The big issue that’ll swing the elections? Vaping, says Grover Norquist
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“The do-gooder movement was never about public health; it was always about money,” Norquist and colleague Paul Blair wrote in the National Review this month. “Since 1998, governments have collected more than $500 billion in cigarette taxes and payments from smokers. In 2013, Master Settlement Agreement (MSA) payments and taxes helped the government rake in nearly $44 billion. No such punitive tax regime exists for e-cigarettes. Each time a smoker picks up an e-cigarette in Michigan, the state loses $2, and the federal government loses $1.01 per pack; in Illinois, $1.98; and in New York, $4.35. It adds up quickly, and for big spenders in state capitols, that’s a problem.”
"It turns out, according to Norquist, that there’s a big underground movement across America to oust Democrats from state legislatures — led by people who crouch in corners, occasionally puffing on those magical electronic sticks and exhaling a plume of vapor wherever freedom already hasn’t been garroted and choked to death by tax-addicted liberals."
“The do-gooder movement was never about public health; it was always about money,” Norquist and colleague Paul Blair wrote in the National Review this month. “Since 1998, governments have collected more than $500 billion in cigarette taxes and payments from smokers. In 2013, Master Settlement Agreement (MSA) payments and taxes helped the government rake in nearly $44 billion. No such punitive tax regime exists for e-cigarettes. Each time a smoker picks up an e-cigarette in Michigan, the state loses $2, and the federal government loses $1.01 per pack; in Illinois, $1.98; and in New York, $4.35. It adds up quickly, and for big spenders in state capitols, that’s a problem.”
"It turns out, according to Norquist, that there’s a big underground movement across America to oust Democrats from state legislatures — led by people who crouch in corners, occasionally puffing on those magical electronic sticks and exhaling a plume of vapor wherever freedom already hasn’t been garroted and choked to death by tax-addicted liberals."
If they can ask the pubs about fantasy football, they can ask the dems (in their debate) about vaping. I'd love to see them go on record and spout their anti-science rhetoric and be held accountable for it in 2016 elections.
What vaper wouldn't like to see this be something that is brought up in national elections for 2016?
Given how things have played out thus far in both national politics in general and vaping politics specifically, I'd have no issue with Pubs backing the pro-vaping position while Dems take the anti-vaping stance. Not like I'm creating some theoretical there, it is mostly the case already (though I'm sure there are Pubs that are a little anti-vaping and perhaps a couple national dems that are a little pro-vaping).
I sometimes think if there was a Pub that just came out and said, "I oppose FDA regulations on eCigs and will fight to keep that market viable / free" that they'd gain around 500,000 votes overnight.
What vaper wouldn't like to see this be something that is brought up in national elections for 2016?
Given how things have played out thus far in both national politics in general and vaping politics specifically, I'd have no issue with Pubs backing the pro-vaping position while Dems take the anti-vaping stance. Not like I'm creating some theoretical there, it is mostly the case already (though I'm sure there are Pubs that are a little anti-vaping and perhaps a couple national dems that are a little pro-vaping).
I sometimes think if there was a Pub that just came out and said, "I oppose FDA regulations on eCigs and will fight to keep that market viable / free" that they'd gain around 500,000 votes overnight.
2015/2016- The time that will go down in history of how Vaping changed the political landscape.
The article was all sarcasm. The author was not buying into what Norquist was saying, and was attacking vaping.
And they'd need to explain why they oppose. At first, they might lose more support than they'd gain, but if they can hang in there long enough, the tide might very well turn before the 2016 election.
More like a liberal shooting themselves in the foot. The National Review article was real (and true):
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/390334/vaping-tax-freedom-grover-norquist-paul-blair
The: "Or (more likely) it’s the lefty liberal news media, led by debate host CNBC, whose questioners deliberately didn’t ask about e-cigarettes because the socialist media just wants to focus on fantasy football gambling and stuff like that." is a bit understating (rather than 'sarcastic') since there was much more where the socialist media moderators also shot themselves in the foot with a fully auto assault rifle
- which he failed to mention.I'm guessing he was so upset with the debate that he thought he'd write a 'hit piece' on someone, anyone (I imagine the Koch brothers were considered) and it turned out just the opposite of what he intended - typical of liberals.
We could probably at least agree that it was horrible journalism, and likely backfiring more than getting his point across, which seems to have been that Norquist is silly, and please pay no attention to the economic realities Grover's shining a light on. I'm no fan of Norquist, but that doesn't make him automatically wrong on every issue, but the author is banking on that dumb assumption.More like a liberal shooting themselves in the foot. The National Review article was real (and true):
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/390334/vaping-tax-freedom-grover-norquist-paul-blair
The: "Or (more likely) it’s the lefty liberal news media, led by debate host CNBC, whose questioners deliberately didn’t ask about e-cigarettes because the socialist media just wants to focus on fantasy football gambling and stuff like that." is a bit understating (rather than 'sarcastic') since there was much more where the socialist media moderators also shot themselves in the foot with a fully auto assault rifle
I'm guessing he was so upset with the debate that he thought he'd write a 'hit piece' on someone, anyone (I imagine the Koch brothers were considered) and it turned out just the opposite of what he intended - typical of liberals.
Did you notice that one of his links was to an ECF page, in an attempt to show Grover's wrong about New Mexico?
The author's description of politically active vapers disgusts me, and it has no valid place in our culture, let alone our journalism.
And his 'banking' works most of the time. To a certain segment of the population (lesser than they'd like to think) bringing up the names of Norquist, Koch, Limbaugh, Bush, Fox is expected to get a 'bankable' response, since most low information voters on that side get their mis-information from Media Matters, and other similar sites rather than the sources themselves. When they actually go to the source - which is highly protested, ridiculed, despised - then they get better informed.
Grover isn't different than any other conservative/libertarian - he wants no more taxes - but he's made a lobbying group out of the idea. Not unlike many liberal groups that want more taxes, spending and regulation, under the guise of 'helping the middle class' when in fact they have decimated it.
The middle class is despised in socialism. Bourgeoisie is a French term for middle class. It is a derogatory term for all socialists. While in socialism it also includes small businesses - not large businesses, btw - it include the whole segment of middle class. It's just another way for socialists to be snobby towards the masses, while claiming to help them.
Thx for that explanation -- I knew it meant the middle class, in French, but never could figure out why it's so often used derogatively. They don't seem to grasp that the middle class is what MAKES an economy thrive or fail. When the middle class in America was solid and prosperous, so was the American economy; now that the middle class are sliding backward... well, just look at the economy!
America is never going to recover until we have more industry -- it needs to be brought back from the third world, and no I really don't give a damn for the third world, I'm worried about MY world.
Andria
Then I hope you'd be OK with the third world deciding "screw you and YOUR world".
As long as companies (such as Disney now in the news) replace Am. employees with foreign shipped in, we're going to have a problem maintaining a middle class. This has been going on for at least the last 20 yrs. that I can recollect.
Sorry, NicNic, I've watched the U.S. largesse being used and abused by the countries and organizations we've sent to over many years. It usually winds up in some dictator's/premier's pocket while his people continue to suffer. Our money/food continues to make him stronger and better able to put down any rebellion from his people.
Andria is right in that we now are in dire jeopardy ourselves from our own government. Time to focus on our own business.
Andria is right in that we now are in dire jeopardy ourselves from our own government. Time to focus on our own business.
The "third world" might actually save Vaping even if the FDA gets their way. Rules down here are not as strict, and if the vaping community continues to grow through out the rest of the world; research, product development and so on will continue. There is strength in numbers, the more vapers in the world the more acceptance we will gain.
They've been saying that for years -- we're the "great satan" you know.
If they want to be taken seriously, then they need to develop their OWN industry, not steal jobs from the US. And yes I'm aware it's the mega-global-corporate complex that has caused it, and as far as I'm concerned, THEY are the "great satan."
The US needs to implement massive tariffs on any company that outsources jobs -- PERIOD.
Andria
Wish I could like this about 1,000,000 times. They sure do like our jobs and our money, considering how much they hate us. I say it's high time we take back our jobs and our money and tend to our problems at home, and nevermind the whole world's problems.
Andria
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