RBA n00b with problems

[jaxgator]

I've just recently started with RBA's and can't figure out what I am doing wrong. There has to be something wrong because I have read about the great flavor and amount of vapor produced using RBA's but I am just not getting it. Hell, I started with a couple of Nautiluses and compared to my build the nautilus is way out performing it. That can't be right, can it?

I am using an RSST (Genesis-like RBA). The coil is at 1.8Ω. I started at about 3.5v and ended up going all the way up to 5v. It was a little better at 5v but not much and not even as good as the nautilus. I tried it on both a ProVari and an ePic Supreme and it was the same.

I really want to get this sorted out as I am tired of paying for Nautilus coils and sometimes getting duds. I would think that it would out perform a Nautilus or any other clearomizer for that matter.

Here's an image of my build. Lil' help here please?

 

[FatherTime]

1.8 ohms? try building around 1. if you like that try going lower. oh and get a dripper

 

[jaxgator]

Ok, so I need to go lower. I'm using 1.8Ω coil in the Nautilus so I kind of expected pretty much the same type of vape.

I'm not chasing clouds so I don't want to venture into the sub-ohm world. Yet.

I want to become proficient at building coils before trying dripping. I might not ever try that as it just seem like a PITA.

Thanks for your suggestion.

 

[rrayda]

I've actually found that higher resistance builds tend to produce better flavor and vapor on a regulated device. Since you're using an evic and Provari, the resistance of your coils really doesn't matter much as you can just increase voltage to compensate. Basically, a sub-ohm build is in no way required on a regulated device for anything; it simply doesn't matter.

That vast oversimplification being said, coil parameters do matter on regulated devices, but for different reasons than you might think. Since resistance really doesn't matter anymore, you care more about wire gauge and build quality.

Larger wire gauge (smaller number) equals increased surface area for vaporization but also decreased resistance per length of wire. I like building with 28 gauge as it's good tradeoff between vaporization area and bulk to meet a given resistance.

Build quality is probably the most important of all. RBAs are fickle and your build will influence performance more than anything else. I use micros and cotton to great effect. Your coil should glow from the inside out. Sometimes a build just doesn't perform...rebuild it (usually re-wicking is sufficient).

This is a very complex matter and thousands of posts have been made on this forum discussing building coils. Poke around, you'll find some great information. The upshot is that yes, RBAs can provide great performance if you figure them out.

 

[muzichead]

I've just recently started with RBA's and can't figure out what I am doing wrong. There has to be something wrong because I have read about the great flavor and amount of vapor produced using RBA's but I am just not getting it. Hell, I started with a couple of Nautiluses and compared to my build the Nautilus is way out performing it. That can't be right, can it?

I am using an RSST (Genesis-like RBA). The coil is at 1.8Ω. I started at about 3.5v and ended up going all the way up to 5v. It was a little better at 5v but not much and not even as good as the Nautilus. I tried it on both a ProVari and an ePic Supreme and it was the same.

I really want to get this sorted out as I am tired of paying for Nautilus coils and sometimes getting duds. I would think that it would out perform a Nautilus or any other clearomizer for that matter.

Here's an image of my build. Lil' help here please?

First of all, if you are using cotton and a micro coil, you're doing it wrong!! Genny type atty's were made to vape with SS mesh or cable and a spaced wrap. I have an RSST that I still use sparingly, (I use my Reo 99.9% of the time), but the RSST still gives a very good vape though. I use a very simple setup in mine. It is usually a 28g 3/4 wrap on a 3/32" SS cable w/ SS mesh topper @ .6-.8Ω vaping on a mechanical. I will also say it is very important you torch the SS cable, mesh, and also your wire prior to installing as well. I get a very clean and tasty vape with thick dense clouds. I might also add, I have no leaking of any kind with this setup. The device can be laid on its side overnight and still no leaks.Since you are using a regulated device, you would want your coils to be in the 1.2-1.5Ω range so you can effectively use the parameters of the device. Here are some pics of my coils...

 

[Tinkiegrrl]

First of all, if you are using cotton and a micro coil, you're doing it wrong!! Genny type atty's were made to vape with SS mesh or cable and a spaced wrap. I have an RSST that I still use sparingly, (I use my Reo 99.9% of the time), but the RSST still gives a very good vape though. I use a very simple setup in mine. It is usually a 28g 3/4 wrap on a 3/32" SS cable w/ SS mesh topper @ .6-.8Ω vaping on a mechanical. I will also say it is very important you torch the SS cable, mesh, and also your wire prior to installing as well. I get a very clean and tasty vape with thick dense clouds. I might also add, I have no leaking of any kind with this setup. The device can be laid on its side overnight and still no leaks.Since you are using a regulated device, you would want your coils to be in the 1.2-1.5Ω range so you can effectively use the parameters of the device. Here are some pics of my coils...
View attachment 349773 View attachment 349774

What are the benefits to wrapping stainless mesh around the cable as opposed to just using mesh? I'm curious.

 

[Rodeorat]

First of all, if you are using cotton and a micro coil, you're doing it wrong!! Genny type atty's were made to vape with SS mesh or cable and a spaced wrap.

Wow. There are plenty of folks here using Gennys in auto-dripper mode with a MC and cotton wick, with great results.

Since you're fighting gravity in this setup, your wick is paramount. Sounds like you're not getting the capillary action you need.

Did you twist the cotton up tight to fit it through the coil? Twisting the cotton too much can restrict the juice flow. Perhaps its too loose in the coil? Hard to tell from the pics.
Alot of us completely pull out that fill plug to allow juice flow. Air in the hole, juice up the wick.
Finally, check out the thread on Rayon. Cheap and wicks better than cotton.

 

[jaxgator]

I've actually found that higher resistance builds tend to produce better flavor and vapor on a regulated device. Since you're using an evic and Provari, the resistance of your coils really doesn't matter much as you can just increase voltage to compensate. Basically, a sub-ohm build is in no way required on a regulated device for anything; it simply doesn't matter.

Ok, thanks for that info. I did not know that.

Build quality is probably the most important of all. RBAs are fickle and your build will influence performance more than anything else. I use micros and cotton to great effect. Your coil should glow from the inside out. Sometimes a build just doesn't perform...rebuild it (usually re-wicking is sufficient).

I'm using 28g Kanthal and the coil does glow from the inside out so I guess it is my crappy build quality that is the culprit then. Funny, but this was the best one that I made after about 7-8 tries.

This is a very complex matter and thousands of posts have been made on this forum discussing building coils. Poke around, you'll find some great information. The upshot is that yes, RBAs can provide great performance if you figure them out.

I've been reading but obviously, not enough. I'm very new to this so I guess it will just take some time and patience along with a lot of trial and error. I guess I better go purchase another 100' of Kanthal wire. Ha! Just kidding.

Thank you very much for taking the time to respond and helping me out.

 

[williebb123]

i agree with muzichead the ss mesh with or without the cable are the best i use both i find that using mesh with the cable i get a little less gunking of the coils transfer back down to the tank which turns your juice dark but it still happens , 28ga 4/3 wrap or a 5/4 wrap( 1.1 ohm) seems to be my sweet spot , there is one more i like its a hybrid wick i use a hollow mesh wick with a thin layer of cotton on top just where your coil sits i tend to use the 4/3 on this one just remember bare mesh has a learning curve to get top performance but a set up can last a month or more with proper cleaning every couple of days

 

[muzichead]

The capillary action of the SS rope is superior to the SS mesh is why I use it and the SS mesh topper is used to help with hot spots that normally occur with SS rope. They are much easier to work out with the topper. It is easier to make better contact with the coil using the mesh topper. It is also common for some to use Ekowool as a topper as well, but I prefer the mesh over it because of the taste I get with Ekowool. I hope this made sense to you...

 

[jaxgator]

First of all, if you are using cotton and a micro coil, you're doing it wrong!! Genny type atty's were made to vape with SS mesh or cable and a spaced wrap. I have an RSST that I still use sparingly, (I use my Reo 99.9% of the time), but the RSST still gives a very good vape though. I use a very simple setup in mine. It is usually a 28g 3/4 wrap on a 3/32" SS cable w/ SS mesh topper @ .6-.8Ω vaping on a mechanical. I will also say it is very important you torch the SS cable, mesh, and also your wire prior to installing as well. I get a very clean and tasty vape with thick dense clouds. I might also add, I have no leaking of any kind with this setup. The device can be laid on its side overnight and still no leaks.Since you are using a regulated device, you would want your coils to be in the 1.2-1.5Ω range so you can effectively use the parameters of the device.

Yeah, pretty much every tutorial I have seen they are using SS mesh. I really thought that cotton would wick better.

Did you twist the cotton up tight to fit it through the coil? Twisting the cotton too much can restrict the juice flow. Perhaps its too loose in the coil? Hard to tell from the pics.
Alot of us completely pull out that fill plug to allow juice flow. Air in the hole, juice up the wick.
Finally, check out the thread on Rayon. Cheap and wicks better than cotton.

I'm guessing that this part was directed at me? If so, yes, I twisted the cotton up tight to fit through the coil. It seems to be wicking just fine. I used a very thin piece of cotton with a thicker piece up top.

I think my problem is what rrayda said; poor quality coil build. I just need to get better at it. This coil takes quite a bit longer to heat up than the manufactured coils in my Nautilus. They seem to be instantaneous where as my coil seems to take 1-2 seconds before it glows completely.

Thanks for the rayon tip. I will look into it.

 

[jaxgator]

i agree with muzichead the ss mesh with or without the cable are the best i use both i find that using mesh with the cable i get a little less gunking of the coils transfer back down to the tank which turns your juice dark but it still happens , 28ga 4/3 wrap or a 5/4 wrap( 1.1 ohm) seems to be my sweet spot , there is one more i like its a hybrid wick i use a hollow mesh wick with a thin layer of cotton on top just where your coil sits i tend to use the 4/3 on this one just remember bare mesh has a learning curve to get top performance but a set up can last a month or more with proper cleaning every couple of days

The capillary action of the SS rope is superior to the SS mesh is why I use it and the SS mesh topper is used to help with hot spots that normally occur with SS rope. They are much easier to work out with the topper. It is easier to make better contact with the coil using the mesh topper. It is also common for some to use Ekowool as a topper as well, but I prefer the mesh over it because of the taste I get with Ekowool. I hope this made sense to you...

Thanks guys! Maybe I need to give that a shot in the future. Cotton might not be as good but I want to learn on it first.

I just ordered a couple of Kayfun 3.1's by HCigar as the Nautilus is a bottom feeder too and seems to perform just how I like my vape but I just hate the cost of manufactured coils.

 

[muzichead]

Wow. There are plenty of folks here using Gennys in auto-dripper mode with a MC and cotton wick, with great results.

Since you're fighting gravity in this setup, your wick is paramount. Sounds like you're not getting the capillary action you need.

Did you twist the cotton up tight to fit it through the coil? Twisting the cotton too much can restrict the juice flow. Perhaps its too loose in the coil? Hard to tell from the pics.
Alot of us completely pull out that fill plug to allow juice flow. Air in the hole, juice up the wick.
Finally, check out the thread on Rayon. Cheap and wicks better than cotton.

I have wicked both the RSST and an Ikarus hybrid I have with cotton and results from both were not successful at all. I tried twisted, thin, thick, and fluffy and failure with all. I also tried with the plug in and or out also with failure. A couple of good hits and then dry hits for what seemed an eternity. Constantly had to tilt the device to get liquid up the wick and it leaked like a sieve... The capillary action was abysmal to say the least with cotton. When I switched to the SS rope/mesh combo, I can now vape with the plug in and get 0% leakage from the atties at all. I can lay the device down on its side overnight and still no leaks. Try that with cotton and with the plug in it... You will have liquid everywhere...

As to the whole cotton vs. rayon vs. KGD vs. hemp thing, you can have it... I use the SS rope/mesh in my genny's and I use Ready-X-Wick in my RDA's. I don't miss having to replace my wicking every day or every other day at all. I put the XC in my RDA and vape it straight away with no weird taste or dry hits at all. I dry burn the coil with the XC in place every couple of days and its like I just put a new wick in the atty and vaping fresh again. I have yet to "have to" replace the XC because of wear and tear unlike any form of cotton or rayon... There is no advantage to using those for my vaping... You could argue that the cost of the XC is a little much, but when you are only using a piece that is about 1/2" long in a coil and it last you months on average, how costly is it really? The convenience of not having to replace wicking every or every other day is worth it alone!! For the genny's, I do a dry burn after a few tanks and its good to go for a few more as well. I haven't changed the setup in my RSST for about 7 months and its still vaping like when I set it up originally... YMMV...