Supporting Local Brick and Mortar Stores

[MrStik]

People who claim gouging do not know how much it costs just to run ANY B&M retail business, let alone a vape store.
Monthly operating costs just to keep a store open ranges from 4k to 10k depending on size of operation. That is 48k-12k a year in just keeping a store open. Not including inventory. And just labor alone to keep someone in the store for a 12 hour day 7 say a week operation paying them 10 per hour is equal to 840 per week in payroll. Every shop I have been in will have 3-4 employees.. Granted I am sure they do not have 4 employees from open to close but just having 2 bodies all day equals to 1680 a week in payroll on the front end. And also remember that the employer is responsible to match each employee's Federal Withholdings, FICA, and Medicare taxes along with State taxes as well, and in some instances Local taxes.

Also remember that this is just minimal operating costs. Thousands if not tens of thousands may be poured into making the store presentable with nice display cases, carpeting, lighting fixtures, eye appealing decor, security cameras, seats, juice bar, cash registers, computers etc.

So how do you make up 4-10k of operating costs PER month? High markup is a must for small operations JUST to practically break even.

 

[HiFi Guy]

My local shop is high priced, but I know it going in, kind of like a vaping 7-11.

 

[inspects]

I'm self employed too....I understand overhead, its mind-blowing. That being said...I don't mind paying more at a B&M, because it costs a small fortune to keep a store open.

The shops in my area do mark their prices up considerably, but everytime I walk into a shop, seldom is there more than one or two other customer in the store.

I think when more people start vaping and quit smoking, the B&M stores could lower their prices and still stay in business, they would have more volume to work with.

 

[Danbrooks2k]

I am ok with a standard 50% markup... something like an MVP2 is close to 40$ online so I think 60$ is reasonable. I understand that other items are going to cost a little more... 1.00 drip tips you wont get for 1.50, closer to 5.00... and DIY juice costing pennies may sale for 50 cents a ml.

Unfortunatley I see far too many 100$ MVPs, 10 and 12 dollar drip tips, 30$ ego batteries... and staff that are rude, know little about vaping or a mix between the two.

I am headed to houston in a few weeks and have been told of a few good shops... I will try them out... Mostly I just stick to online... I dont mind the extra cost in a store, but I wont get gouged and treated like an idiot at the same time.

 

[codeflayer]

Seems like the consensus is that B&Ms are overcharging with the occasional stand out place. I'll keep hunting for a good local shop, but I won't feel bad for buying online.

 

[OlderNDirt]

Seems like the consensus is that B&Ms are overcharging with the occasional stand out place. I'll keep hunting for a good local shop, but I won't feel bad for buying online.

Charging more does not necessarily equate to "overcharging". But I totally agree with your second sentence.

 

[ThunderDan]

Charging more does not necessarily equate to "overcharging". But I totally agree with your second sentence.

Charging $0.67/ml for DIY, $80 for a MVP 2.0, and $135 for a tobeco CDNA 30 is overcharging. I don't care what their operating expenses are.

The one store by me that is the worst offender is charging $45 for a tobeco doge v1 clone. You can buy an authentic v2 for less than that.
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[OlderNDirt]

Charging $0.67/ml for DIY, $80 for a MVP 2.0, and $135 for a tobeco CDNA 30 is overcharging. I don't care what their operating expenses are.

The one store by me that is the worst offender is charging $45 for a tobeco doge v1 clone. You can buy an authentic v2 for less than that.
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But are these examples or all of your personal experiences justification for making the blanket statement "B&M's are overcharging"? One cannot proclaim "overcharging" without knowing C.O.G.S.

 

[fyrefiend]

The one vape shop I've shopped at, while they do have a pretty decent mark up is also very friendly and knowledgeable so I'm willing to give them business for somethings (I just bought a Aspire Nautilus Mini from them at a reasonable mark up). Plus I'll buy eliquids there when I find something I like on their taste bar. That being said I'm not going to buy drip tips, cheap iClears, or replacement coils from them because while I'm ok with a mark up on somethings I'm not going to pay double for a stupid cheap item. It's a balance.

 

[Raguvian]

I would only go to a B&M if I needed help with coils or something (which I don't). I just can't justify paying $25-30 for a FT clone I can get for $10 online, even if I do get some instant gratification. Stuff like the MVP 20W, which usually goes for ~$40 online, is $70 at my B&M. I understand they have overhead but I can't justify the cost.

The only things I'll buy from a B&M store are premium juices since they have price control and you wouldn't be able to find it cheaper online (and tax and shipping usually even out things). I don't mind throwing a couple extra bucks for a mod or atty if it's reasonable, though. For example I found a shop locally selling authentic KFLs for $110, which I'd gladly pay since they're about $90-100 online.

 

[ThunderDan]

But are these examples or all of your personal experiences justification for making the blanket statement "B&M's are overcharging"? One cannot proclaim "overcharging" without knowing C.O.G.S.

I wasn't trying to say all B&Ms are overcharging, or make a blanket statement about B&Ms are overcharging, just that a couple in my area that do. Just examples from personal experience.

There are a couple other shops not too far from me that have very reasonable B&M prices, and have been open longer, so it can be done. They are still higher than what the online vendors can get away with understandably, but not blatantly trying to rip off uninformed customers.

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[OlderNDirt]

Sorry for the misunderstanding. I took it based on your quote of my statement. But all is good.

 

[bullet08]

hardware, always online. not willing to pay 3-4 times what i can get from china. juice, i used to get them locally.. until they stop stocking them on time. been to the store twice, 30 min drive, both time they didn't have anything i wanted. now i order juice online too. even with shipping, it's cheaper then buying one locally with mark up and the tax.

 

[BraveNewWorld]

Also, some reasons I like my local guys. One shop will rebuild your coils on your tanks/drippers for you. Just drop by and they'll do it for you. They are always friendly and bend over backwards to help customers and introduce them to whatever they have questions about. They never try to push something at a cusotmer that they are not ready for. Another shop is trying to recreate a liquid I like but can't get locally right now. It's Bamskilicious' Kool Apple, an apple menthol. I can't find anything locally or online that even comes close to the flavor. I let the juice guy try it and he was really impressed with the flavor. He has his own line and had never tasted any apple flavor that full. Last time I talked to him he had replicated the apple flavor, but was having problems with the cool aftertaste that it has. The people in these shops around here are evangelists at getting people off analogs.

Koolada flavor? It's not a menthol but a wet kooling sensation, best I can describe it, but look up "koolada" in the big flavor companies.
The flavor apprentice
Capella's
Flavour art
Etc. ^ but I'm sure it's one of them.

 

[FRSguy]

I kind of really love the local shop I go to. It is overpriced on a lot of items but you will still find there every Friday evening after work to make some kind of purchase. Some things I do have to get online as they dont carry it and other times some of the mark ups are just to out there... like over $2 per foot for wire... really?
I can get a whole spool that will last me a lifetime probably for just a few dollars and of course cases. They are not really consistant on their mark ups as with mods you can sometimes be only about $20 over what you pay online which is cool by me but the $17 for coils kind of bugs especially when I average 2 bum coils per 5 pack which is not their fault but it gets a bit much for me. On the whole though they are taking out full page ads in magazines advertising the store and they appear to have their own juice line and do all the model photo shoots and everything all of which I think kicks .... to see this little store working it as hard as they can. I have even thought of trying and getting a part time job their as I have 15 years marketing experience and thought maybe I could lend them a few ideas... they are all great people and its a great place to check out at the end of the week and even though I am as supportive of their efforts as I can be sometimes I just cant take that big of a hit.

 

[BrushyHillGuide]

I guess I must be one of the luckiest people/vapers in the world. Although I have to travel 100+ miles each way to get to a vape shop (yeah, there are 2 within 25 miles, but are small town undersupplied shops), I am batting 1000 on hitting pretty good ones in "the city". No, they don't have great selections and their prices are higher then online (but never twice the price or higher), but they are there and do a great job taking care of me. Although my visits are rare, they know me, my equipment, my favorite juices, and where I am coming from. I look forward to when I can/do make a trip to check out what they have to offer in equipment and juices and have a good visit with them on the industry. I'm very thankful they are there.

Having said that, they do not get all my vaping business and they know they don't. But they understand my situation and don't hold it against me when I walk in with my subtank knowing I didn't buy it there. It was great when on a second or third visit, I walk in and they immediately say hi and want me to try a new juice they just came up with that they think may be in my wheelhouse. Even when my wife called them to purchase a gift certificate for me for Christmas, they asked who it was for and she mentioned a hat I usually wear and they responded with "oh, yeah. Dan from (name of town)".

So I have spent more on some items at the B&M and I have made some purchases online that they just couldn't provide or come reasonably close to online. Having found my seven favorite juices so far from them (their house blends), I really want to see them still around on my next trip. If spending an extra $5 for 5 coils helps, that is a small price to pay. If they go away, I will have no other choice but to buy online or travel out of state for vaping paraphernalia.

Being as remote as I am yet still having access to some very fine B&M's, I am somewhat surprised at those seemingly from large cities proclaiming all B&M's are not worth going to. No question there are some bad or poorly run shops and some that are disgustingly overpriced, but surely there are some good ones sprinkled in. Look around and make an effort to find them, even if it requires a little longer drive out of your way. I've been around long enough to know that vaping is not the only business/industry with both great and pathetic establishments. Find the good ones. avoid that bad ones, and the bad ones will eventually disappear.

Wow, I thought I was rural with a 60 mile drive but you've got me beat, brother! I've also had very good luck finding B&M stores in the cities. Both San Antonio and Austin have some great shops with some pretty good pricing; and the service and knowledge at those shops is incredible. It's almost like going into a B&M version of ECF. Can I get stuff cheaper online? Sure. And, because I live so far out, I DO but a lot of stuff online, to save the drive. On the other hand, I strongly support those B&M stores because I think they're an essential resource. When I wanted to get into building coils and using mech mods I read all the warnings and scary stuff and even though I thought my research was adequate to keep me safe and enable me to set up a dripper, it sure felt better to go in to a shop and do it under the watchful eye of a guy that clearly knew what he was doing. Not everybody needs that but it's sure nice to have.

Also, I think supporting B&M businesses of ALL types is important. These days you can buy every from a car to a refrigerator to clothing online. And it's ALWAYS cheaper to buy online. If we're not careful, always chasing the cheapest possible price for everything will (eventually) eliminate B&M stores. I don't want to see the end of B&M stores or the jobs they provide.


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[DingerCPA]

Once I discovered the "simplicity" and cost-savings of ordering online, I do about 98% of my shopping that way. However, I have a great B&M just around the corner from my house - I frequented there A LOT to get juices the first few months I was vaping.

I now save my "big" purchases for online shopping, but if I need a knick-knack or two, I'll pop my head in my B&M to continue to support them.

 

[McFeely]

Support them if you feel they should be supported. If you like the people that work there and they are good at what they do by all means buy something once in a while. You don't have to be completely loyal, buy stuff off the net when you like. I had one shop in town about 5 months into vaping their prices were good very close to net prices and there were a few good juices (a bit more expensive but good). Now there are at least 5 or 6 shops around, shops will come and go, the good ones will last.

 

[OlderNDirt]

Wow, I thought I was rural with a 60 mile drive but you've got me beat, brother! I've also had very good luck finding B&M stores in the cities. Both San Antonio and Austin have some great shops with some pretty good pricing; and the service and knowledge at those shops is incredible. It's almost like going into a B&M version of ECF. Can I get stuff cheaper online? Sure. And, because I live so far out, I DO but a lot of stuff online, to save the drive. On the other hand, I strongly support those B&M stores because I think they're an essential resource. When I wanted to get into building coils and using mech mods I read all the warnings and scary stuff and even though I thought my research was adequate to keep me safe and enable me to set up a dripper, it sure felt better to go in to a shop and do it under the watchful eye of a guy that clearly knew what he was doing. Not everybody needs that but it's sure nice to have.

Also, I think supporting B&M businesses of ALL types is important. These days you can buy every from a car to a refrigerator to clothing online. And it's ALWAYS cheaper to buy online. If we're not careful, always chasing the cheapest possible price for everything will (eventually) eliminate B&M stores. I don't want to see the end of B&M stores or the jobs they provide.


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Well said!

 

[MrStik]

A B&M should really take a look at providing loss leader prices on certain items...For a B&M these will most likely be mods. These prices will bring in the customers to make the initial purchase on a mod at a very reasonable price, ie, online pricing or slightly higher than online pricing. And the higher profit margins needs to be on items that are accessories and disposables and juices.