. I wish to master the RBA because it seems to be the only way to a satisfying vape.
Experiment #2
I will drill the wick hole a little larger than 1/8", then widen a torched ekowool with a 1/8" drillbit, then torch the ekowool again, and slip in some double boiled non torched 3/32 ss rope with the straight center strand removed so as to allow for gravity feeding. Ekowool will extend all the way to near the bottom of the tank, as with just a coil-sheath, wicking was not sufficient. Hopefully all of these changes will increase wicking efficiency. Will report back.
Please add your experiment results. If someone has an infrared viewer, it would be great to see how the abovementioned problems affect temperature, and at what temperature juice starts to taste bad.
This is a bit long and unorganized but my eyes are bloodshot at this point so I will organize principles and troubleshooting later.
Last edited:
