The ethics of "Made in USA" on clones

[Coelli]

There's been a lot of discussion about clones vs. authentics (a LOT, right? ) but I was wondering specifically how people feel about clones that even clone the "USA" and "Made in the USA" engravings on mods. While I try to buy stuff that's made in the USA by small companies when I can, I'm not that hardcore about it (it's almost impossible to be, and some of my favorite vaping gear comes from By Leo in Greece). Still, it REALLY bothers me when I see things like the satin brass King clone's end cap duplicated exactly, like this:

It's NOT Made in the USA. It's made in China. The original King is made here in my hometown (L.A.).

Same with the Tree of Life clone - it's also made here in L.A. but the end cap on the clone carries the same "USA" engraving.

This isn't really a discussion about whether mods are overpriced or who can afford an authentic and who can't or anything like that. I'm just curious how many people share the feeling I have when I see it, that it's just... not cool. Kind of like when American flags are manufactured in China and everyone's flying them on Independence Day. How do people who buy them feel? When you see the engraving on your mod, do you care?

 

[stevegmu]

If it weren't for fools who buy them, it would never be an issue...
I go way out of my way to buy everything I can made in the USA. Tools, clothing, shoes, furniture, housewares...

 

[MrPlink]

Im not sure how one could get past the copy of the fundamental design, then get past the copying of logos and identification marks only to then take issue with false claims as to the place of manufacture?

 

[edyle]

There's been a lot of discussion about clones vs. authentics (a LOT, right? ) but I was wondering specifically how people feel about clones that even clone the "USA" and "Made in the USA" engravings on mods. While I try to buy stuff that's made in the USA by small companies when I can, I'm not that hardcore about it (it's almost impossible to be, and some of my favorite vaping gear comes from By Leo in Greece). Still, it REALLY bothers me when I see things like the satin brass King clone's end cap duplicated exactly, like this:

It's NOT Made in the USA. It's made in China. The original King is made here in my hometown (L.A.).

Same with the Tree of Life clone - it's also made here in L.A. but the end cap on the clone carries the same "USA" engraving.

This isn't really a discussion about whether mods are overpriced or who can afford an authentic and who can't or anything like that. I'm just curious how many people share the feeling I have when I see it, that it's just... not cool. Kind of like when American flags are manufactured in China and everyone's flying them on Independence Day. How do people who buy them feel? When you see the engraving on your mod, do you care?

I'm sure it's all just jibberish to a factory worker in China, but on the sales floor, it's fraud as far as I'm concerned.

Next we'll see "Stainless Steel" engraved on brass.

 

[Funk Dracula]

There's been a lot of discussion about clones vs. authentics (a LOT, right? ) but I was wondering specifically how people feel about clones that even clone the "USA" and "Made in the USA" engravings on mods.

Who cares? It's not like there is a rampant problem with clones being passed off as the real thing.

Generally speaking, if your in the market and searching out the real thing, you know where to go to get that.

If it weren't for fools who buy them, it would never be an issue...

That's an arrogant thing to say.

People who buy clones know exactly what they're getting. People buying authentics know exactly what they're getting.

And what a HUGE issue it is, right?

I go way out of my way to buy everything I can made in the USA. Tools, clothing, shoes, furniture, housewares...

'Murica buddy...

Did they interview you here?

Man Only Buys Products Made Right Here In The USA By Cheap Immigrant Labor | The Onion - America's Finest News Source

 

[Steamix]

There's clones. And there's fakery. If customs anywhere wants to get real uptight about it, they can seize those.
It's one thing makiing a non-descript clone. It's another putting 'Made in ....' when it's not.

So I'm ok with clones. As Funk said, you know what you're getting.

Wouldn't go for fakes, though. Even if the luck of the draw might be in favour of the recipient, it could still get seized with all the ensuing hassle...

 

[bsoplinger]

Im not sure how one could get past the copy of the fundamental design, then get past the copying of logos and identification marks only to then take issue with false claims as to the place of manufacture?

Pretty much have to agree here. If you're OK with them copying the design and all the other markings from the original, why is copying certain text different?

Made me smile the first time I saw a Russian clone with the designed in Russia, made in Germany tag on it. Exactly the same issue.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Xparent Purple Tapatalk 2

 

[stevegmu]

Who cares? It's not like there is a rampant problem with clones being passed off as the real thing.

Generally speaking, if your in the market and searching out the real thing, you know where to go to get that.



That's an arrogant thing to say.

People who buy clones know exactly what they're getting. People buying authentics know exactly what they're getting.

And what a HUGE issue it is, right?



'Murica buddy...

Did they interview you here?

Man Only Buys Products Made Right Here In The USA By Cheap Immigrant Labor | The Onion - America's Finest News Source

Yes, because even poor people should have fancy mech counterfeits....

Some of us care about quality and American jobs...

 

[blueGrassTubb]

Yes, because even poor people should have fancy mech counterfeits....

Some of us care about quality and American jobs...

Then buy quality items made in America and stop caring what others buy. Unless they're using your money what other people buy is really none of your business.

 

[Funk Dracula]

Yes, because even poor people should have fancy mech counterfeits....

Some of us care about quality and American jobs...

 

[stevegmu]

Then buy quality items made in America and stop caring what others buy. Unless they're using your money what other people buy is really none of your business.

I don't care what people buy. Ridiculing people for buying American is a bit sad, but I guess it goes with the entitlement generation and mentality...

 

[Northern-Lights]

I dont mind using clones as I am a poor ... college kid, but I dont like that my patriot clone says made in usa when its not lol.

 

[Coelli]

I dont mind using clones as I am a poor ... college kid, but I dont like that my patriot clone says made in usa when its not lol.

Thanks... that's pretty much what I was asking, thanks for not derailing

 

[Bad Ninja]

Doesn't bother me. I know where it's made.

I don't care what other people think of me.
Is that why you buy things? Based on what others think or might think of you?
I use my own judgement to spend my money on what I want, not what someone tells me to.
Plenty of crappy overpriced products made right here in in the USA, just like everywhere else.
I feel zero urge buy something just "'cause it's made in 'Murcia".

This doesn't only apply to mods.
I don't buy to impress others. I don't feel the need to "make a statement" with my purchases to show my patriotism. I'm 46. I've proven myself a very long time ago.

 

[Coelli]

Doesn't bother me. I know where it's made.

I don't care what other people think of me.
Is that why you buy things? Based on what others think or might think of you?
I use my own judgement to spend my money on what I want, not what someone tells me to.
Plenty of crappy overpriced products made right here in in the USA, just like everywhere else.
I feel zero urge buy something just "'cause it's made in 'Murcia".

This doesn't only apply to mods.
I don't buy to impress others. I don't feel the need to "make a statement" with my purchases to show my patriotism. I'm 46. I've proven myself a very long time ago.

Thanks for answering the question. You seem a little defensive, since you could have just stopped there. Just sayin'.

 

[Robinowitz]

What a thought provoking thread title! There are no correct or incorrect opinions. Only thoughts that often change with the exchange of ideas.
I didn't know that this was even happening. As a small business-owner I strive to carry and personally buy "made in USA." (As I see the correlation between jobs, the economy and my purchase). I've also found that customer service is better here. This is not to say that I'm a "USA is #1!" kind of person, because we have lots to learn from others.
I do find that "made in USA" logo on the clone to be disingenuous at best. Actually dishonest. Leaves a bad taste in my mouth for the product. I suppose I would feel the same way if the product made claims (whether on the device or on the website) that are patently untrue. Yes, sounds like a possible consideration for some regulation.
Thanks for starting this conversation stevegmu

 

[Bad Ninja]

What a thought provoking thread title! There are no correct or incorrect opinions. Only thoughts that often change with the exchange of ideas.
I didn't know that this was even happening. As a small business-owner I strive to carry and personally buy "made in USA." (As I see the correlation between jobs, the economy and my purchase). I've also found that customer service is better here. This is not to say that I'm a "USA is #1!" kind of person, because we have lots to learn from others.
I do find that "made in USA" logo on the clone to be disingenuous at best. Actually dishonest. Leaves a bad taste in my mouth for the product. I suppose I would feel the same way if the product made claims (whether on the device or on the website) that are patently untrue. Yes, sounds like a possible consideration for some regulation.
Thanks for starting this conversation stevegmu

The king mod used a an example in the OP is originally made by Surefire Vapor.
They are known for horrible customer service.

And.... The king is a copy of the Chi-You design with Lion logo and octagon locking rings.
Blatant ripoff. Zero R&D.
Not original at all.
Now again, why shouldn't I buy the $20 clone of the $230 king labled Chi-you clone?

 

[JaRod]

I buy clones sometimes, just not the ones that say "made in the USA" or "Made in Germany" or "made in the Philippines" I just don't like being lied to. The manufacturer who stamps made in XXXX when its made in YYY doesn't give a squat if you are conned and sold the fake as the real thing, its the retailers that out of honesty or fearing a law suit or both that tell you that you are buying a clone, but in many other places outside the developed world fakes are being sold as the real thing just so you know.

 

[Coelli]

I do find that "made in USA" logo on the clone to be disingenuous at best. Actually dishonest. Leaves a bad taste in my mouth for the product. I suppose I would feel the same way if the product made claims (whether on the device or on the website) that are patently untrue. Yes, sounds like a possible consideration for some regulation.

I was curious about the legality so I did a little (very little) digging. These items could be confiscated by customs, and it's probably illegal for them to be resold.

Complying with the Made in USA Standard | BCP Business Center

 

[e-pipeman]

To answer your question directly if it says "Made In The USA" on it and in fact it's made in Switzerland then it's an illegal statement. Ethical? Ethics and jurisprudence are not related, really.

Your question raises lots of other issues, though. China produces lots of clones because we buy them. If we didn't buy them they wouldn't be there. That doesn't mean that it's any more legal for them to do this than it is for someone to sell illegal drugs over the internet. Just because there is a demand doesn't mean that it's ok to supply that demand.

Then again many people will try a clone and like the idea behind it so then buy the original. Many don't.

Sometimes I feel that if original manufacturers were to price more competitively they would sell more and the clone would be squeezed out of the marketplace.

All just imho, of course.