Smallest RTA rebuildable and RTA with premade coils?

[vapesmooth123]

The dna 250 in two battery configuration outputs 6.2 volts if you want 167 watts you need a .2 ohm coil. You don't have to vape at 167 watts you can vape at one watt if you wanted to

what would happen if I try to vape a .65 or higher build (or whatever is of concern if anything even is?). FYI I don't even vape high wattage, a .45 build I'll vape like 50-60 watts.
can I stick an original protank on the DNA 167 with a 2.3ohm coil??

 

[bombastinator]

so is this video wrong or did I get confused and this only pertains to TC coils? There's zero comments on it. He doesn't say anything about trying to vape the crown coils at an abnormally high TC or Wattage either.

It only even barely applies to tc. You don’t NEED to run tc at max wattage. I’m not surprised the guy doesn’t see much activity on his channel

 

[vapesmooth123]

im still lost on this 6V thing :/

what would happen if I try to vape a .65 or higher build (or whatever is of concern if anything even is?). FYI I don't even vape high wattage, a .45 build I'll vape like 50-60 watts. But I do crank it up pretty high to dry burn coils and sometimes crank it to around 80W in attempts to burn through a gurgle.

can I stick an original protank on the DNA 167 with a 2.3ohm coil??

 

[bombastinator]

im still lost on this 6V thing :/

what would happen if I try to vape a .65 or higher build (or whatever is of concern if anything even is?).

It would vape fine unless you tried to do it at some ungodly high wattage in power mode in which case you would burn everything.

FYI I don't even vape high wattage, a .45 build I'll vape like 50-60 watts. But I do crank it up pretty high to dry burn coils and sometimes crank it to around 80W in attempts to burn through a gurgle.

Easier imho to shake out a gurgle, but do as thou wilt

can I stick an original protank on the DNA 167 with a 2.3ohm coil??

Yes. You just want to turn the wattage down.

The higher the ohms the lower the wattage you want to vape at because you risk melting the coil and burning the cotton
The higher the ohms the more resistance in the coil wire and the hotter it gets from a given voltage. High ohm builds use longer thinner wires which enhances the issue. Low resistance (low ohm) builds have thicker more robust wire and pass more energy through them so they have the power to heat more liquid making more vapor. If you want to puff big clouds use low resistance, if you want small clouds with high flavor (MTL) you want high resistance at low voltages.

 

[stols001]

I'm kind of confused by some of your questions but here is what I got.

You can pretty much find "premade" coils in an infinite number of configurations, many of which may suit your needs. Often, you can get a "kit" with some more exotic coils if that is what you are after (drop in coils are premade, you can't use them in a dedicated RDA/RDTA although a few makers have built drop in coil tanks that will also allow you the option of a build deck, but in my opinion those are tough to start out with as you may find the deck small and difficult to work with, and that's really not the tank is for so it often ends up being unnecessarily complicated and not a great vape.

I don't go the RDA route, but I will say that the feedback on the Engines has been pretty consistently positive and a good place to start.

Wherever you are getting that you "can't run 0.6 ohms resistance or above" on a mod is incorrect. The LOWER resistance you go, the higher the wattage you will need. A 0.6 COIL (not 6 OHMS, which is an entirely different thing) will likely require LESS power to get a decent vape and will save you on juice consumption and batteries. What you vape around shouldn't necessarily be a problem at the wattage you like, but you may even find yourself vaping lower wattage, and more happily. The issue may be that no 0.6 coil (well, I suppose an exotic one might work) is going to LOVE being vaped at 167 watts or whatever nonsense is your mod's highest setting. If you want to vape THAT HIGH (which is going to stress batteries and your equipment, the "highest" setting is just a number, and while it may theoretically go that high, most vapers will choose a mod that doubles (or more) their wattage needs, to NOT stress the equipment and get good battery life. I don't vape my mods anywhere NEAR their highest settings, in fact when I used coils I build, they're usually in the 0.8--1.2 range (but I am a MTL vaper).

You can check your mod's specs but I am fairly certain they will not say "Can't vape 0.6 resistance coils or above," although I have been surprised before and may be so again.

Anna

 

[vapesmooth123]

I'm pretty much good on the suggestions for tanks now, thanks. I still have to sort through 'atomizers' on fasttech which is like 9175 results lol but I'm not gonna go crazy with it. Bascially looking for velocity decks and 24 and 24.5mm stout tanks.

I don't go the RDA route, but I will say that the feedback on the Engines has been pretty consistently positive and a good place to start.

I think every somewhat serious vaper should have an RDA. They're good for testing juices VS filling and emptying a tank atty. Unless you don't DIY juice at all or anything maybe. I prefer the madhatter V2 (velocity deck) because I can pop the lid off with my lips instead of putting my 'out and about' fingers on the tip because I'm just a germaphobe like that. Ijoy makes a flip top RDA also now. I trialed the madhatter vs other high-rated RDAs about a year ago which had minor features the Hatter didn't like air flow to UNDER the coils but I couldn't feel any benefit and they leaked worse and I sold them.

I'm not a noob or anything if it sounds like it, I've been vaping since late 2012. We basically had ce4 clearomizers when I started, and like 1,100 mAh ego mods were the best, 3.7V range or something. Then people on here started tediously making their own twisted wire carpentry drills lol, and selling it, now we have staple wire and dual claptons etc, and TC. Cotton was being questioned as the preferred wick to silica. Things REALLY picked up quick after that. Things haven't changed much in the past year or two though I would say. Some new things here and there like flax paper etc, and "12-coil attys" (which are more like 6 in parallel) but it's still basically the same stuff as last year.

Each year or so I relearn everything I missed and upgrade tanks and mods. That's basically what I'm doing now (asked about a new dual 18650 to replace my triple 18650, mini 18650, and now I gotta find some new smaller tanks).

I still really need to perfect DIY juicing, or at least something decent. That's a different story. For some reason all the nic concentrate brands I've bought are basically unvapable even at just 6mg and flavorless is too harsh vs premade juice I've bought at 6mg, but who wants to pay $12 for a 30ml they can make for 75 cents including the bottle?

Wherever you are getting that you "can't run 0.6 ohms resistance or above" on a mod is incorrect. The LOWER resistance you go, the higher the wattage you will need.

this is what kida confuses me. I'm pretty much clear on the whole .6ohm thing being no problem for a DNA167 but I think maybe because everything is at least a dual coil nowadays is what makes this confusing?
When we had Ce4 clearomizers and kanger T3s (loved that tank lol and hack-rebuilding it without soldering non conductive wire to the coil and therefore sorta burning the grounding grommet) and when we had protank 1s, all single coil tanks, the higher the coil resistance (like 1.8 or a 3ohm), the HIGHER volts you needed. But once you make it dual coil, you add twice the wire but the resistance divides in half. Meaning you need more Watts to heat up more wire mass (but the resistance is lower from being a dual coil (or quad or octa etc).

 

[stols001]

I do DIY but somehow I have found that most of my flavors have been fine. I started really slow on single flavors and did a lot of juice testing and tasting and reading recipes etc.... I actually taste flavors with a drop on the tongue and that tells me enough about whether they have steeped enough and etc.

I might get an RTA though, and a good one, in case I ever decide to squonk, strikes me as a useful tool before getting into that.

Anna

 

[vapesmooth123]

I do DIY but somehow I have found that most of my flavors have been fine. I started really slow on single flavors and did a lot of juice testing and tasting and reading recipes etc.... I actually taste flavors with a drop on the tongue and that tells me enough about whether they have steeped enough and etc.

I might get an RTA though, and a good one, in case I ever decide to squonk, strikes me as a useful tool before getting into that.

Anna

You mean RDA, not RTA I think. But yea you can't really go wrong with an RDA in the collection. I never squonked, I kinda want as little plastic as possible with anything vape-related. But from what I understand manually dripping on TOP of the coils might be better than squank feeding the bottoms of the wicks.

To me a squonk is basically a slow manually-fed genesis top-coil atty which might not be as good as the more common bottom-feeder RTAs. But RDAs have a smaller chamber and coil closer to the tip some say they can taste a difference.


I used a single coil regular round wire basic RDA for years though because I was tired of the protank 2 leaking (it's basically an RTA bottom-fed but the wicks didn't 'bend downward' at all, the juice just comes in from the sides to horizontal wicks and let it flood more easily. We had to add extra wick to stop the flood but they would still flood from time to time.


I get good hits off a dual Clapton Mad hatter V2 velocity deck but if I build the same coil in a TFV8 RBA deck, it's just as good and I don't have to constantly drip new juice.

------------------------------
I'm seeing not too much has changed with RTAs vs about a year ago when I bought my last tanks.
Only thing that I might prefer I've seen so far is how some tanks have air flow from the sides of the coils. The picture shows air from under the coils commonly but if there's a tank with only the side air flow it also shows, that might prevent all possible leaking from out the bottom of the air intake.

I don't get a lot of leaking with a TFV8 build but sometimes it'll leak.

I know it's all about crazy and multiple angles of air flow hitting the coils these days, but can anyone really really tell if their air flow is angled or made to "swirl" etc?

When I got the mad hatter V2, I also got a Tsunami RDA for the bottom air flow but noticed no difference in perfromance and the Tsunami would leak more often out the bottom whereas the side-air flow of the Mad Hatter doesn't do that.

-------------------


DIY has been an epic fail for me lol but I'm not giving up.
I prefer ECBlends very smooth %100VG organic line but haven't come very close to replicating it. I've bought probably thosuands of dollars of flavor concentrates and gallons of VG etc but I sold it for some profit.
I tried almost every nic brand and it's still harsher at just 3mg than ECBlends' 6mg even if I mix it flavorless. ECB's flavors for that line are alcohol-based but all alcohol-based flavor concentrates I tried vape like battery acid!
Granted vapor production is much larger nowadays but I buy the ECB from time to time and it still tastes smoother in modern attys. But the ECB does taste a bit off from when I vaped it in a much smaller tank (Protank 1 or 2 or a single coil tiny RDA which actually had great taste).

I'm actually going to buy another protank 2 now just to sort of take a step back. I did that last year and sold it right away though because the leaking but I'm basically just going to try and replicate the air flow and flavor of the Protank 2 with something less leak-prone like a small single coil kayfun clone (juice doesn't feed into the SIDES of the coil chamber with a kayfun [or anything modern really] like the Protanks did which encouraged leaking or gurgling. The air flow intake is like a pinhole in the Protank also lol now that I tried it again, I used to think big air flow was stupid now I vape wide open though.

anyway sorry to go off topic but I'll be back to the drawing board trying to find a DIY recipe for smooth and tasty juice and not giving up.

 

[vapesmooth123]

OK here's the list I came up with. This actually took forever because there's so many RTAs and I haven't looked at RTAs for about a year.

when I said I wanted a small RTA, I guess I meant short and stout in order to use up the full 24mm of my single 18650 MOD, and my dual 18650 can fit 25mm with no overhang, but a little overhang I'm not too opposed to if it means I can use a tank I prefer more than a narrower one.
Use up the full mm of the MOD in order to hold more juice in the tank, in theory should correlate, but some tanks are wider but hold less juice due to a large build deck and/or chimney or shorter height.


There were tons that didn't make my list because a quick image search showed they didn't have much to offer over the others. Or they had IMO worse decks, like the old type with no opening to put the wire through, they just clamp up against a post, sometimes a cylindrical post, all of which I don't think is best for a big fused Clapton wire I use.

Basically I did searches for "best RTA of 2017" "best RTA" etc etc, found articles, reddit posts etc. Saw what was popular and therefore should be good tanks before even seeing what they looked like. Then figured out if fasttech has it and lots of spare parts (extra glass, gaskets, o rings etc), and also had clones of it, then it's usually a good (popular) tank. Same thing if there's a lot of youtube videos, especially from the more popular channels usually means it's a worthwhile tank.


I still have to check through fasttech for just "RTA" but it's going to be thousands of results and I doubt I missed anything.

So anyways, here's what I've come up with. If it says 24x55 or something, that means millimeters.

I'm gonna sort of nit pick between these and get a few. Depending on certain specifics like "top air flow only" which I think is a good idea. It basically makes juice flow obsolete except for when filling. I don't think I personally can tell the difference between all the air flow styles (swirly, multi angled, direct under coil etc), but I do notice wide open vs tight draw of course but that's besides the point. What I mean is that top air flow leak-proof designs may not be preferred by some people vs other types of air flow but I doubt I'll notice after getting used to it. True if you wick right, you won't have leaks, and if you need juice flow to decrease intake and prevent leaks probably means you're not using the tank to its full potential, But I think juice flow (or leak proof top air) is a must in summer heat - in a car etc, they just start leaking sometimes. I'm vaping an octa coil premade TFV8 right now flavorless %100 VG (flavor thins the juice due to PG or alcohol base) so I'm vaping the thickest juice possible but it still leaks sometimes at room temperature. Would be nice if it were leak-proof. And it's only very rarely it leaks in this settings but it does decide to leak sometimes for whatever reason.

You can nit pick them however you want, I'm just posting this to hopefully save others a lot of time who are new to RTAs and don't want to make a research project out of narrowing down the newest RTAs. FYI not much has changed since about 14 months ago, biggest change I would say are the top air flow leak-proof ones. If it's flooding from not enough cotton or from heat thinning the juice, then you'll be sucking up the juice like a straw and may need to rebuild anyway but at least will not have juice pouring all over you mod etc. can probably do the blow outward trick and clear a gurgle and then wipe but if it keeps flooding, something's wrong.


MOST of these mm sizes are correct, especially if it says confirmed which means I found a picture the manufacture made showing measurements, or found a video someone measuring it, but a few random 'confirmed' measurements may mean I only found the size of the tank confirmed and estimated the height of the included drip tip based on scale.

JF = has juice flow. Doesn't have JF if it doesn't say JF (but a couple still might because I didn't go much further into depth about these yet other than googling the name + "juice flow" and then [find] "juice flow" in the google results. (some call it juice control also I've learned afterwards).

Velocity means dual coil (velocity style).
Single means Single coil only (or maybe can do dual but not meant to).

a lot seem to have shifted back to single coil-only, which, with a big dual clapton/alien etc coil, should be plenty of vapor, and for a single 18650 MOD will conserve battery life.

also please note some things just might be wrong because as I noted about how I determined if they have juice flow or not with a simple google search and then "find" "juice flow" on the first page or so, I didn't go much into depth for each tank yet because it's just too much time. But probably %95 of info is correct.

Mage RTA: 24x39 w tip confirmed 3.5ml velocity.

merlin MTL (meant to be MTL, google MTL vaping if not sure. it includes various chimney reducer size tiny inserts): single 22x43 w shorter included tip. 3ml confirmed.

Merlin Mini single or velocity 24x42.5 w tip 2ml confirmed no JF

engine rta leakproof top air, Dual velocity, 25x55 w tip. 5.2ml - also a 23mm mini not sure ml on the mini.

ijoy captain elite mini Single 22.5X46 prolly not w tip. 2or3ml at same height using bubble tank included.

ijoy captain rta non-elite mini. JF dual postless air flow hits sides (which could help prevent leaking, but probably also has air flwo form under which can leak) 4ml confirmed, not 3.8 stated. 25.5x52 w tip confirmed

AZEROTH RTA triple
Triple 28 RTA : these are triple postless tanks I might get 1 just for fun regardless of nit picking the specs I didn't compare yet.

griffin rta NON mini JF 25x65 w ctip 5ml velocity

griffin rta mini JF 25x46 w tip 3ml velocity

Herakles RTA velocity JF 25x67 6ml OR mini 24x58 3ml

gemini mega rta JF 25x67 4.5ml. Non mega 22.5mm x 67 3ml same height just fatter. I had one of these a year ago when I also got a TFV8 and sold it and stuck with the TFV8 because I ended up preferring the TFV8's wider air flow and ability to use premade octa coils. It basically the same as the Griffin 25 and Aromamizer.

TFV8: been using this for about a year. It's a great tank, maybe the most popular (will have parts available for a long time and cheap), premade coils are cheap from china and the included RBA dual velocity is good also. I didn't include pre-made coil "sub ohm tanks" in this list because that's a different project. I've been using premade 6 or octa (octa 8 coil but really is 4 single strand wires doubled up in parallel and isn't a huge noticeable difference vs a 5 wrap dual fused Clapton build), been using premade coils mostly lately, for about $2 and last me about 3 weeks or more is practically free, but it's nice to build you own and dry burn and change out to fresh cotton weekly and change coil metal every month or so is the consensus (some more or less).
I don't really like the rubber seal at the top, it swells and then can't close the tank. I figured out I can just cut a piece off of it (if removed fully though, the tank won't stay closed). I don't like swelling gaskets reacting with juice possibly leaching stuff etc - I would prefer to just unscrew a threaded cap than this hinged gasket cap. It's also quite tall and I prefer shorter but it does hold 6ml so might not need to carry a small bottle of juice with you. Confirmed 24.5X64 w/included tip.
mini TFV8 baby beast and big baby beast: basically same thing as above but smaller.

 

[vapesmooth123]

Wotofo Sapor RTA 22mm JF dual coil 2ml 22mm x aprox 52 w tip. no leak top air

Wotofo Sapor RTA 25mm JF dual coil 25mm 47.5mm w cap. 3.5 or 4ml unclear. no leak top air.

Kylin RTA mini Single, air hits sides (but still may leak from under air). 24.4mmX about 40mm w- tip 3or5ml same size

Kylin RTA single/dual. 24x61 6ml or 49mm 2ml. hits side coil (but still may leak from under air)

Govad RTA 24mmX50 4ml confirmed. Single. hits side coil (but still may leak from under air)

zeus rta 25x45.5 Single 4ml confirmed. 2ml TPD version is shorter but still 25mm. top air means no leaks.

pharaoh mini JF 24mm w/ cap 47mm 2ml TPD version. OR 24x 55w cap 4.5ml Single or buy additional decks. Kind of reminds me of the Zeus media blast finish, has JF which zeus doesn't but zeus has leak proof top air. Seems overpriced at $47 on fasttech I would, and am probably getting the Zeus instead (plus a couple others probably).

Advken Manta RTA 24mm 41mm even with shorter option 3 or 4.5ml option. Dual velocity esque

berserker MTL tight air Single 24X43mm 4.5ml, 2ml is shorter

ammit rta V2 dual coil version 25X47 3ml 3or6ml adapter included, 6ml about 55mm. hits side coil (but still may leak from under air).

Kayfun not trying to spend $100 on an RTA, Fasttech removed "kayfun" from results of 316L clone/style versions, need to search "prime style rta" instead. Might get one to mimic the performance of the original protank 1/2 which originally made me enjoy vaping. But kayfuns are quite tall and should be able to mimic protank good enough if not better with any of these other single coil RTAs with a single strand 1.8ohm build and using tight air flow (not to mention the protank doesn't wick as good, is more leak prone, and not supposed to rebuild protank without adding low resistance leads to the main coil wire) but I still might get a protank 2 also just to have it.

serpent smm - 24x45 single postless 4ml

Voluna 25mm RTA - dual velocity 25x45 2.5ml

Hotcig Centaur 24X42.5 in 2ml mode. 4ml extension included. Single coil, Easily shorts if excess wire is not cut flush after building (saw this in a video, any RTA with a similar deck would have same issue).

_____________________________________

so that's my list of what I think are the most worthwhile current RTAs in 24-25mm or similar range. If I missed anything please do let me know, thanks! Hope I saved others some time!

 

[KenD]

The Obs Engine Nano. Single-coil version of the Engine. I prefer it to the dual-coil Engine.

Sent from my Thor E using Tapatalk

 

[vapesmooth123]

well, I didn't find any more attys to add to the list after finalizing the search by going through all of Fasttech's "atomizers".

I think fasttech is just screwed up or something:
If I just type in "RTA" on the main page, it says there's 499 results, 394 of them in the category "Atomizers", 76 in "misc accessories", the other ~25 in random categories like "drip tips", "coil heads" etc.

So ok I go to the Atomizer category to look though them all, apparently there's many more which aren't listed though. The 499 items make up 8 pages I looked through them all and didn't see most of the ones I already listed but they are listed on Fasttech. And if I search those items separately, they show up in the Atomizer category (and also have "RTA" attached to their names). So I dunno what the problem is. If I search "Zeus rta", it'll show it in the Atomizer category, but if I go through all 8 pages of the 395 atomizers, the Zeus isn't there.

But, I don't think there's even anything I missed worth while for me or those looking for 24-25mm ish RTA that are mostly stout and not too tall, and that accommodate big coils like fused claptons.
As mentioned, I basically voided out all attys with small wire holes meant mostly for single strand wire because I use fused claptons, but can still use thin single strand wire in a large velocity deck or similar).

 

[vapesmooth123]

Wait, so you made a "list of what I think are the most worthwhile current RTAs in 24-25mm or similar range" for others to use, but you haven't tried any of them and are asking for advice on which one(s) to buy? ... lol


So are you still searching for an RTA(s)? I know of two that I didn't see on your list of the most worthwhile current RTAs that I think you might enjoy more than the ones you listed (judging by your posts).

The OBS Nano Engine (not the standard or the mini). Top airflow directed from the side, 5ml+ capacity, and is 25mm.

The Wake RTA is also a good option for you since it's a rebuildable tank that can also use pre-made coil heads, but it is bottom airflow. (I'd personally go with the Nano).[/quote]

------------------------------

I didn't use any of those tanks listed other than the TFV8 and Gemini, but I watched a lot of reviews which were mostly all positives, and saw the star ratings and don't think I listed any POS or defective tanks.

YES! the OBS Engine (nano and standard) are great tanks, thanks for pointing out that I missed that. I might actually get one of those too.

The reason it's not on the list is because it ended up in my "sub ohm tank" folder simply as "OBS Engine", and I didn't yet search about sub ohm tanks which use premade coils to have figure out that there are RTA-only Engines.
It ended up categorized as a sub tank because I must have done a google image search for simply OBS Engine (first thing I did was look at pictures) and saw the premade coil next to it along with the other RBA pictures and probably figured it was a RBA that can also use Premade coils (like TFV8s), but there's about 4 different Engine tanks.
Or I saw the premade coils when "OBS Engine" is searched on Fasttech.
There are probably at least a few others which ended up in my sub ohm folder but might be RTA-only versions because of this same confusion, but I would have listed them with these later.
Besides the TFV8 that I listed as an RTA, any sub ohm tanks which also have an RBA deck I'll list as a sub-ohm tank though.
But thanks for pointing out that the Standard OBS engine (and 25mm nano, and 23mm mini) are RBA-only.



OBS Engine RTA Standard 25mm: dual velocity, 25x54.5 w/ tip confirmed by manufacturer's 'parameters" graphic, 5.3ml, leak proof top air.

OBS Engine Nano RTA 25mm: single, 5.3 ml 25x54.5 w tip confirmed by saw in manual during review most likely means w/ included tip because Standard version was confirmed same size with tip. Leak proof top air. (identical to standard version besides dual vs single coil deck).

OBS Engine Mini RTA 23mm: dual velocity 3.5ml 23X54.5 w/ tip most likely. Leak proof top air. Basically identical to the Standard dual velocity version but is 23mm instead of 25mm hence the 3.5ml vs 5.3ml.

 

[vapesmooth123]

just wanted to add one more tid bit as if my posts haven't been long enough already which is that if you're new to vaping or even if not, don't be afraid to put a 25mm tank on a 24mm MOD.

When I first started looking at newer tank videos, a lot of reviewers seemed to be very preoccupied with making sure there was no overhang and I thought it was silly. Sure a 30mm tank on a 24mm mod may look ridiculous but don't be afraid to put a 25mm on a 24mm MOD if you really like that 25mm tank (and that 24mm MOD).

A US dime coin is 1.35mm thick. Which means a 25mm tank on a 24mm MOD will overhanging the mod at a distance that is less than half the thickness of a US dime, which is practically nothing.

 

[vapesmooth123]

minimag, after all that reply, I realized I did list the OBS Engine and the mini (but I must have though mini was the nano) but there are different.

 

[JCinFLA]

I just started using the Berserker 24mm MTL RTA on Wednesday night. I love it so much that I ordered 6 more in the wee hours yesterday, for just $21.99 each from a US vendor. I can't find anything about the way it vapes, that I don't like. I love the small height of it, the impressive flavor I get with it, the smoothness of the vapor, the AFC hole size choices, the easy build deck, how slowly it uses eliquid even when I'm chain vaping, the smooth and easy draw, etc., etc.

I've used and loved mainly the KFL "shorty" tanks for over a year, but this Berserker has put them on the back burner for me. I've only used 1 of my KFL shortys for about an hour since getting the Berserker! I highly recommend it!

 

[madstabber]

@vapesmooth123, great write up, lots of info thank you. I did notice you said you were having trouble diy your own juice and said you couldn’t find a nicotine base that wasn’t harsh. May I suggest trying nicotine salts? They are specifically made to be a smoother vape that the regular stuff, even at high mg’s. Sounds like a perfect solution to your problem, unless you’ve already tried it. I have not used it but lots of others have and it’s well thought of. Nicotine river sells some as well as nude nicotine. Anyways thanks for the write up and good luck with your diy’ing.

 

[stols001]

I use nic salts from Nic River and find them to be consistently of high quality. There is almost no throat hit, so if you want some you could consider trying a mix of freebase and nic salts. If you get interested in nic salts, could try a few different vendors, most will send you a sample for the cost of shipping. They should arrive very clear yellow (unlike freebase which is clear) but extremely pale. I've used them a lot in DIY but I actively search out lack of throat hit, and it might certainly cut down on harshness....

Best of luck, there are also "premade" nicsalt juices that many e-liquid vendors sell if you want to give that a shot first and see how you like them. They are reportedly more quickly bioavailable (I didn't notice a huge difference, really) so if you do try them, might want to keep an eye out for nic overload at first, especially if chainvaping.

Best of luck,

Anna

 

[vapesmooth123]

JCinFLA, thanks for the info on the MTL berserker. MTL Mouth to Lung. MTLs are not made nowadays nearly as much as direct to lung, some people are complaining about that.
Probably Berserker MTL or Merlin MTL will be the best modern replacement for the original Protank 1 which was what made me start enjoying vaping to begin with (before that I was using a CE2 Clearomizer pictured below which gave some problems from it being a top-coil silica wicked atty [had to tip and shake them often to help juice up the coil or it'll give burnt hits]).

I re-bought a protank 2 a year ago (and got rid of it right way lol but might get another just as sort of a souvenir and to compare against) just to revisit it and they need to be wicked very exact depending on the juice viscosity vs modern bottom coil RTAs are less problematic.
With a modern RBA, you tuck the ends of the wicks DOWN to the bottom of the build deck and that's where the juice come in from, but the protank has it that they just stay horizontal, so juice just comes in from the sides of the coil instead down under the coil on a modern RBA which makes it less leak-prone. If the wicks tucked down much further though than a modern bottom coil RTA/RBA, then it would be a modern top-coil Genesis RTA which can maybe not wick so well, so I don't get into those (have to maybe shake and tip it to prevent dry hits).
You could get the build right with a Protank but then temperature changes or juice heating up from vaping would thin the juice and it would gurgle and leak rather easy, or would burn the coil if added too much "top wick" to prevent said gurgling and flooding.
But when the Protank was working I did enjoy it despite all that.

The protank feels like a pin hole after getting used to a wide-open direct to lung, 810 drip tip pull of a TFV8, but it's a different MTL style of vaping, and these modern MTL tanks aren't just pinhole air intakes, instead, the chimney is usually also reduced in size. If I put a 510 on the TFV8 and close up the air hole to be small it's not the same vape as a MTL protank.

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Nicotine salt? That sounds like bath salts! lol, but no seriously I will check into that, sound very promising.
I used to vape a protank at 6mg %100VG alcohol-based flavor purchased from ECB plus 'extra flavor" and it felt like nothing but smooth flavor. I would even go up to about 18mg when I wanted more nic per puff but less less puffs per day, and even that was fine. But when I DIY (and I've tried every nic brand fresh besides Carolina Xtract which is said to be the best and never comes in contact with oxygen during manufacturing, doesn't use as many or any of the chemicals in extraction like other brands but it's like 2-3X the price), even if I DIY other "smooth" nic concentrates VG based at 3mg and flavorless (less burn from flavor base) it's like battery acid compared to ECBlends at 6-12mg with extra flavor (alcohol based none the less which is supposed to be harsh but wasn't really).

-Got my new MODs coming, and that was quite a research project. -Got the new RTA choices listed above I'm gonna pick a few.
-Not trying to go too crazy making a list of modern sub tanks which I want a couple of also still. I need to stay in the loop of e cig gear somewhat so I don't have to search though everything every year or so when I want to upgrade like I did last year and didn't look at anything really since now.
-THEN I hope to get this DIY thing down pat once and for all. I've spend at least a couple thousand on flavor concentrates not to mention cases and cases of VG and many liters of different brand 100mg nic (I was selling too though, not vaping this all) but never found a smooth vape like ECBs %100 VG organic alcohol based line.
The ECB is budget juice at like $8 a 30ml with coupon code which never expires, so I highly doubt they are using something like carolinaXtract nic base which cost 2-3X more.
There's also possibly new(ish) organic USP pharmaceutical-grade choices for VG base and that are not just palm-based anymore. 9Palm is also controversial due to rain forest destruction).
Now they make VG from Mustard seed and corn and coconut and possibly other stuff, and supposedly it's so refined that it wouldn't matter if someone's allergic to coconut/mustard. I have to really look into that though, maybe just see what other venders are not using palm-derived anymore would tell if it's indeed allergen-free to use something like soy or coconut-based. I'm not selling anymore but it's just good to know, and I might end up passing off a few bottles here and there anyway. Another plus is if it's organic grown corn/soy, then that guarantees it's GMO-free corn/soy.

Maybe those VG types give more vapor, but again, I highly doubt ECB was using anything but common palm-derived VG.

I tried many times to find ECBs flavor source of their alcohol based organic flavorings but haven't found them, or they do something to them like heat treat it to smooth them out but I doubt that too. I tried many times in Contact Us to try and indirectly trick them into revealing their flavor source lol but I never got it. Doesn't have to be the same exact flavor though, I just want something very smooth. Still haven't tried VG-based flavors either but VG doesn't carry flavor well at all and supposedly need to add that flavor and a very high %. And FWIW, if I buy ECB now and put it in a TFV8 with a big coil, it'll indeed be smooth and produce a ton of vapor (seems like more than when I vape just 4mg flavorless pure VG) but it tastes off compared to the MTL vape in a protank.

sorry to go on about DIY, that'll actually be another thread, but just saying.

 

[vapesmooth123]

hmm decisions decision, not really sure which MTL is best to get.

The mini Merlin I basically voided out because it's only 2ml. It is a bit shorter than the full size one though because it's 24mm, not 22. The Mini is 24x43 w tip confirmed, and that IS an MTL tip.

The $23 standard Merlin is only 22ml but holds 3ml which I guess will do. It's 22x54 using the MTL tip, or 22 x aprox 47 (give or take just 1mm or so on the 47mm) using the short, wide black tip which isn't really an MTL tip.

The mini I believe only includes 2 sizes of chimney reducers but the standard includes 4.

Berserker MTL $45 on fasttech but $28 with MAP code, $30 elsewhere China, I don't think includes any reducers, you have to like the air flow they decided on, but it'll hold 4.5ml at 24x43 including the MTL tip caliper confirmed.

so basically the 4.5ml capacity of the berserker is attractive but doesn't have chimney reducer options. It also has individual holes for the air flow instead of the Merlin's oval slot which might be more prone to whistling when set as restrictive but on the other hand probably allows more wide open air flow if that even happens to be preferred with an MTL.

There's also the $30 Innokin Ares RTA MTL which I didn't originally list because I didn't pick up on it being an MTL. Holds 5ml, and just going by Fasttech's specs it's 24x54 which probably includes the tip since the Berserker holds 4.5ml at 43mm wip included.
I don't think this includes any chimney reducers either, and I originally might have seen this tank but didn't included it in my "best" list because it seems to be a bit genesis top coil-esque being that the wick tails have to tuck down quite a distance meaning that juice might not wick as well or as quickly. I guess the reason for top-coil-esque is to have the coil closer to the mouth for better flavor at the expense of slower wicking. If you ask me, I'd rather have it wick faster. No one wants a burnt coil, and how much flavor difference is a ~8mm difference in distance from the coil to mouth going to make?

Also not listed probably because I didn't know what MTL meant at the time is the $30 Fumytech Rose MTL, which isn't top-coil esque BTW.
Just by going by Fasttech's specs it'll hold 3.5ml at 24x55 which even if that includes the tip, I think the Merlin Standard is a better choice at 22x54mm 3ml because even though the Merlin holds .5ml less, it includes various chimney reducers and I'm almost certain the Rose doesn't.

Lastly is the $25 Cthulhu Hastur MTL which includes 5 reducers sizes and you can buy 5 more different ones for $3.20 which are dual-holed and might produce a different/better MTL flavor.
Holds 3.5 @ 24x52mm including the tip confirmed by caliper video.
This one is also top-coil-esque having long wick tails that may not feed the coil as quickly but might give better flavor since the coil is closer to the mouth.


MTL is all about flavor basically, a lot of MTL reviews say they're getting the best flavor of basically all their tanks.
Most of these listed above are very new like 2 months or so, so if MTL picks up more, I think we'll be seeing more MTL tanks, like 25mm ones that hold more juice also without being tall, some genesis top col -esque and some not, and most with various reducers.
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Edit, personally I'm getting the berserker. I vape very thick %100VG juice (and am going to start trying VG-based flavors which adds no thinner alcohol/PG based flavors to the mix at all), so I want to avoid those two top coil--genesis-esque RTAs regardless of chimney reducer options and ml capacity and cheaper price of them. Thick juice and long wicks is a combination for a burnt hit that ruins the cotton that overrides the benefits IMO.

So it was between the berserker and the Merlin for neither being genesis-esque. I'd rather have the 4.5ml of the berserker vs 3ml Merlin regardless that merlin includes chimney options and berserker doesn't.

Might as well add that there's a digiflavor siren MTL but it's also top coil-genesis-esque and not for me. Probably some other MTLs such as the Kayfuns but I'm not going to google like crazy, I already listed all the ones FT has when search "MTL RTA" and added two or three others I stumbled on that weren't in the results but were mentioned in reviews as competition.